Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?

[Dynion Araf Uchaf]

Because not everybody is a middle class educated libertarian?

[MC Bodge]

Dynion Araf Uchaf said:

Because not everybody is a middle class educated libertarian?

And why would that lead to support for Reform?

[skwdenyer]

MC Bodge said:

Dynion Araf Uchaf said:

Because not everybody is a middle class educated libertarian?

And why would that lead to support for Reform?

The same reason so many voted to “stick it to the man” in the Brexit referendum.

[captain_cynic]

Dynion Araf Uchaf said:

Because not everybody is a middle class educated libertarian?

So you're saying that you need to be uneducated to vote reform... And this to you is a cogent argument in reforms favour?

[zarjaz1991]

MC Bodge said:

I still cannot work out why somebody would think,
"I'm not voting for those Tories, I will vote for the same, but a bit sillier, and with Lee Anderson involved"

Exactly.

“I’m fed up with these awful Tories, let’s give these even worse Tories a go”.

They won’t win a single seat and will vanish on July 5th.

[Dynion Araf Uchaf]

captain_cynic said:

So you're saying that you need to be uneducated to vote reform... And this to you is a cogent argument in reforms favour?

can you tell me where I said that?

[768]

zarjaz1991 said:

MC Bodge said:

I still cannot work out why somebody would think,
"I'm not voting for those Tories, I will vote for the same, but a bit sillier..."

Exactly.

“I’m fed up with these awful Tories, let’s give these even worse Tories a go”.

Genuinely managed to read this as being about voting Labour for a second there.

[MC Bodge]

768 said:

zarjaz1991 said:

MC Bodge said:

I still cannot work out why somebody would think,
"I'm not voting for those Tories, I will vote for the same, but a bit sillier..."

Exactly.

“I’m fed up with these awful Tories, let’s give these even worse Tories a go”.

Genuinely managed to read this as being about voting Labour for a second there.

Genuinely?

[MiniMan64]

zarjaz1991 said:

MC Bodge said:

I still cannot work out why somebody would think,
"I'm not voting for those Tories, I will vote for the same, but a bit sillier, and with Lee Anderson involved"

Exactly.

“I’m fed up with these awful Tories, let’s give these even worse Tories a go”.

They won’t win a single seat and will vanish on July 5th.

Right on the first but wrong on the second

Unfortunately parties like this always lurk on despite irrelevance because unfortunately there’s always a subset of the population that feel they need a party to justify themselves.

[captain_cynic]

Dynion Araf Uchaf said:

captain_cynic said:

So you're saying that you need to be uneducated to vote reform... And this to you is a cogent argument in reforms favour?

can you tell me where I said that?

in the post i quoted.

Right there in black and white.

[wisbech]

Cutting waiting lists to zero in 24 months would be quite easy. Just remove NHS from anyone over the age of 67. Government has no interest in keeping them healthy for work. Win win as it would also reduce pension payments and increase tax take from IHT.

[Baroque attacks]

MC Bodge said:

I still cannot work out why somebody would think,
"I'm not voting for those Tories, I will vote for the same, but a bit sillier, and with Lee Anderson involved"

The only difference I can see is the (greater) dislike of brown people.

[The Gauge]

Scolmore said:

Perhaps the change should be not having power bounce between the same two parties. Parties who have become so similar, that it is impossible to spot the difference.

True. The only real difference is that one party cares little for those who have less wealth than themselves, and the other party pretends they'll look after those same people. I despise both, but there's currently no third choice.

Whenever I decide on the party I'm to vote for, instead of trying to get that party into power I'm normally voting tactically to get a current government out of power, and I then suffer the consequences of that new government. I feel I'll be doing the same again this year.

Edited by The Gauge on Sunday 26th May 10:16

[swisstoni]

I expect a lot of people considering Reform would normally vote Conservative. But this Govt have done nothing but infight and, apparently let everything else go to hell.

They just want their old party back. As there are no signs of that happening any time soon, they have to seek alternatives or not vote at all.

[bitchstewie]

swisstoni said:

I expect a lot of people considering Reform would normally vote Conservative. But this Govt have done nothing but infight and, apparently let everything else go to hell.

They just want their old party back. As there are no signs of that happening any time soon, they have to seek alternatives or not vote at all.

They don't want "their old party back" they want the hateful stshow that Johnson and Truss have turned it into and that they think Sunak is taking away from them back.

[swisstoni]

bhstewie said:

swisstoni said:

I expect a lot of people considering Reform would normally vote Conservative. But this Govt have done nothing but infight and, apparently let everything else go to hell.

They just want their old party back. As there are no signs of that happening any time soon, they have to seek alternatives or not vote at all.

They don't want "their old party back" they want the hateful stshow that Johnson and Truss have turned it into and that they think Sunak is taking away from them back.

That doesn’t make any sense.

[bitchstewie]

swisstoni said:

That doesn’t make any sense.

I don't think the people bleating about the current lot "not being Conservative" and saying they'll vote Reform are doing so because they want someone like Cameron or May running the party or even Sunak.

I think they still think Johnson or Truss is the answer.

Seriously when you (Sunak) thinks saying you'll introduce mandatory National Service is the way to win voters back you've lost the plot.

[swisstoni]

bhstewie said:

swisstoni said:

That doesn’t make any sense.

I don't think the people bleating about the current lot "not being Conservative" and saying they'll vote Reform are doing so because they want someone like Cameron or May running the party or even Sunak.

I think they still think Johnson or Truss is the answer.

Seriously when you (Sunak) thinks saying you'll introduce mandatory National Service is the way to win voters back you've lost the plot.

Quite possibly. But Johnson and Truss are off the table and nobody else seems to be making any similar noises.

In fact nobody in the Tory party is saying much at all apart from Sunak. They have virtually put the ‘Closed For Stocktaking’ sign up for this GE.

[bitchstewie]

True but the point was more that the Reform voting "they just want their old party back" types don't want someone moderate and reasonably sensible in charge.

They'd take a Braverman type in a flash.

Or whoever is banging on the most about brown people and foreigners.

[swisstoni]

bhstewie said:

True but the point was more that the Reform voting "they just want their old party back" types don't want someone moderate and reasonably sensible in charge.

They'd take a Braverman type in a flash.

Or whoever is banging on the most about brown people and foreigners.

I said ‘a lot’ now considering Reform would probably normally vote for a viable Conservative party. Not all.

Reform would always have attracted the more extreme. They would have found a Conservative offering too centrist.

But branding all those now considering Reform as extemists is not correct imho.