The Official F1 2025 silly season *contains speculation*

[andburg]

vaud said:

ThingsBehindTheSun said:

Would Mercedes really take a chance on a (currently) 17 year old rookie who isn't exactly setting the F2 championship alight?

Running 6th (36pts) vs Bearman (6pts)

This I had a similar view until i really looked.Antonelli skipped F3, has gone straight to F2 and in the same team is outperforming the top Ferrari junior who already has a full season of F2 under his belt. Skipping F3 makes F2 a much bigger challenge, new car, new team, hasn't driven many of the tracks before.

[ralphrj]

andburg said:

vaud said:

ThingsBehindTheSun said:

Would Mercedes really take a chance on a (currently) 17 year old rookie who isn't exactly setting the F2 championship alight?

Running 6th (36pts) vs Bearman (6pts)

This I had a similar view until i really looked.Antonelli skipped F3, has gone straight to F2 and in the same team is outperforming the top Ferrari junior who already has a full season of F2 under his belt. Skipping F3 makes F2 a much bigger challenge, new car, new team, hasn't driven many of the tracks before.

Is it really fair to say "out performing" when there have only been 4 rounds, 1 of which Bearman missed to take part in the F1 race?

[SpudLink]

andburg said:

vaud said:

ThingsBehindTheSun said:

Would Mercedes really take a chance on a (currently) 17 year old rookie who isn't exactly setting the F2 championship alight?

Running 6th (36pts) vs Bearman (6pts)

This I had a similar view until i really looked.Antonelli skipped F3, has gone straight to F2 and in the same team is outperforming the top Ferrari junior who already has a full season of F2 under his belt. Skipping F3 makes F2 a much bigger challenge, new car, new team, hasn't driven many of the tracks before.

Max Verstappen skipped most the usual pre-F1 development series. Team bosses are willing to take risks if they see the potential for someone special, even if the isn't an obvious domination of the lower formula.

[vaud]

ralphrj said:

Is it really fair to say "out performing" when there have only been 4 rounds, 1 of which Bearman missed to take part in the F1 race?

I think they are both great.

[ralphrj]

vaud said:

ralphrj said:

Is it really fair to say "out performing" when there have only been 4 rounds, 1 of which Bearman missed to take part in the F1 race?

I think they are both great.

I've only seen a little of either but I'm hoping to see them both in F1 in the years to come.

[Sandpit Steve]

andburg said:

This I had a similar view until i really looked.Antonelli skipped F3, has gone straight to F2 and in the same team is outperforming the top Ferrari junior who already has a full season of F2 under his belt. Skipping F3 makes F2 a much bigger challenge, new car, new team, hasn't driven many of the tracks before.

He’s also been doing loads of private testing with Mercedes, and this year they’re allowed to test the 2022 car for the first time. Toto has benchmarks of performance from Hamilton, Bottas, Russell and current test driver Schumacher, with which he can be directly compared, and the suggestion is that so far Toto is impressed. Yes he’s still very young, and has a lot to learn, but it’s not impossible they put him straight into the top team. That said, a year at Williams benchmarking with Albon is more likely.

I think that, for next year, Toto’s list goes Verstappen, Sainz (but only for one year), Antonelli, Albon. I suspect Verstappen’s management already has their offer in hand, which could delay the announcement until the Red Bull political stshow sorts itself out one way or the other.

[Leithen]

Wolff is clutching at straws if he places Antonelli in Mercedes next year. He can put him in Williams for at least a year, preferably two. By then he might have found a design/engineering team that can produce the goods.

Sainz for two years would be the clever move. Intelligent, consistent and likely to work well with Russell, exactly when needed. They could just as easily lose further ground over the 25/26 rule changes as somehow rediscovering how to produce a winning car.

The hope that they might have an advantage in the engine department is tenuous at best. Even with an advantage, without understanding their aero platform they won’t dominate.

Antonelli’s management team ought to understand that to.

Red Bull ought to be chasing Sainz for similar reasons. They don’t know how good their power plant will be and can they be sure that without Newey they will still have the best car? They need both drivers pushing the team.

[PRO5T]

Sandpit Steve said:

Toto’s list goes Verstappen, Sainz (but only for one year), Antonelli, Albon.

He’ll have a job with Albon, he’s signed to Williams.

[Derek Smith]

Leithen said:

Red Bull ought to be chasing Sainz for similar reasons. They don’t know how good their power plant will be and can they be sure that without Newey they will still have the best car? They need both drivers pushing the team.

Is it possible that they, including Newey, know just how good their power plant is?

[HighwayStar]

Derek Smith said:

Leithen said:

Red Bull ought to be chasing Sainz for similar reasons. They don’t know how good their power plant will be and can they be sure that without Newey they will still have the best car? They need both drivers pushing the team.

Is it possible that they, including Newey, know just how good their power plant is?

Good point…

[732NM]

davidd said:

Toyota have been pretty handy at Le Mans but their F1 effort ultimately failed. (I appreciate Audi have a very different approach).

Toyota F1 was an exercise in pissing money up the wall, it was a very odd setup, including flying in your designer every day by private jet. Nutters.

[tele_lover]

vaud said:

ThingsBehindTheSun said:

Would Mercedes really take a chance on a (currently) 17 year old rookie who isn't exactly setting the F2 championship alight?

Running 6th (36pts) vs Bearman (6pts)

Bearman didn't race in SA and at Imola was 1st/2nd before his car stalled twice whilst pitting and he dropped 18 places.

I agree, Antonelli hasn't set F2 alight yet.

[tele_lover]

Hustle_ said:

Merc are going to go for Antonelli. Sainz, sadly, has a choice between Audi or sabbatical IMO.

Williams' Sargeant replacement will be somewhat interesting... Sauber refugees? Gasly? Lawson? Young driver of some kind?

Edited by Hustle_ on Wednesday 15th May 11:02

Riccardo will probably be replaced by Lawson.

[Killer2005]

Wheel covers have been scrapped it seems

F1 abandons rain wheel cover idea after latest test https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-abandons-rai...

[TheDeuce]

Killer2005 said:

Wheel covers have been scrapped it seems

F1 abandons rain wheel cover idea after latest test https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-abandons-rai...

Good!

[Mark-C]

tele_lover said:

Hustle_ said:

Merc are going to go for Antonelli. Sainz, sadly, has a choice between Audi or sabbatical IMO.

Williams' Sargeant replacement will be somewhat interesting... Sauber refugees? Gasly? Lawson? Young driver of some kind?

Edited by Hustle_ on Wednesday 15th May 11:02

Riccardo will probably be replaced by Lawson.

Aren't we expecting Williams to be Albon and Bottas?

[Sixpackpert]

Killer2005 said:

Wheel covers have been scrapped it seems

F1 abandons rain wheel cover idea after latest test https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-abandons-rai...

Surely this was never going to work. So if they eliminate the water from the wheels, what about all the water that is sucked up by the car and thrown out the back?

Was never going to work IMHO.

[SpudLink]

Sixpackpert said:

Killer2005 said:

Wheel covers have been scrapped it seems

F1 abandons rain wheel cover idea after latest test https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-abandons-rai...

Surely this was never going to work. So if they eliminate the water from the wheels, what about all the water that is sucked up by the car and thrown out the back?

Was never going to work IMHO.

Reading the article, seems they thought that the defuser would be the main issue, but wanted to see how much difference it would make to reduce spray from the tyres. They've done the test, and now they know the difference is marginal, so will not proceed.

They knew what they were doing, and were right to do the test.

[Rotary Potato]

Leithen said:

Wolff is clutching at straws if he places Antonelli in Mercedes next year. ...

Quite.

You wouldn't want to drop a raw 18 year old into the white heat of a championship battle, no matter how talented they are. The perfect environment for Antonelli would be a car that can roll round on the fringes of the top 10, with a known benchmark for a teammate to assess him against.

Sounds tailor made for the 2025 Merc to me!

It's becoming clear that there is no silver bullet for Merc (or even a bronze bullet ... or frankly, even a gun!) in this set of rules. RB have set the benchmark ... Ferrari and McLaren are in the close-but-no-cigar camp, where a good off season could see them make a fight of things on a more regular basis ... but Merc are left picking up the scraps and are not really any further forwards than they were in 2022.

There's nothing left to lose for Merc - chuck Antonelli in there, see how he does. If you have the next big thing on your hands, and you manage to ace the rules for 2026, you're back in the pound seats. If you've aced the rules, but Antonelli isn't all that ... then I can't imagine it'd take much to get Max away from the internal fun'n'games at RB with the lure of a front running car. If you haven't aced the rules for 2026, then your drivers are largely irrelevant and Toto needs to take a long hard look in the mirror to see where the problem lies.

[paulguitar]

SpudLink said:

Reading the article, seems they thought that the defuser would be the main issue, but wanted to see how much difference it would make to reduce spray from the tyres. They've done the test, and now they know the difference is marginal, so will not proceed.

They knew what they were doing, and were right to do the test.

If only they had consulted PH first, they could have saved the time, money and effort!