Size of f1 cars

[vulture1]

Would it be a huge problem for new regs to make the cars a bit smaller? Make them 90% of the size surely would improve the racing with more space on the track and to overtake?

[andycaca]

they went from 1.8m to 2m wide only a few years ago.

[Rumblestripe]

I've often thought, in a sort of idle stream of consciousness kind of way, that a narrower car would have several advantages. So a max width over tyres of say 1.5 m and perhaps 1.7 m over bodywork?

1. Less downforce and therefore less grip and consequently reduced cornering speeds
2. Effectively makes the track wider
3. Less drag from reduced frontal cross-section so quicker in a straight line?
4. Easier to overtake?

Probably nonsense. But I'd love someone who knows about this stuff to tell me why I'm wrong

[CedricN]

andycaca said:

they went from 1.8m to 2m wide only a few years ago.

That was mega stupid, especially in combination with the wide complex front wings that came along. Should have went the other way, with narrower and more robust front wings. The race is now over for the involved drivers after the tinyest of touches, with carbon parts flying all over the place.

[HustleRussell]

Don’t forget they’d also be lighter and more nimble with better all round visibility

[thegreenhell]

They're also surprisingly long. At c.5.7m, they're half a metre longer than a long wheelbase Mercedes S-class.

[coppice]

And they weigh 40 % more than an 80s F1 turbo car - and , shockingly , not much less than a 1937 Mercedes W125 .

[patmahe]

The modern cars are hideously big.

[toastyhamster]

Some of the increase up to the Petronas Merc is moving the drivers feet behind the front suspension points and the MGUK systems taking up more space (I assume the latter?), but what the heck happened between the Merc and the Renault, who thought that was a good idea?

Went to my only F1 GP at Silverstone when Schuey was in a Ferrari and Coulthard had a first lap accident in a Mac, remember being surprised at the size of the dummy cars in various displays, felt the same seeing a Vettel era RedBull hung up in reception in their MK HQ many years later.

[coppice]

Not all Formula One cars are big . This is Jim Clark's Lotus 25 - 1.5 Coventry Climax V8 and a svelte 450 kilos

[kambites]

It's interesting that even after the recent increase in width, they're still narrower than the 80s cars.

[Dr Jekyll]

All the extra length seems to be in front of the driver, why is this?

[kambites]

Dr Jekyll said:

All the extra length seems to be in front of the driver, why is this?

Safety.

The safety cell has been pulled back so the driver's feet are entirely behind the front axle line so any impact to the front wheels of the car can rip off the whole front, including the steering rack, without exposing the driver's feet.

It also makes space for a much larger crumple zone in front of the steering rack to deal with head on impacts.

[CanAm]

Rumblestripe said:

I've often thought, in a sort of idle stream of consciousness kind of way, that a narrower car would have several advantages. So a max width over tyres of say 1.5 m and perhaps 1.7 m over bodywork?

Or the other way round?

[Sandpit Steve]

Dr Jekyll said:

All the extra length seems to be in front of the driver, why is this?

Because the front crash structure used to be the driver’s ankles!

Even the recent width increase has allowed for more substantial side impact protection. It’s all safety-driven, but we do see fewer injuries even as the cars get faster.

I think it was 2018 that the same 20 drivers took the start for every race, which had never happened before. LH has never missed a race in 14 years!

[CanAm]

Dr Jekyll said:

All the extra length seems to be in front of the driver, why is this?

Not compared to the compact cars of the 60s and early 70s, as in the Lotus 25 above. The Mercedes wheelbase is over 4 feet (122cm for our younger readers) longer than the typical DFV powered car of 1969. Some of that will be due to the fuel cell being between the driver and engine. In the 60s the driver sat surrounded by fuel tanks either side of him, and sometimes even over his knees.
I'm sure the drivers prefer the newer design.

[TheDeuce]

Sandpit Steve said:

Because the front crash structure used to be the driver’s ankles!

Even the recent width increase has allowed for more substantial side impact protection. It’s all safety-driven, but we do see fewer injuries even as the cars get faster.

I think it was 2018 that the same 20 drivers took the start for every race, which had never happened before. LH has never missed a race in 14 years!

Same as road cars, safety and tech requires the cars to become larger.

I don't mind the larger cars except at Monaco, where they're frankly ridiculous looking going through the hairpin!

[CanAm]

TheDeuce said:

Same as road cars, safety and tech requires the cars to become larger.

I don't mind the larger cars except at Monaco, where they're frankly ridiculous looking going through the hairpin!

One of the mags printed lap and corner tines in their F1 season preview last year. Some of the lap times were actually quicker many years ago and the Monaco (Station) hairpin was pathetically slow in the current cars.

Bearing in mind the number of "racing incidents" resulting in front wing damage, I'd like to see them reduced in length and, more importantly, width, eg no wider than the inside edge of the front wheels.

[markcoznottz]

kambites said:

It's interesting that even after the recent increase in width, they're still narrower than the 80s cars.

They narrowed the cars for ‘98. Started the trend of making the cars ugly for no good reason, something I think matters more than people think. Was looking at a Williams fw06 and a Ferrari 640 last summer, just stunning, even years later.

[Teddy Lop]

CanAm said:

One of the mags printed lap and corner tines in their F1 season preview last year. Some of the lap times were actually quicker many years ago and the Monaco (Station) hairpin was pathetically slow in the current cars.

Bearing in mind the number of "racing incidents" resulting in front wing damage, I'd like to see them reduced in length and, more importantly, width, eg no wider than the inside edge of the front wheels.

I think the requirement for front wings to be hyper-stiff (flexi-wing tests) doesn't help this, I think a more forgiving bendy wing, (or end-of-wing segment say 10%), would allow drivers to get closer without fearing losing it or puncturing the opponents tyre and ruining their race.

I'm not saying I want BTCC but there's something in between.