RE: Murray T.50 confirmed as lightest hypercar ever

RE: Murray T.50 confirmed as lightest hypercar ever

Friday 29th May 2020

Murray T.50 confirmed as lightest hypercar ever

Hero-designer says official reveal of 650hp, £2m McLaren F1-beater now set for August



If the Gordon Murray Automotive T.50 has a problem it's human skepticism - with many people still not believing it's going to be possible to build something so otherworldly. That's despite the fact work on the T.50 is well advanced, even as much of the rest of the supercar segment seems to be in danger of collapse, and has only suffered from relatively minor inconvenience from the COVID-19 lockdown.

More to the point, Gordon Murray himself says that around three quarters of the limited-to-100 run of road cars have now been sold, that's despite a £2m price tag and the need for buyers to front a £600,000 deposit when they sign on the line. The combination of an ultra-light carbon body, a central driving position, naturally aspirated V12 engine and a six-speed manual gearbox might be gloriously unlikely - but it is happening - as is the use of active 'ground effects' aerodynamics from a 48-Volt fan.

The disbelief should have ended last Friday with the official unveiling of the car, but unfortunately that's one of the things the Corono-crisis has pushed back. "The company that was building our model for the launch got some cases of COVID and shut down, so we lost around six weeks," Murray explains. The new plan is for an unveiling in August, which will almost certainly be done online rather than physically.


But we do have some more details, including confirmation that the car will come in on Murray's target of a 980kg kerbweight. That won't just make it the lightest supercar ever, but also one of the lightest roof-wearing cars on the road - 100kg less than an Exige and 260kg under a Mazda MX-5 RC. While Murray has plenty to be proud about with the new car, he says hitting the target has given him the greatest pleasure - especially as he missed the same one with the original McLaren F1 whose spirit the T.50 is explicitly channeling.

"Initially we were looking at a smaller motor [for the F1] and we were going to use carbon brakes," Murray remembers, "but it ended up with a 6.1-litre engine and no carbon brakes, and everything gets bigger as the torque gets higher... I was determined to do better this time."

Weight has been saved both in terms of major components, but also an obsessive attention to detail with smaller ones. The T.50 development team has held regular "mass track" sessions where they plot the weight of every component being added to the car, from individual fasteners upwards, to make sure that everything is as light as can be. The carbon monocoque and all exterior body panels weigh less than 150kg, the windscreen uses extra-thin glass and even the pedal box is lighter than the one on the F1; something Murray initially thought would be impossible.


"I said to the guys 'I designed the pedals on the F1, I did the stress analysis, you're not going to get any weight out of that.' But we had a look at the whole thing again, materials and technology, and we've saved 300g on the pedal box, and 800g on the gear change mechanism by using a lot more titanium."

Bigger reductions have come from both engine and transmission, with Murray admitting that both Cosworth and X-trac "laughed a bit nervously" when he gave them his targets. Yet both have delivered. The Cosworth-made 4.0-litre V12 is set to weigh less than 180kg, a 60kg saving over the F1's BMW unit. It's also going to make more power - 650hp - and rev to a motorbike-like 12,100rpm; although famed for the speed of its responses the F1's rev-limiter was set at 7500rpm. The gearbox is similarly special. "The [Pete] Weismann [designed] 'box on the F1 was very light, the lightest transverse gearbox in a road car ever at that point, and we've managed to beat that by 9.5kg," Murray says, "again, with new materials and new technology - X-trac has taken a millimeter out of the casing with a new casting technique."

"It's what I call engineering art," Murray says, "every single little piece - whether it's the mount that holds the windscreen wiper to the monocoque or something you'll touch every time you drive it - is a beautifully designed piece of art. That's what really sets you apart; it set the F1 apart from the other supercars of the time and we're doing it again with the T.50."

 

Beyond delaying the full-size model, COVID has also caused some problems for the aerodynamic modeling of the car. Murray says that the deal to use the Racing Point Formula 1 team's wind tunnel is still in place - despite owner Lawrence Stroll's recent acquisition of a sizeable chunk of Aston Martin - but lockdown means it hasn't been possible to do it. That has required much more CFD - computational fluid dynamics - modeling, a process it turns out is actually slower than real-life modeling. "In a wind tunnel you can do up to 60 runs a day," says Murray - but with computer modeling, nothing close. "We're two or three weeks behind," he adds, "but that's easily recoverable."

Even without a formal launch, the car has continued to sell - to the point that anyone wanting to add a T.50 to their collection would be well advised not to wait too long to make contact. "When we first announced it I said we'll probably pre-sell 12 or 15 cars before the laMurray says, "but we've had a steady trickle of sales every week since we announced the car." Indeed, the rate of sales has actually increased slightly since the COVID-crisis, helped by Zoom video conferencing sessions where potential customers get a digital look at what the finished car will look like.

While some are existing McLaren F1 owners, Murray says he is surprised at the relative youth of many of the buyers - 40 percent being under 45. "They consistently tell me the same thing," he says, "they were teenagers with the F1 on a poster on their bedroom wall, but by the time they had a successful business the F1 was £15m and they couldn't find one anyway. This is their F1 and they're getting it at an 85 percent discount - that's one way of looking at it."


 

Author
Discussion

Sandpit Steve

Original Poster:

10,353 posts

76 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
Great news that they’ve got so many substantial deposits, despite everything that’s going on in the world right now.

Good luck to Murray and the team, the project looks utterly insane but completely awesome!

Now, about those lottery numbers...

mekondelta

686 posts

262 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
Wow, that's the only hypercard I'd like to own. I like the back, it's not trying to ape a Batmobile like others, I hope the front is even better.

anonymous-user

56 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
I thought this was his lightest hypercar?



or perhaps that 48 volt fan for "active ground effects" makes all the difference. scratchchin


Leftfootwonder

1,120 posts

60 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
I'm glad this actually is happening, unlike so many of his projects before. If it doesn't, I want the last 22 years of my life back!

Are we saying T point five oh or T point fifty or dropping the point to T Five Oh or T Fifty? scratchchin

0a

23,907 posts

196 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
If the above details are true, it will make every other hypercar irrelevant!

rev-erend

21,437 posts

286 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
So, has he dropped the istream or is the T.50 not planned to use this construction method.

sgtBerbatov

2,597 posts

83 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
rev-erend said:
So, has he dropped the istream or is the T.50 not planned to use this construction method.
I thought the T.50 was using, or at least using some of the iStream concept in it's design?

This car though, this is a car. This is what is exciting. Not some Tamiya DB5 for £3.3 million. Not another Ferrari that's the best thing since the last Ferrari. Not something that's built just so it can say it has 1,000bhp bro.

No. This is a car that has a proper engine, a proper gearbox, and is designed to go round corners quickly. And it'll look stunning.

kambites

67,695 posts

223 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
So that thing on the back which looks like a fan, really IS a fan. Coming from anyone else I'd have called it a gimmick but I can't imagine he would have put it on if it didn't provide enough benefits to overcome the weight.

Krikkit

26,635 posts

183 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
This is a serious-sounding piece of kit, I'd love to be able to afford one because this would be right at the top of my list. As a nerd of engineering this sounds like manna from heaven.

shalmaneser

5,943 posts

197 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
rev-erend said:
So, has he dropped the istream or is the T.50 not planned to use this construction method.
IiStream is a concept for (relative) volume production and a tech demonstrator. This application isn't really appropriate for iStream.

Europa1

10,923 posts

190 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
kambites said:
So that thing on the back which looks like a fan, really IS a fan. Coming from anyone else I'd have called it a gimmick but I can't imagine he would have put it on if it didn't provide enough benefits to overcome the weight.
He does after all have some form in this area. smile

anonymous-user

56 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
Leftfootwonder said:
I'm glad this actually is happening, unlike so many of his projects before. If it doesn't, I want the last 22 years of my life back!

Are we saying T point five oh or T point fifty or dropping the point to T Five Oh or T Fifty? scratchchin
The latter - T Fifty

anonymous-user

56 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
It's 2020; and all we get is batteries, hybrids, downsized turbos and autos and continual excuses why 'duller is better'.

So to read about:

- manual gearbox
- naturally aspirated V12
- 12k+ rev limit(!)

is manna from car heaven.

It's unlikely that I'll ever have one, but great that it exists somewhere. Probably, already, the car of the century for people like us

anonymous-user

56 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
tommy1973s said:
Leftfootwonder said:
I'm glad this actually is happening, unlike so many of his projects before. If it doesn't, I want the last 22 years of my life back!

Are we saying T point five oh or T point fifty or dropping the point to T Five Oh or T Fifty? scratchchin
The latter - T Fifty
T Fiddy, obvs.

Mr.Jimbo

2,082 posts

185 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
that V12 is VERY light at 180kg.

I remember benchmarking the McLaren V8 (developed by Ricardo) at ~205kg iirc - that engine is power dense and very light, but relatively 'low tech' - depends on your OEM requirements, won't go into it, but not saying it's a bad engine.

So to have 4 more cylinders and 20kg less... wow.

blade7

11,311 posts

218 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
It would be a fairly dull motorcycle that only revved to 12100 rpm in 2020.

Krikkit

26,635 posts

183 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
blade7 said:
It would be a fairly dull motorcycle that only revved to 12100 rpm in 2020.
Were you chastised as a work experience kid by a certain G. Murray or something?

4 litres revving to 12k in a road car (and presumably not thousand mile rebuild intervals) is pretty cool.

kambites

67,695 posts

223 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
Mr.Jimbo said:
that V12 is VERY light at 180kg.

I remember benchmarking the McLaren V8 (developed by Ricardo) at ~205kg iirc - that engine is power dense and very light, but relatively 'low tech' - depends on your OEM requirements, won't go into it, but not saying it's a bad engine.

So to have 4 more cylinders and 20kg less... wow.
It's light for a road car engine, but it's there or there abouts per cylinder compared to bike derived units. For example the RST V8 is around 100kg in service for a 550bhp supercharged V8 (or rather less for a 400bhp naturally aspirated version).

Still impressive, especially given it presumably meets current emissions regulations, but not unheard of.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 28th May 15:07

NJJ

438 posts

82 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
The perfect tonic against the current Hypercar market, which was becoming more and more irrelevant with each passing year. It will be one of the most exciting car launches of recent memory.

shalmaneser

5,943 posts

197 months

Thursday 28th May 2020
quotequote all
tommy1973s said:
It's 2020; and all we get is batteries, hybrids, downsized turbos and autos and continual excuses why 'duller is better'.

So to read about:

- manual gearbox
- naturally aspirated V12
- 12k+ rev limit(!)

is manna from car heaven.

It's unlikely that I'll ever have one, but great that it exists somewhere. Probably, already, the car of the century for people like us
Quite right. No doubt the last of the petrol (only) hypercars.