RE: Mercedes-Benz 190E 2.3-16 | The Brave Pill
RE: Mercedes-Benz 190E 2.3-16 | The Brave Pill
Saturday 3rd October 2020

Mercedes-Benz 190E 2.3-16 | The Brave Pill

Who wants to boldly go where Clarkson once did?



Brave Pill was created around the mission of venturing the the most far-flung and daring parts of the automotive world - or, at least, the PH Classifieds - in search of high-risk adventure. Like Indiana Jones, only with expensive, elderly cars. But this week's selection is closer to home, and one that requires tweaking the corporate pronoun from "we" to "me" earlier than usual. Because when it comes to 16-valve versions of the Mercedes 190E I've been there, done that and bought a series of really expensive T-shirts.

You can read about the recent adventures of my own 2.5-16 in the PH Fleet stories that cover its recommissioning after a long lay-up, subsequent mechanical meltdown and eventual return to order. (There are more updates approaching, too.) My personal odyssey started with a decent (but neglected) car, took two years and cost more than seven grand. Here's an earlier 2.3-16 which needs a fair bit more done to it. From the modest height of my expertise I can tell any doubters that getting it into fettle is going to require considerable amounts of time, expertise and - most of all - cash.

The 190E 16V was one of those cars that qualified as a spectacularly successful failure. It was originally created to go rallying, with the idea being to use a Cosworth-developed 16-valve cylinder head to give some serious pep to the regular M102 2.0-litre engine of the Baby Benz, raising output from 136hp to 185hp. The arrival of the dominant AWD Audi Quattro and then Group B regs did for that plan, but not before work on a road-going version was too advanced to be stopped.


The 2.3-16 made its debut when Mercedes built 20 identical cars for a one-off race to celebrate the opening of the new Nurburgring GP Circuit in 1985. It was almost certainly the most distinguished grid of all time, one that featured no fewer than nine existing Formula 1 world champions and two future ones - with Ayton Senna emerging victorious. Racing was clearly the future, with Mercedes developing the car for the then-new DTM Championship, where its long-running battle with the E30 BMW M3 and Sierra RS would eventually spawn both the brawnier 2.5-litre engine in 1988 and then the more extreme Evo and Evo 2 homologation versions.

Motorsport glory - and the 16V's good looks - propelled it to considerable sales success. Mercedes sold 19,400 of the 2.3-16 globally, followed by 5750 of the 'regular' 2.5-litre version. And that's despite a price tag that put it well above the obvious alternatives. In 1986 an unoptioned 2.3-16 was £21,940 in the UK at the same time an E30 BMW 325i Sport was £14,095 and the newly launched Ford Sierra RS was £15,950.

But by the late 1990s the 16-valvers had already acquired a reputation for being markedly less reliable than the almost unburstable standard 190E, and values had reached a low plateau they sat on for more than a decade. It's not long since cars as shabby as our Pill would most likely have been broken up. After buying mine in 2012 I soon realised it was easier to find less common components from people scrapping cars than official channels. I bought a set of wheels and a throttle body from a bloke who had two 'parts cars' outside his house, both serving as donors to keep an equally scruffy running example alive. Rare bits can be both ferociously expensive and hard to track down and a surprising amount of stuff is different from the regular 190E.

Our Pill's valuation is based in part on its interesting backstory, with the vendor saying it was an original UK press demonstrator. That was doubtless a hard life - 1980s road testers didn't spare the whip when it came to gathering performance numbers - but after the rat-pack had finished beating on it it was passed onto a youthful Jeremy Clarkson who ran it as a long-termer for six months. That explains why almost every available options box was ticked when it was first ordered, including the stylish houndstooth trim, heated seats, power sunroof and four electric windows. The presence of a recirculation switch on the dashboard also suggests the very rare option of factory aircon.


It needs plenty of work, with the seller being honest about the scale of the challenge that the next owner faces. The gold-ish smoke silver paint has faded, and although it doesn't look too bad from most angles the advert admits it probably requires a full respray. It is also suffering from some rust - the vendor reporting a rust patch at the bottom of the rear screen and more on the slam panel and offside rear wheelarch. The MOT history adds a few more areas for careful consideration with multiple corrosion advisories back in 2016 when the car was put through its first test since 2006. From personal experience I can say that even a smart-looking 190E can be hiding expensive quantities of grot. And this is not a smart-looking 190E.

The official record also suggests that what was intended to be a recommissioning four years ago never went anywhere; the car didn't get another MOT test until this year. It failed in May with some of the familiar afflictions of the long-neglected: weepy, non-operative power steering, insufficient brakes and a cracked windscreen. Other issues revealed by the pictures include scuffed, worn and damaged trim, peeling leather on steering wheel and gear shifter, corroded alloys and a hole in the rear wing where what would almost certainly have been an expensive Hirschmann electric aerial once went. It's also missing the '2.3-16' badge from the right side of the boot lid. The vast, ugly wing indicator repeaters are non-standard too.

But to look on the bright side, our Pill doesn't seem to be hiding anything. As 16 Valve values have risen so some unscrupulous sellers have realised that polish costs less than expensive remedial work, there are lots of cars out there that look considerably better above the waterline than they do below it. The price of our Pill seems a little keen for anyone who isn't drawn by the tangential Clarkson connection, you could easily spend the difference between it and a really good one on a comprehensive restoration. Yet as even the brawniest Mercs head towards a downsized future - the new '63' engine is set to be four-cylinder - so interest in the hottest 'Baby Benz' may well rise further. I've got my fingers crossed on that one.


See the original advert here




 


Author
Discussion

Gareth9702

Original Poster:

393 posts

153 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
You need to see something very special in old Mercedes to make that worthwhile. Certainly requires bravery but to most observers there will be nothing to be seen except an old car.

FlukePlay

1,130 posts

166 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Although I liked these back in the day, no amount of 'man maths' would make me purchase this example. It was 1988 and I found myself selling fax machines from an office in Covent Garden, where another young lad (at 17) from a less desirable part of Essex, had one brand new. The proceeds from crime perhaps?

Gus265

271 posts

154 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
That is a tired looking car needing what looks like an engine out refresh/rebuild/respray and a lot if interior work - so possibly ruinous unless you can do it yourself. So I can’t tell if it’s overpriced or not. The fact it’s the UK press car and JC’s for 6 months helps but not sure persuasive enough to me.

But if you can take it on, a very worthwhile project.

Jte3397

46 posts

117 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
I had one of these in smoke silver that I sold in auction for about 1/10 of this. They do rot everywhere. The 2.3 16 is faster than the 2.5 16, not that that is fast these days. Brave is right - worn rear suspension arms cost me £1400 not including the large lower ones which were a further £1000, fuel pump relay £180 and a hours fitting due to its odd location. Absolutely loved it though and when I replaced it with a Civic Type R I initially wondered what I'd done...

SidewaysSi

10,742 posts

255 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
£13k for a pile of silver poo? Pull the other one...

ducnick

2,112 posts

264 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
that's big money for what is essentially scrap metal. Some parts will fetch money to keep other examples on the road, but this one looks like a lost cause to me.

irocfan

45,824 posts

211 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Brave pill? Not a chance, you'd need to be certifiable

tobinen

10,156 posts

166 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
It seems very overpriced to me

Augustus Windsock

3,693 posts

176 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
The provenance is about THE Inly thing going for the car, from description only, and without giving it a thorough going-over I’d have thought that this was just fit for being a parts car...

W201_190e

12,738 posts

234 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
They rot everywhere that a normal 190e doesn't and parts are ludicrously expensive. I'd have a boggo 2.6 every day of the week.

A1VDY

3,575 posts

148 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Overpriced scrapper/ parts car or extensive restoration but a better looking proposition If it had a proper clean ie full seats out wet vac, engine steam clean and paint mop/polish. Its only cosmetic but would help to sell it.
A mate has just bought a 2.5 16 from Romania. It's being restored out there to keep costs down. It's being completely stripped Inc interior, engine/gearbox, windows out respray ect, apparently its completely rot free.

Edited by A1VDY on Saturday 3rd October 09:15

Motorsport3

558 posts

213 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
About £1000 sounds more like it and assuming the buyer can do most work himself.

waynecyclist

13,114 posts

135 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Way overpriced but needs saving

Getting rare now

s m

24,076 posts

224 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Jte3397 said:
I had one of these in smoke silver that I sold in auction for about 1/10 of this. They do rot everywhere. The 2.3 16 is faster than the 2.5 16, not that that is fast these days.
Like most 80s stuff they can be fairly ripe by now unless they’ve been looked after

Disagree with the 2.5-16 being the slower of the 2 though

cfc1892

13 posts

181 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Could be a right can of worms this once you get past the obvious work that needs doing. Would be lovely to see it back to former glories though as cracking looking thing and shame if it just kept deteriorating to the stage of being a scrapper

birdcage

2,888 posts

226 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Junk. In its current state

biggbn

29,293 posts

241 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
Never got the Cosworth mercs, the high revving engine seemed at odds with the gravitas of the packaging. A clean 2.6 for me please. Had they went the usual merc route and dropped a big, simple, powerful engine into the shell, that would have been heaven! Imagine a 500e but as a 190...?

Jte3397

46 posts

117 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
s m said:
Like most 80s stuff they can be fairly ripe by now unless they’ve been looked after

Disagree with the 2.5-16 being the slower of the 2 though
I got that from the garage that looked after mine and quite a few others, including one with a Mosselman turbo conversion. He always reckoned the 2.3, which was a Cosworth built head, revved better than the later Mercedes inhouse 2.5 and felt quicker. Probably just perception or maybe that a large number of 2.5 were autos. Admit the numbers from the time tell a different story.

richinlondon

789 posts

143 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
I like the car, but it feels about £8k too much.

Eazy71

162 posts

77 months

Saturday 3rd October 2020
quotequote all
I love these. My fantasy garage has a “touring car” section - one of these (ideally 2.5-16) lined up alongside an e30 M3 and a Sierra RS500 Cosworth...one day!

This one is unfortunately on life support and needs major surgery to bring it back...it’s about 10k too expensive. You can get one in decent nick for about for about 20k - so 13k for a dog is a tad unrealistic.