CV19 - Cure Worse Than The Disease? (Vol 19)
Discussion
Elysium said:
You are entitled to your opinion of course and I think there are many things we agree on.
Unfortunately, when you say there is no evidence that COVID exists or that vaccines do not have any effect I am forced to disagree with you. Not because I have picked a side, but because I can plainly see that there is evidence.
I would agree that, at this point a discussion about the benefits achieved by the vaccine programme does not really matter. It happened and the people who wanted the vaccine took it.
It matters more to me that we find ways to make sure the evils of lockdown, vaccine passports and mandates are never allowed to happen again.
Oh there’s evidence that Covid exists, you only have to listen to BBC News, but if you actually look, there really wasn’t anything. I’ve said time and time again, if none of us looked at any media we’d not have noticed anything. I didn’t see anyone be ill in 2020, until the testing and hysteria was ramped up. Perhaps you had a different story to tell, and you saw friends and family bed ridden or dead in 2020 and so got a different perspective. I don’t have an issue with that, just let us deal with the situation ourselves, don’t blanket everyone. Unfortunately, when you say there is no evidence that COVID exists or that vaccines do not have any effect I am forced to disagree with you. Not because I have picked a side, but because I can plainly see that there is evidence.
I would agree that, at this point a discussion about the benefits achieved by the vaccine programme does not really matter. It happened and the people who wanted the vaccine took it.
It matters more to me that we find ways to make sure the evils of lockdown, vaccine passports and mandates are never allowed to happen again.
Agree strongly with your last point, but unfortunately giving credence to the fact there was a pandemic just means justification for the next one is baked in. So you’re on to a loser unfortunately
BigMon said:
jameswills said:
The “other thread” shouldn’t exist, it serves no purpose at all for PH, I’ve seen threads with valued content shut down, but that still continues. That sounds alarm bells. Coupled with anyone that crosses over to here only throws a few jibes and rolling smilies about shows what it’s true intention is. To stifle debate.
Discussion and argument is extremely important, it is non existent now on any major platform or media outlet, so I’d fight to protect forum discussion. It’s why I don’t engage with anyone that calls people deniers and loons normally. They aren’t trying to further discussion or get to any truth. They are just trying to shut down a narrative they don’t align to.
That happens here too as well. If you read back you will notice that, several times, people have been accused of being members of 'the other thread' or have been told to go back to 'the other thread'. Presumably, as you correctly say, with the notion of creating an echo chamber where anyone questioning the thread narrative will be burnt at the stake as a heretic.Discussion and argument is extremely important, it is non existent now on any major platform or media outlet, so I’d fight to protect forum discussion. It’s why I don’t engage with anyone that calls people deniers and loons normally. They aren’t trying to further discussion or get to any truth. They are just trying to shut down a narrative they don’t align to.
jameswills said:
BigMon said:
jameswills said:
The “other thread” shouldn’t exist, it serves no purpose at all for PH, I’ve seen threads with valued content shut down, but that still continues. That sounds alarm bells. Coupled with anyone that crosses over to here only throws a few jibes and rolling smilies about shows what it’s true intention is. To stifle debate.
Discussion and argument is extremely important, it is non existent now on any major platform or media outlet, so I’d fight to protect forum discussion. It’s why I don’t engage with anyone that calls people deniers and loons normally. They aren’t trying to further discussion or get to any truth. They are just trying to shut down a narrative they don’t align to.
That happens here too as well. If you read back you will notice that, several times, people have been accused of being members of 'the other thread' or have been told to go back to 'the other thread'. Presumably, as you correctly say, with the notion of creating an echo chamber where anyone questioning the thread narrative will be burnt at the stake as a heretic.Discussion and argument is extremely important, it is non existent now on any major platform or media outlet, so I’d fight to protect forum discussion. It’s why I don’t engage with anyone that calls people deniers and loons normally. They aren’t trying to further discussion or get to any truth. They are just trying to shut down a narrative they don’t align to.
I might not agree with some of what is posted on here, but it makes for a much more interesting thread if there is reasoned debate with argument and counter-argument and that sort of thing can change opinion one way or the other.
For example, you were going to post up why your world view had changed and what had caused it to change. I would honestly be very interested in reading that and I wouldn't be denigrating you if you did.
BigMon said:
I don't think I've ever posted on the other thread, despite being accused several times of doing so. If I have, I have never gone on and denigrated anyone.
I might not agree with some of what is posted on here, but it makes for a much more interesting thread if there is reasoned debate with argument and counter-argument and that sort of thing can change opinion one way or the other.
For example, you were going to post up why your world view had changed and what had caused it to change. I would honestly be very interested in reading that and I wouldn't be denigrating you if you did.
Agreeing with people is often nice, but it doesn’t really have any benefit. It’s good to argue and discuss, but it has to be allowed to happen. We don’t get that enough now.I might not agree with some of what is posted on here, but it makes for a much more interesting thread if there is reasoned debate with argument and counter-argument and that sort of thing can change opinion one way or the other.
For example, you were going to post up why your world view had changed and what had caused it to change. I would honestly be very interested in reading that and I wouldn't be denigrating you if you did.
Sadly haven’t had the time to do that, I would really like to do it for my own benefit. Been thinking about it a lot, and I realise there’s a lot of gaps! Can I even trust my own memory?
Good video from JC on the vaxx damage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boqKzpftNSI
I'll say it again, give it a couple more years and the vaxx damage deniers (just like the mask deniers and the heart attack/myo/peri deniers) will be openly talking about their vaxx damage and that of friends and family like it was well-known and never in doubt. I've noticed a shift in the narrative from several of the pot-stirrers from the other thread where 6 months ago they were firmly in the "unthinkable" camp but are in the process of moving through the "radical" camp to the "accepting" camp as more and more anecdotal evidence comes under the spotlight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boqKzpftNSI
I'll say it again, give it a couple more years and the vaxx damage deniers (just like the mask deniers and the heart attack/myo/peri deniers) will be openly talking about their vaxx damage and that of friends and family like it was well-known and never in doubt. I've noticed a shift in the narrative from several of the pot-stirrers from the other thread where 6 months ago they were firmly in the "unthinkable" camp but are in the process of moving through the "radical" camp to the "accepting" camp as more and more anecdotal evidence comes under the spotlight.
A chat through of the current situation regarding blood transfusions and mRNA products, with reference to a scientific paper awaiting peer review:
https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202403.0881/v...
Concerns regarding Transfusions of Blood Products Derived from Genetic Vaccine Recipients and Proposals for Specific Measures
https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202403.0881/v...
Concerns regarding Transfusions of Blood Products Derived from Genetic Vaccine Recipients and Proposals for Specific Measures
Paper said:
Abstract
The coronavirus pandemic was declared by the World Health Organization (WHO) in 2020, and a global genetic vaccination program has been rapidly implemented as a fundamental solution. However, many countries around the world have reported that so-called genetic vaccines, such as those using modified mRNA encoding the spike protein and lipid nanoparticles as the drug delivery system, have resulted in post-vaccination thrombosis and subsequent cardiovascular damage, as well as a wide variety of diseases involving all organs and systems, including the nervous system. In this article, based on these circumstances and the volume of evidence that has recently come to light, we call the attention of medical professionals to the various risks associated with blood transfusions using blood products derived from people who have suffered from long COVID and from genetic vaccine recipients, including those who have received mRNA vaccines, and we make proposals regarding specific tests, testing methods, and regulations to deal with these risks. We expect that this proposal will serve as a basis for discussion on how to address post-vaccination syndrome and its consequences following these genetic vaccination programs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPJfXh-Kx2cThe coronavirus pandemic was declared by the World Health Organization (WHO) in 2020, and a global genetic vaccination program has been rapidly implemented as a fundamental solution. However, many countries around the world have reported that so-called genetic vaccines, such as those using modified mRNA encoding the spike protein and lipid nanoparticles as the drug delivery system, have resulted in post-vaccination thrombosis and subsequent cardiovascular damage, as well as a wide variety of diseases involving all organs and systems, including the nervous system. In this article, based on these circumstances and the volume of evidence that has recently come to light, we call the attention of medical professionals to the various risks associated with blood transfusions using blood products derived from people who have suffered from long COVID and from genetic vaccine recipients, including those who have received mRNA vaccines, and we make proposals regarding specific tests, testing methods, and regulations to deal with these risks. We expect that this proposal will serve as a basis for discussion on how to address post-vaccination syndrome and its consequences following these genetic vaccination programs.
O/T
Jimmy Dore discusses a video seemingly showing a WEF Young Global Leaders training session.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuayF752dMM
Jimmy Dore discusses a video seemingly showing a WEF Young Global Leaders training session.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuayF752dMM
r3g said:
Good video from JC on the vaxx damage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boqKzpftNSI
I'll say it again, give it a couple more years and the vaxx damage deniers (just like the mask deniers and the heart attack/myo/peri deniers) will be openly talking about their vaxx damage and that of friends and family like it was well-known and never in doubt. I've noticed a shift in the narrative from several of the pot-stirrers from the other thread where 6 months ago they were firmly in the "unthinkable" camp but are in the process of moving through the "radical" camp to the "accepting" camp as more and more anecdotal evidence comes under the spotlight.
Sounds like a fulfilling way to spend one's time.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boqKzpftNSI
I'll say it again, give it a couple more years and the vaxx damage deniers (just like the mask deniers and the heart attack/myo/peri deniers) will be openly talking about their vaxx damage and that of friends and family like it was well-known and never in doubt. I've noticed a shift in the narrative from several of the pot-stirrers from the other thread where 6 months ago they were firmly in the "unthinkable" camp but are in the process of moving through the "radical" camp to the "accepting" camp as more and more anecdotal evidence comes under the spotlight.
r3g said:
“All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident.”
~ Arthur Schopenhauer (19th century German philosopher)
Are you referring to the apparent truths that you share? ~ Arthur Schopenhauer (19th century German philosopher)
Will you take the same approach with truths from the opposing side or is that just people drinking the lool aid?
Further inadmissible anecdote, correlation is not causation, you must be the unluckiest man alive, yadda yadda shabbalat.
Family friend, 85, in amazing health for her age. Walks into town every day for messages three miles each way come rain or shine, a hardy old girl. Fully up to date with the jab programme as considered vulnerable. Had her latest booster (so 2 jabs plus 4 boosters at this point) last Thursday. Later that same evening developed intense pains in her legs, to the point now where she can barely stand let alone walk... "I wish I'd never had that last one". Really hoping for her sake that it's only a temporary symptom, but it's not showing any signs of clearing yet.
People will continue to be injured by these jabs so long as the media ignore vaccine harms, government and medical profession parrot the "safe and effective" narrative, and proper debate is stifled and silenced.
Family friend, 85, in amazing health for her age. Walks into town every day for messages three miles each way come rain or shine, a hardy old girl. Fully up to date with the jab programme as considered vulnerable. Had her latest booster (so 2 jabs plus 4 boosters at this point) last Thursday. Later that same evening developed intense pains in her legs, to the point now where she can barely stand let alone walk... "I wish I'd never had that last one". Really hoping for her sake that it's only a temporary symptom, but it's not showing any signs of clearing yet.
People will continue to be injured by these jabs so long as the media ignore vaccine harms, government and medical profession parrot the "safe and effective" narrative, and proper debate is stifled and silenced.
No mention of this on the BBC
https://www.newsflare.com/video/539041/covid-vacci...
This is was Jan 2023! You can’t find a sniff of it (I only just heard of it last week from a comment on a podcast and went searching). Anything like this is totally hidden from most people’s view of the world, so reality via the media becomes a total fabrication. This is what I mean about not believing anything you’re fed, it paints a very distorted picture of what real life is like.
https://www.newsflare.com/video/539041/covid-vacci...
This is was Jan 2023! You can’t find a sniff of it (I only just heard of it last week from a comment on a podcast and went searching). Anything like this is totally hidden from most people’s view of the world, so reality via the media becomes a total fabrication. This is what I mean about not believing anything you’re fed, it paints a very distorted picture of what real life is like.
jameswills said:
No mention of this on the BBC
https://www.newsflare.com/video/539041/covid-vacci...
This is was Jan 2023! You can’t find a sniff of it (I only just heard of it last week from a comment on a podcast and went searching). Anything like this is totally hidden from most people’s view of the world, so reality via the media becomes a total fabrication. This is what I mean about not believing anything you’re fed, it paints a very distorted picture of what real life is like.
Why didn't they upload it to other sites rather than just one random host?https://www.newsflare.com/video/539041/covid-vacci...
This is was Jan 2023! You can’t find a sniff of it (I only just heard of it last week from a comment on a podcast and went searching). Anything like this is totally hidden from most people’s view of the world, so reality via the media becomes a total fabrication. This is what I mean about not believing anything you’re fed, it paints a very distorted picture of what real life is like.
You know, get the word out.
Some interesting earlier discussions on Covid deaths in the UK, but with little discussion over deaths 'OF' and deaths 'WITH'.
Some helpful chap submitted a Freedom Of Information request to the ONS in a bid to find out how many people died OF Covid in 2020 and 2021, and the results were a bit surprising. The number of deaths where only Covid was mentioned on the Death Cert were: 6,183.
23 in the under 30 cohort.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgove...
Some helpful chap submitted a Freedom Of Information request to the ONS in a bid to find out how many people died OF Covid in 2020 and 2021, and the results were a bit surprising. The number of deaths where only Covid was mentioned on the Death Cert were: 6,183.
23 in the under 30 cohort.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgove...
Next, we've had some discussion around whether the Vaccines actually worked. Well, if you want to follow someone who is eminently qualified, AND has crunched the number to death, then it's this guy who has worked tirelessly over the past few years.
He is also very clear, the vaccines did next to Sweet FA!
Here's his credentials first, for those who'll call him a swivel eyed loon:
"I’m a former NHS head of department for clinical audit with specialism in assessment of clinical outcomes for cardiac surgery, cardiology and cardiac anaesthesia at a busy teaching hospital. Before this I headed a statistical modelling section as a PSO/G7 UK government scientist working on a wide variety of projects.
My interest in COVID kicked-off back in April 2020 when debate centred around estimation of case fatality rates and since then I have spent upwards of 7,000 hours analysing various COVID-related datasets. These days I publish exclusively on Substack, with my output standing at +300 articles to date."
In order to read his analysis you'll have to subscribe to his Substack, but if you are REALLY interested then that'll be a very small price worth paying.
A full list of his archive is here, and is why many folks don't see conspiracy, they see lies, mistruths, obfuscation and downright dirty f
king dealing!
https://jdee.substack.com/archive?sort=top
He is also very clear, the vaccines did next to Sweet FA!
Here's his credentials first, for those who'll call him a swivel eyed loon:
"I’m a former NHS head of department for clinical audit with specialism in assessment of clinical outcomes for cardiac surgery, cardiology and cardiac anaesthesia at a busy teaching hospital. Before this I headed a statistical modelling section as a PSO/G7 UK government scientist working on a wide variety of projects.
My interest in COVID kicked-off back in April 2020 when debate centred around estimation of case fatality rates and since then I have spent upwards of 7,000 hours analysing various COVID-related datasets. These days I publish exclusively on Substack, with my output standing at +300 articles to date."
In order to read his analysis you'll have to subscribe to his Substack, but if you are REALLY interested then that'll be a very small price worth paying.
A full list of his archive is here, and is why many folks don't see conspiracy, they see lies, mistruths, obfuscation and downright dirty f
king dealing!https://jdee.substack.com/archive?sort=top
jshell said:
Some interesting earlier discussions on Covid deaths in the UK, but with little discussion over deaths 'OF' and deaths 'WITH'.
Some helpful chap submitted a Freedom Of Information request to the ONS in a bid to find out how many people died OF Covid in 2020 and 2021, and the results were a bit surprising. The number of deaths where only Covid was mentioned on the Death Cert were: 6,183.
23 in the under 30 cohort.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgove...
If that's what he wanted to find out, why did he ask a completely different question?Some helpful chap submitted a Freedom Of Information request to the ONS in a bid to find out how many people died OF Covid in 2020 and 2021, and the results were a bit surprising. The number of deaths where only Covid was mentioned on the Death Cert were: 6,183.
23 in the under 30 cohort.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgove...
For the above Substack there are Discussions that can be accessed without subscribing, one of which you may like to read is this one showing A&E admissions for respiratory illness that had a massive peak in Dec 2019, dropped massively during the Covid 'peak' until rising again mid/late 2020!
https://jdee.substack.com/p/emergency-department-a...
https://jdee.substack.com/p/emergency-department-a...
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