Sneaky, very Sneaky
Discussion
Driving along Hove Seafront today, I pass the speedcamera on Kingsway at the correct limit
Once past it some of the traffic accelerates and overtakes me - Fop Me 100 yards further along the road is a Police Traffic car with 
pointing radar/laser - not an expert on these thing but I was going slow enough to see that it looked a bit like a video camera (rectangle) Sneaky, very sneaky
WildCat said:
Did I not read that they had unmarked cars prowling around scam sites in South East at some time to cop those who accelerated once clear of PC Gatso??
Cannot remember where I read it now.....
When we are out in the Unmarked cars this is what we do.
However,this is to catch the drivers who are the No Licence/Insurance brigade.
They are easy to spot....they dont slow down for the Cameras.
Tonyrec said:
Did I not read that they had unmarked cars prowling around scam sites in South East at some time to cop those who accelerated once clear of PC Gatso??
Cannot remember where I read it now.....
When we are out in the Unmarked cars this is what we do.
However,this is to catch the drivers who are the No Licence/Insurance brigade.
They are easy to spot....they dont slow down for the Cameras.
I don't have any problem with marked cars, ANPR vans, and Red light Cameras. I do, however, have a problem with cameras that are solely there for revenue purposes. I was discussing this with a police class 1 driver last friday, as he spent the day with me, driving around, improving (hopefully) my driving. I was heartened to hear him endorse my comments re a camera on the A15.
Road engineering and better/more instruction and training would reduce casualties at a much better rate than some of these scameras. But it's all about money. I had a distaste for a couple of cameras on the A1, but my instuctor said that they were either to slow traffic down for a junction that had a history of cross traffic accidents, or where the traffic cars used to wait for speeders. I can see the logic in this, but road engineering would remove the first, and training would alleviate the second. And in both cases, marked trafpol would be better in slowing traffic than semi-hidden or blindingly obvious cameras.
marcos maniac said:
can you imagine getting 2 NIPS within 100yards
Already happened, somebody has got two NIPS for the same date with exactly the same time (to the nearest minute). They're parking scamera vans nearly nose to nose under the guise of targeting traffic from both directions when in fact they also from time to time go for the double tax whammy. Not sneaky, f
g disgusting and a total travesty of what passes for justice and road safety in this once fair land. We are now led by buffoons, who are happily presiding over a rise in road fatalities after decades of falls, with eyes closed, deaf ears, and their hands in our pockets. The lunatics have taken over and they just want more moolah to waste on any number of pointless politically correct money wasting schemes. >> Edited by turbobloke on Monday 27th September 22:50
ca092003 said:
I believe that roads that are speed camera targetted (as in by safety camera partnership personnel) are generally not targetted by plod. Something to do with not wanting different enforcement teams skewing each others figures (as if!)
Dont you believe it. A23 Hooley/Coulsdon....2 cameras within half mile. BiB regularly lurk around here with lasers looking for the "rolling start speeders".
Take nothing for granted and keep your eyes open.
Steve
marcos maniac said:
Driving along Hove Seafront today, I pass the speedcamera on Kingsway at the correct limit
Sneaky, very sneaky
Odd; didn't I read that the ACPO guidelines state that any cop with a laser gun and patrol car must be standing clear of the vehicle and in full view of the target vehicle and the public? Was he sitting in the car?
14. Laser/Optical Speedmeters 14.1 Introduction Laser/optical devices are capable of being manufactured for hand-held, vehicle mounted (when stationary) or roadside use in both attended and unattended/automatic mode, with or without camera attachments. The handheld devices, on occasions, have the appearance of a firearm. It is therefore important that this fact is borne in mind when operating such units. The operator must be clearly visible to the public and the target vehicle throughout the check. Devices should be operated in accordance with manufacturers instructions. There are two automatic/tripod-mounted devices Type Approved – namely the Autovelox 104/C-2 and Leica XV2. Neither have a secondary check and so although automatic, they are both approved only for attended actively operated use. The Autovelox operates from a tripod at the roadside or mounted on the rear window of a parked vehicle and point two laser beams down on to the nearest traffic lane. It operates similarly to a sensor device, detecting when a vehicle reflects the beam instead of the road surface. The Leica XV2 operates on a tripod (but may be hand held) automatically using a pulsed laser beam in a similar way to hand held laser. However the beam is diverged and the vehicle measured in a limited distance window, starting when the vehicle is first detected at a distance of 50m or less. The vehicle is not tracked even if the device is hand-held. It is used on approaching traffic only and video recorded. 14.2 Hand-held The hand-held device functions by emitting pulses of infrared laser beams, which are targeted at the vehicle whose speed is being measured. Measurement of speed is performed by aiming the device at the target vehicle in the area around the registration plate and where necessary pressing the trigger or button. It is important that the beam is held steady on the target area to avoid any 'slip factor'. When sufficient pulses of light have been emitted and have returned, within the in built tolerances and checks, then a reading is displayed on the device. The speed recording can be locked into the display by activating the trigger/button in accordance with manufacturer’s instructions where necessary. Devices are capable of recording approaching or receding vehicle speeds, this fact being clearly differentiated by the speedmeter.
© ACPO 2003 Version 2.1 Page 65 of 97
Code of practice for operational use of enforcement equipment
To assist the operator’s identification of the target vehicle the meters have electronic sighting devices (currently either ‘red dot’ telescopic or ‘reticule sight’ on head up displays), together with audible 'locked-on' tones on some devices. Operators should bear in mind the device confirms and corroborates their prior personal observations and opinion. Certain hand-held laser speed detection devices have the ability to establish speeds of vehicles by calculating the time it takes a vehicle to travel over a known distance whilst in the time/distance mode. The time, distance function must be operated in accordance with manufacturer’s instructions and this Code of Practice. Laser or optical hand-held devices may be used from within a vehicle provided there are no radio transmissions during the measurement. Any GSM phones must be turned off and any TETRA radios turned off unless they have a transmission inhibit switch, which is activated. The beam must not be projected through glass or mirrors. The power source must not be taken directly from any vehicle but always from the type approved independent supply. 14.3 Range Hand-held devices are capable of measuring vehicle speeds from a minimum range of 50 feet to a maximum of 2,000 feet and recording speeds from a minimum of 5mph to a maximum of 155mph. Operators should avoid carrying out measurements for enforcement purposes at the extremity of the measurement field. Clearly the steadiness of sighting of the hand-held device affects operating range, but does not affect accuracy. In any case the device will not display any speed reading unless a proper 'lock-on' has occurred. Heavy rain, spray or mist may reduce the range of the laser but will not effect the speed measurement. 14.4 Cosine/Angular Effect The hand-held laser will only record the true speed if it is directed along the path of the target vehicle. The vehicle may be either approaching or receding. If the laser is positioned at an angle to the path of the target vehicle, the displayed speed is less than its actual speed. This reduction in speed is proportional to the cosine of the angle. The angular effect or cosine error is always in favour of the target vehicle,
© ACPO 2003 Version 2.1 Page 66 of 97
Code of practice for operational use of enforcement equipment
whether the device is operated in the horizontal or vertical plane. When operating hand-held devices from the roadside the operator should be within 10 feet of the edge of the carriageway and beyond the minimum operating range (i.e. 50 feet). When operating hand-held devices from an overbridge, the operator must stand where possible over the centre of the carriageway being checked. In respect of minimum range, the operator must carry out a height check from the level of operation to the road surface directly below then multiply this by a factor of ten. This figure becomes the minimum distance for operation. Health and Safety. Never point a laser speedmeter at a civil or military aircraft, vessel or armoured vehicle. Many military aircraft, vehicles or vessels have target acquisition detectors, some of which can initiate automatic counter measures.
© ACPO 2003 Version 2.1 Page 65 of 97
Code of practice for operational use of enforcement equipment
To assist the operator’s identification of the target vehicle the meters have electronic sighting devices (currently either ‘red dot’ telescopic or ‘reticule sight’ on head up displays), together with audible 'locked-on' tones on some devices. Operators should bear in mind the device confirms and corroborates their prior personal observations and opinion. Certain hand-held laser speed detection devices have the ability to establish speeds of vehicles by calculating the time it takes a vehicle to travel over a known distance whilst in the time/distance mode. The time, distance function must be operated in accordance with manufacturer’s instructions and this Code of Practice. Laser or optical hand-held devices may be used from within a vehicle provided there are no radio transmissions during the measurement. Any GSM phones must be turned off and any TETRA radios turned off unless they have a transmission inhibit switch, which is activated. The beam must not be projected through glass or mirrors. The power source must not be taken directly from any vehicle but always from the type approved independent supply. 14.3 Range Hand-held devices are capable of measuring vehicle speeds from a minimum range of 50 feet to a maximum of 2,000 feet and recording speeds from a minimum of 5mph to a maximum of 155mph. Operators should avoid carrying out measurements for enforcement purposes at the extremity of the measurement field. Clearly the steadiness of sighting of the hand-held device affects operating range, but does not affect accuracy. In any case the device will not display any speed reading unless a proper 'lock-on' has occurred. Heavy rain, spray or mist may reduce the range of the laser but will not effect the speed measurement. 14.4 Cosine/Angular Effect The hand-held laser will only record the true speed if it is directed along the path of the target vehicle. The vehicle may be either approaching or receding. If the laser is positioned at an angle to the path of the target vehicle, the displayed speed is less than its actual speed. This reduction in speed is proportional to the cosine of the angle. The angular effect or cosine error is always in favour of the target vehicle,
© ACPO 2003 Version 2.1 Page 66 of 97
Code of practice for operational use of enforcement equipment
whether the device is operated in the horizontal or vertical plane. When operating hand-held devices from the roadside the operator should be within 10 feet of the edge of the carriageway and beyond the minimum operating range (i.e. 50 feet). When operating hand-held devices from an overbridge, the operator must stand where possible over the centre of the carriageway being checked. In respect of minimum range, the operator must carry out a height check from the level of operation to the road surface directly below then multiply this by a factor of ten. This figure becomes the minimum distance for operation. Health and Safety. Never point a laser speedmeter at a civil or military aircraft, vessel or armoured vehicle. Many military aircraft, vehicles or vessels have target acquisition detectors, some of which can initiate automatic counter measures.
Tafia said:
Odd; didn't I read that the ACPO guidelines state that any cop with a laser gun and patrol car must be standing clear of the vehicle and in full view of the target vehicle and the public? Was he sitting in the car?
In our Force area, some of us sit in the car with the door/window open, IE parked on a slip road etc etc.
The one thing we never do is use it through a closed window. Not a problem with everything else.
Tafia said:
Odd; didn't I read that the ACPO guidelines state that any cop with a laser gun and patrol car must be standing clear of the vehicle and in full view of the target vehicle and the public? Was he sitting in the car?
He had parked at the end of a row of parked cars and vans and was standing infront of his vehicle (4X4 Ford thingemmybob) and was pointing it (the laser thing) at an angle across the bonnet at the oncoming traffic - i spotted him quite easily - i was driving a truck so sitting high up I had a good view of the road ahead - traffic overtaking me would not have spotted him until too late.
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