Bus stop in Jerusalem bombed.

[Victor McDade]

Great,just what the Middle East needs right now, an escalation in the I-P conflict

[Team 17]

Victor McDade said:

Great,just what the Middle East needs right now, an escalation in the I-P conflict

And it's not a one way street either...
Gaza: Children die in Israeli attack, say doctors:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-128224...

[tonym911]

I'm increasingly believing that there is a single global impetus behind all this Middle East uproar, something that goes way beyond local, regional or even oil issues. No idea who or what, it's just a crap conspiracy theory, but if I wanted to undermine the West's economy, what's happening now is exactly how I'd do it. Stir things up until the West feels morally obliged to intervene and then slowly bleed them dry through a succession of unwinnable wars. That would certainly even out the ridiculous global imbalance in wealth, but it would be a lot better to drag the poor up to our economic level rather than have them drag us down to theirs (which is the seemingly inevitable consequence of regime-change politics).

[Eric Mc]

Fashion.

One revolution oftem spawns copy-cat revolutions. We had the same phenomenon in the mid to late 80s and just after WW1.

[Victor McDade]

tonym911 said:

I'm increasingly believing that there is a single global impetus behind all this Middle East uproar, something that goes way beyond local, regional or even oil issues. No idea who or what, it's just a crap conspiracy theory, but if I wanted to undermine the West's economy, what's happening now is exactly how I'd do it. Stir things up until the West feels morally obliged to intervene and then slowly bleed them dry through a succession of unwinnable wars. That would certainly even out the ridiculous global imbalance in wealth, but it would be a lot better to drag the poor up to our economic level rather than have them drag us down to theirs (which is the seemingly inevitable consequence of regime-change politics).

More of a belief thing imo. You see one group of people doing it and thus have the balls to do it yourself. And being in Libya is hardly going to undermine our economy a whole lot - money spent on getting rid of Gaddafi will soon make it's way back once a favourable regime is in place over there.

Look what has been spent in Iraq and Afghanistan - this will be peanuts in comparison.

[wakster]

Team 17 said:

And it's not a one way street either...
Gaza: Children die in Israeli attack, say doctors:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-128224...

Did you read that?

"Two Israeli military strikes on Gaza have killed eight Palestinians, medical officials say.

Two were under 18, while four were members of the armed wing of Islamic Jihad, according to the ruling Hamas militant group.

Israel apologised for the civilian casualties but said it would defend itself against rocket fire from Gaza, which has increased in recent days.

Militants fired a barrage of mortars into Israel on Saturday."

[tonym911]

Victor McDade said:

...once a favourable regime is in place over there.

Many a slip twixt cup and lip on that one!

[Ozzie Osmond]

It must be about time for a no-fly zone. Isn't that considered the "right" thing to do these days when one side is armed with rifles and the other side has tanks and aircraft?

[Mermaid]

Ozzie Osmond said:

It must be about time for a no-fly zone. Isn't that considered the "right" thing to do these days when one side is armed with rifles and the other side has tanks and aircraft?

Unless..................................................................

Fill in the gaps

[MX7]

Team 17 said:

And it's not a one way street either...
Gaza: Children die in Israeli attack, say doctors:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-128224...

Are you really comparing the bombing of civilians, with people being killed while trying to target terrorists?

[MX7]

Ozzie Osmond said:

It must be about time for a no-fly zone. Isn't that considered the "right" thing to do these days when one side is armed with rifles and the other side has tanks and aircraft?

ZZZzzzzZZZZzzzZZZzzzzZZZZzzzzz......

[-Z-]

MX7 said:

Team 17 said:

And it's not a one way street either...
Gaza: Children die in Israeli attack, say doctors:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-128224...

Are you really comparing the bombing of civilians, with people being killed while trying to target terrorists?

No Israeli's died, Palestinian children died. From the same article

"The BBC's Jon Donnison, in Gaza City, says the exchanges are among the most serious since Israel's major offensive in the coastal strip between December 2008 and January 2009.

More than 1,300 Gazans lost their lives during the 22-day offensive. Thirteen Israelis, including three civilians, were killed."

Ridiculous overreaction, how is that NOT going to perpetuate the same cycle of kids' fathers dying and the children growing up wanting to avenge those deaths, I know I most definitely fking would.

[Smiler.]

Two words:

The Promise.

The I-P conflict will never be resolved until at least one side commits to no violent action/dialogue. It's very unlikely to be Israel. Not a condemnation as such, just an observation.

The occupation of the West Bank doesn't help.

OTOH, I'm sure that there are elements within the Arab population who will never give up acts of terror upon Israel.

So the cycle continues.

[Mr Sparkle]

-Z- said:

More than 1,300 Gazans lost their lives during the 22-day offensive. Thirteen Israelis, including three civilians, were killed."

If the Hamas leadership cared about its citizens it would stop firing mortar and rockets for this reason.

[S 8 GRN]

Ozzie Osmond said:

It must be about time for a no-fly zone. Isn't that considered the "right" thing to do these days when one side is armed with rifles and the other side has tanks and aircraft?

Armed with rifles you say?

http://www.youtube.com/user/idfnadesk

A real shame this didn't make the news last week, but then it wouldn't support the cause.

[KemP]

S 8 GRN said:

Armed with rifles you say?

http://www.youtube.com/user/idfnadesk

A real shame this didn't make the news last week, but then it wouldn't support the cause.

Wow. That's a lot of kit.

[Puggit]

Only death was a Brit... http://tinyurl.com/644kwz8

[Victor McDade]

MX7 said:

Are you really comparing the bombing of civilians, with people being killed while trying to target terrorists?

I agree, I think it's unfair to compare the two. Hamas will deliberately target Israeli civilians with their rockets and the the Israelis have no choice but to retaliate during which civilians are sadly killed.

But I don't think you can talk about the loathsome acts of violence by the likes of Hamas without addressing the elephant in the room which is the illegal occupation of land which does not belong to Israel.

To be frank, I find the act of kicking out inhabitants from an area then illegally moving your own people in (all in the name of security) equally as despicable as the cowardly methods used by the likes of Hamas.

These neighbours deserve each other.

[Mermaid]

Victor McDade said:

I agree, I think it's unfair to compare the two. Hamas will deliberately target Israeli civilians with their rockets and the the Israelis have no choice but to retaliate during which civilians are sadly killed.

But I don't think you can talk about the loathsome acts of violence by the likes of Hamas without addressing the elephant in the room which is the illegal occupation of land which does not belong to Israel.

To be frank, I find the act of kicking out inhabitants from an area then illegally moving your own people in (all in the name of security) equally as despicable as the cowardly methods used by the likes of Hamas.

These neighbours deserve each other.

So true, and so sad.

Israel needs a moderate leadership, and that means Netanyahu needs to make way. And the Yanks need to start withdrawing support.

[Jimbeaux]

Mermaid said:

Victor McDade said:

I agree, I think it's unfair to compare the two. Hamas will deliberately target Israeli civilians with their rockets and the the Israelis have no choice but to retaliate during which civilians are sadly killed.

But I don't think you can talk about the loathsome acts of violence by the likes of Hamas without addressing the elephant in the room which is the illegal occupation of land which does not belong to Israel.

To be frank, I find the act of kicking out inhabitants from an area then illegally moving your own people in (all in the name of security) equally as despicable as the cowardly methods used by the likes of Hamas.

These neighbours deserve each other.

So true, and so sad.

Israel needs a moderate leadership, and that means Netanyahu needs to make way. And the Yanks need to start withdrawing support.

Moderate leader or not, that will not help. When are people going to understand this? Israel could give them everything they want tomorrow and Hamas, etc would still find a reason to attack. The palestinians are a focus point used by the ilk to maintain hate and their own relevance, thus, power.