Traffic violation Italy - to pay or not to pay ?

[Speed 3]

A full year ago we went skiing in Italy and hired a car. 7 months later I got a charge from the rental company for an unspecified traffic violation. Today I received a fine notice from the local municipal police. The letter says "not contestable" due video evidence. The road they're quoting I'm pretty sure we never drove on but that's by-the-by. I'm not inclined to pay it, anyone with any experience of not paying Italian fines and the consequences ?

[elise2000]

I wouldn’t bother paying if it’s a rental car, as next time you go back you’ll be in a different car, so unlikely to be a problem.

Or ask for a copy of the evidence at least.

How much is the fine?

[RC1807]

Was the fine sent to you by registered post? If not, how can the Italians prove you received it?

If it was in your own car and you'd be travelling there again, I'd have responded differently.

[Speed 3]

elise2000 said:

I wouldn’t bother paying if it’s a rental car, as next time you go back you’ll be in a different car, so unlikely to be a problem.

Or ask for a copy of the evidence at least.

How much is the fine?

The letter says something like €90 but the police portal is saying €123 due. Not sure if that’s because it’s taken them 11.5 months to send me the notification and its already racking up late fees. Don’t know what the statute of limitations is there but suspect its at least a year.

RC1807 said:

Was the fine sent to you by registered post? If not, how can the Italians prove you received it?

If it was in your own car and you'd be travelling there again, I'd have responded differently.

It was an odd letter envelope with a pink postcard glued to the back which I’m assuming is some sort of return card but I certainly wasn’t required to sign for it by my postie.

Not fussed about the car reg as that will be irrelevant in the future as noted, it was more about whether there was any risk at immigration next time I’m in Italy (post Brexit). Not sure under GDPR if they can link my home address to passport number.

[Harpoon]

Where was the fine?

I apparently went up a permit only road in Perugia in July 2018. Rental company e-mailed in November 2018 to say they were passing on my details to the local police (and charged me 48 euro for pleasure!). Fine finally arrived around July 2019 (recorded post the gits!) but the fine payment website for Perugia wasn't available to use until about November. I could lookup my fine on the website but there was no way to pay it. I emailed them several times but they couldn't be bothered to reply, so I've never paid it...

[Speed 3]

Harpoon said:

Where was the fine?

I apparently went up a permit only road in Perugia in July 2018. Rental company e-mailed in November 2018 to say they were passing on my details to the local police (and charged me 48 euro for pleasure!). Fine finally arrived around July 2019 (recorded post the gits!) but the fine payment website for Perugia wasn't available to use until about November. I could lookup my fine on the website but there was no way to pay it. I emailed them several times but they couldn't be bothered to reply, so I've never paid it...

It was in Sauze D'Oulx, the ski resort. It did say a restricted road but there is only one way into the village to our particular hotel as it is one-way and we definitely did it the way we had done it in previous years (not on the road quoted). We literally arrived, unloaded and didn't use the car until we set off for home. Hopefully ignoring it will have a similar effect to yours.

[omniflow]

There's a letter in the money section of this week's Sunday Times from someone who got a demand for £750 from a UK based debt collector for a traffic violation in Italy that happened about 5 or 6 years ago. Not sure of all the ins and outs as I only skim read it, but I think it's enforceable, so not ignorable.

[The Leaper]

Speed 3 said:

It was in Sauze D'Oulx, the ski resort. It did say a restricted road but there is only one way into the village to our particular hotel as it is one-way and we definitely did it the way we had done it in previous years (not on the road quoted). We literally arrived, unloaded and didn't use the car until we set off for home. Hopefully ignoring it will have a similar effect to yours.

Looks like you may have entered a ZLT and thus be subject to a fine for doing so. Italy has loads of ZTLs, entry to which is restricted to locals who have a permit. If you do not have a permit, obviously you get the fine for the violation. The process is controlled by ANPR cameras.

If your hotel is inside a ZTL they can, in advance of arrival, get you a dispensation and thus any fine is avoided.

R.

[RDMcG]

I always pay foreign fines. Never know if I will be back or have some claim that can affect my credit rating. This is assuming I am guilty. Which I normally am.

[HotJambalaya]

If you decide not to pay it, cancel the credit card you used for the car hire, or they'l just help themselves along with a huge admin fee.

[Speed 3]

Decided to pay it to avoid any credit rating or immigration nausea. Despite it being a year ago I still got an early payment discount so worked out under €100. Suspect we might end up with another from this year taking exactly the same route if its resident permit zoning.

[siman05]

i got one one these last week from Bellagio on lake como - 8 months to come though. I went on the site... it was clearly us and the crap box we hired, in an area we shouldn't have been apparently. I'll make sure not to do the same this year!

[cb31]

The Leaper said:

Looks like you may have entered a ZLT and thus be subject to a fine for doing so. Italy has loads of ZTLs, entry to which is restricted to locals who have a permit. If you do not have a permit, obviously you get the fine for the violation. The process is controlled by ANPR cameras.

If your hotel is inside a ZTL they can, in advance of arrival, get you a dispensation and thus any fine is avoided.

R.

I noticed the last time we were there that some of the ZTL's were very confusing, miniature signs virtually hidden and conflicting information on the internet about the area inside the ZTL and operation times.

We got the hotel to get us a dispensation for Assisi but they never asked the reg no. so doubt they actually bothered in the normal Italian way. Probably get a ticket in a few months

[george123]

I received a letter from Waters & Gate debt collectors back in Nov 2018 asking for payment of a violation committed in Rome in 2016 for entering a restricted zone in a hire car - had no idea I had committed this. Long story short, I took a punt and sent W&G the '3 letter process' I found on the internet and it worked...they wrote back stating they were no longer dealing with my case.

Fast forward to last week, I received a letter from `Lovetts Solictors stating they have now instructed by the City of Rome to collect the fine. I have to pay €362.32 within 7 days or legal action will be taken. Since this is now with a solicitor rather than some dodgy debt collector, what are my options?

[The Leaper]

george123 said:

I received a letter from Waters & Gate debt collectors back in Nov 2018 asking for payment of a violation committed in Rome in 2016 for entering a restricted zone in a hire car - had no idea I had committed this. Long story short, I took a punt and sent W&G the '3 letter process' I found on the internet and it worked...they wrote back stating they were no longer dealing with my case.

Fast forward to last week, I received a letter from `Lovetts Solictors stating they have now instructed by the City of Rome to collect the fine. I have to pay €362.32 within 7 days or legal action will be taken. Since this is now with a solicitor rather than some dodgy debt collector, what are my options?

Given that you seem to agree that you were in the vicinity and may well have committed the offence, looks like you are liable. It's up to you to decide what to do next: ignore, contest, or pay up. I suppose your decision may depend on whether or not you will ever be in Italy again, or the likeleyhood that you will hire a car from the same company you used when in Rome.

Those Italian ZTLs are easy to fall foul of.

R.

[Simpo Two]

Solicitors aren't going to spend much time trying to collect 362 Euros. What 'legal action' will they take?

Ah they're just really more debt collectors: https://lovetts.co.uk/

£1.50 a letter.

Wouldn't the logical route for Rome be to use small claims? Or perhaps they can't...

Will anything change if you can string it out until 1 Jan?

Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 2nd November 17:33

[philcray]

The same thing happened to me, I received an email about a month ago as follows (we were in Italy for 2 weeks in August):

===================================

Dear Customer,

during your rental period you got a fine for for entering in a restricted traffic area (ZTL) without authorization, that you could find in attachment.
Zona a traffico limitato (ZTL) is the area with restricted traffic acccess controlled with surveillance cameras.
Please find enclosed to this e-mail also the invoice related to the Fine Administration Fee for transferring the traffic fine under your name, as reported in out terms and conditions point 6.1 letter J, in attachment.
From the day you receive the fine at your home address, which will happen in up to 360 days, you will have time to complain to the police and pay less, according to traffic law, directly to Italian Authorities.
For paying or complaining follow the instructions on the fine paper.

Best regards,
Autovia srl

============================================================================================

This states that we will receive a letter about the fine in the next 360 days and we will then be able to "complain and pay less", I am fairly sure they have us bang to rights although I have no idea where the ZTL was we strayed into. To add insult to injury, the hire company charged €60 for the privilege of passing on my details and sending an email.

[Speed 3]

Speed 3 said:

Decided to pay it to avoid any credit rating or immigration nausea. Despite it being a year ago I still got an early payment discount so worked out under €100. Suspect we might end up with another from this year taking exactly the same route if its resident permit zoning.

As expected we did pick up exactly the same fine this year although it only took 6 months not 12.

[so called]

I received a fine via a rental company for not paying on a Florida Toll road - no cash.
Paid it as soon as the fine came through as I was in and out of the US every month and didn't want to give myself problems.

Passing through Schiffol Airport a few years back, I was pulled aside at immigration for a traffic offence involving a Dutch rental.
It wasn't me and after some thorough checks, they let me on my way with an apology.
Benefits of having Jones as a surname.

Had a few flashing cameras in France and Germany but never had any communications.

Edited by so called on Monday 9th November 15:37