vDSL faceplate..?

[Funk]

Talking to Plusnet about speed and banding issues earlier it occurred to me that the microfilter built into my socket may well be worn out. In the old days this was a pigtail but now will involve replacing the interstitial plate on the master socket.

As far as I can see once the main faceplate is unscrewed, the upper part which my router's plugged into separates from the lower part (where the phone socket's orange and white wiring is connected):







Two things - is the microfilter in the part where the vDSL connection is or where the phone connects? As I don't even have a phone plugged in, does the microfilter matter and would it have any bearing on the sync speed? If not, does anything even need changing?

My interstitial plate is not marked Mk2 or Mk3 but replacements seem to be - are they interchangeable and would it be a Mk3 I need? They look identical:





Basically does any of this need replacing and if so, can anyone point me in the direction of what I actually need? Obviously I don't want to dick about with wires but am happy if it's an 'unscrew-swap-screw in' situation.

I'd appreciate any guidance!

Edited by Funk on Wednesday 1st July 18:55

[Blockbuster]

The filter is in the phone part. Technically you don’t need one if you’re not using the landline, however your RJ11 cable isn’t going to fit without it.

Yes the MK3 is a direct replacement for it. They don’t often go faulty but it’s not beyond the realms of possiblity and worth trying for the sake of a few quid.

No messing about with wires involved. The faceplate first between the actual socket and the front plate (the bit where the extension wires are connected). It’s a 2 minute job to swap.

[Chozza]

If you still have one of the old style microfilters - plug it into the master socket test port.
If it fixes the issue then the faceplate has a problem ( and telling the provider that you have done this , will stop them saying its your wiring and the whole charge for a visit

[Mr Pointy]

The filter's built into the loose bit - that's were the RJ11 connector that goes off to your router plugs in.

The Orange/White pair should be running off to another phone point. The incoming line should be made off on to the fixed part.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UxkSUaMVM8

[Funk]

Blockbuster said:

The filter is in the phone part. Technically you don’t need one if you’re not using the landline, however your RJ11 cable isn’t going to fit without it.

Yes the MK3 is a direct replacement for it. They don’t often go faulty but it’s not beyond the realms of possiblity and worth trying for the sake of a few quid.

No messing about with wires involved. The faceplate first between the actual socket and the front plate (the bit where the extension wires are connected). It’s a 2 minute job to swap.

Sorry for being dim, just trying to understand - so the microfilter is in the middle part of the unit (which the lower front plate with the phone socket connects into) - ie the parts above marked Mk2/3?

But ultimately if I don't have a phone plugged in, the microfilter part of it (whether fine or borked) isn't going to have any effect anyway? If there's no chance it's causing a problem I'll leave the whole lot be.

Just trying to eke out the max speed from my line as the Plusnet guy said the line should do 67mbit, the router my end shows a max rate of 62mbit but the actual current rate (being band-limited, which he's getting removed/reset) is 42mbit. Essentially there's 20mbit+ hiding there somewhere.

I need to wait for the banding to be removed but am just trying eliminate any other potential bottlenecks. Thanks for the info and help so far.

Mr Pointy said:

The filter's built into the loose bit - that's were the RJ11 connector that goes off to your router plugs in.

The Orange/White pair should be running off to another phone point. The incoming line should be made off on to the fixed part.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UxkSUaMVM8

You've reminded me - the socket in the living room isn't the master. For some reason that's in the bedroom, no idea why. However, that has been bypassed as it was causing a massive drop in speed in the days when I had ADSL. Even though the socket's bypassed, I guess it could still be having an effect on the connection. Without getting the master socket moved, there's not much I can do about that though.

Edited by Funk on Wednesday 1st July 19:20

[Blockbuster]

Funk said:

Sorry for being dim, just trying to understand - so the microfilter is in the middle part of the unit (which the lower front plate with the phone socket connects into) - ie the parts above marked Mk2/3?

Correct

Funk said:

But ultimately if I don't have a phone plugged in, the microfilter part of it (whether fine or borked) isn't going to have any effect anyway? If there's no chance it's causing a problem I'll leave the whole lot be.

Whilst it may not one strictly required, I would say that since you have one then IF (big IF) it is faulty then it probably will cause you problems.

Just trying to eke out the max speed from my line as the Plusnet guy said the line should do 67mbit, the router my end shows a max rate of 62mbit but the actual current rate (being band-limited, which he's getting removed/reset) is 42mbit. Essentially there's 20mbit+ hiding there somewhere.

I need to wait for the banding to be removed but am just trying eliminate any other potential bottlenecks. Thanks for the info and help so far.

Funk said:

You've reminded me - the socket in the living room isn't the master. For some reason that's in the bedroom, no idea why. However, that has been bypassed as it was causing a massive drop in speed in the days when I had ADSL. Even though the socket's bypassed, I guess it could still be having an effect on the connection. Without getting the master socket moved, there's not much I can do about that though.

So this one pictured is not the master? If I had to guess, I would say that what has been done is the incoming wires at the back of the bedroom socket have been crimped to the blue/white pair which feed the back of the pictured socket. The orange/white pair of the same cable is then being used to feed the circuit back to the bedroom socket. So technically the pictured socket is the master (ie the first on the circuit) and the bedroom one is an extension.

[Funk]

Blockbuster said:

Funk said:

Sorry for being dim, just trying to understand - so the microfilter is in the middle part of the unit (which the lower front plate with the phone socket connects into) - ie the parts above marked Mk2/3?

Correct

Funk said:

But ultimately if I don't have a phone plugged in, the microfilter part of it (whether fine or borked) isn't going to have any effect anyway? If there's no chance it's causing a problem I'll leave the whole lot be.

Whilst it may not one strictly required, I would say that since you have one then IF (big IF) it is faulty then it probably will cause you problems.

Funk said:

Just trying to eke out the max speed from my line as the Plusnet guy said the line should do 67mbit, the router my end shows a max rate of 62mbit but the actual current rate (being band-limited, which he's getting removed/reset) is 42mbit. Essentially there's 20mbit+ hiding there somewhere.

I need to wait for the banding to be removed but am just trying eliminate any other potential bottlenecks. Thanks for the info and help so far.

You've reminded me - the socket in the living room isn't the master. For some reason that's in the bedroom, no idea why. However, that has been bypassed as it was causing a massive drop in speed in the days when I had ADSL. Even though the socket's bypassed, I guess it could still be having an effect on the connection. Without getting the master socket moved, there's not much I can do about that though.

So this one pictured is not the master? If I had to guess, I would say that what has been done is the incoming wires at the back of the bedroom socket have been crimped to the blue/white pair which feed the back of the pictured socket. The orange/white pair of the same cable is then being used to feed the circuit back to the bedroom socket. So technically the pictured socket is the master (ie the first on the circuit) and the bedroom one is an extension.

I don't know what the guy did - I was under the impression he simply bypassed the bedroom socket completely. It's also possibly complicated by the fact that there's a second line into the socket next to the one I'm using; a defunct relic from a previous job long ago...

Edited by Funk on Wednesday 1st July 22:08

[Mr Pointy]

Funk said:

I don't know what the guy did - I was under the impression he simply bypassed the bedroom socket completely. It's also possibly complicated by the fact that there's a second line into the socket next to the one I'm using; a defunct relic from a previous job long ago...

I suggest you need to establish how the two sockets are actually wired before you change anything else. You need a master as the first point of termination & it can then be extended on to the socket you are using now. Take the faceplates off the master & the extension & take some pictures of how the connections are made.

[droopsnoot]

It's been a while since I had any involvement in this stuff, but back then we were always told that if you had more than one socket, you must have a filter on all sockets, whether used or not. I should add that was all trailing filters.

[Funk]

Mr Pointy said:

Funk said:

I don't know what the guy did - I was under the impression he simply bypassed the bedroom socket completely. It's also possibly complicated by the fact that there's a second line into the socket next to the one I'm using; a defunct relic from a previous job long ago...

I suggest you need to establish how the two sockets are actually wired before you change anything else. You need a master as the first point of termination & it can then be extended on to the socket you are using now. Take the faceplates off the master & the extension & take some pictures of how the connections are made.

Thanks, I think that's essentially what the guy did. The socket in the bedroom is bypassed completely and in fact there's a socket behind the sofa which was also bypassed, effectively moving the master socket over to where my desk is.

I'll be honest I'd forgotten it was all this messy and I know nothing about this stuff. Perhaps I'll see if the banding removal opens up some more speed and just make do until I can get FTTP... I think the law of diminishing returns will apply the more I start to dig into it all.

Thanks for all the input though, the depth of knowledge on PH is remarkable!

[itsnotarace]

The master socket is where the BT line comes into your house. It will not be any extension socket and will most likely be by your front door

[Funk]

itsnotarace said:

The master socket is where the BT line comes into your house. It will not be any extension socket and will most likely be by your front door

I'm in a flat and the master socket was in the bedroom; the engineer that came to upgrade the broadband to fibre said that's where it was. As that was massively inconvenient and never used, he bypassed it. If I've understood correctly that effectively 'moved' the master socket into the living room as that became the new 'first' socket in the connection chain. It may well not be technically a 'master' socket but it's the only one in the flat that's connected.

Edit: there are only two sockets in the flat - the one in the bedroom and the one in the living room.

Edited by Funk on Thursday 2nd July 10:44

[Mr Pointy]

Funk said:

Thanks, I think that's essentially what the guy did. The socket in the bedroom is bypassed completely and in fact there's a socket behind the sofa which was also bypassed, effectively moving the master socket over to where my desk is.

I'll be honest I'd forgotten it was all this messy and I know nothing about this stuff. Perhaps I'll see if the banding removal opens up some more speed and just make do until I can get FTTP...

Well you might want to check & clean up the connections because you shouldn't have the orange/white pair attached
to the front plate if it isn't going anywhere - presuming the blue /white is attached to the rear plate as the incoming line.

This site has some useful information including how it should be wired as the master should be the first point of connection. If you look at the last picture it shows how to wire filtered ADSL/VDSL from the AB terminals on the new type of master to an extension, which is how you should really have it.
http://www.davefrydoes.co.uk/install-an-new-style-...

Check how the bypassing has been done. I'd use small IDC connection blocks like these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BT-78A-4-Pair-IDC-Telep...

You can hide them inside the existing box.

[Funk]

Thanks Mr. Pointy.

I'm starting to think 'just leave it, it's working..' for the time being. It was a BT Openreach guy that fitted it all so I have to trust that he's not done anything daft wiring-wise. I think fking with it might be a recipe for more issues than it solves.

[buggalugs]

I would get the newest BT faceplate you can and install it on the wire as soon as it enters the house, I.e. make the wire as short as possible. Leave any extensions you don’t need physically disconnected from the line at the master socket.