"We want more cameras"
Discussion
The numbers of safety camera partnerships, Gatsos, Truvelos and SPECS will continue while people keep asking for them..
West Yorkshire's Safety Camera Partnership states:
You might be surprised at how many concerned individuals, community groups and neighbourhood representatives contact us every month to ask if we can help improve local conditions by setting up safety cameras.
In all cases, we will see if the roads concerned meet the Government's criteria for the installation of fixed or mobile cameras. If they don't, there may be other engineering-based solutions that we can offer. Or we can put people in touch with useful organisations.
We are concerned to hear from anyone with a view on speed control safety cameras and road safety. It is only with consensus that we can move forward in reducing road deaths and injuries. If you disagree with what we're trying to achieve, it does matter to us and we must find a way to debate the issues fully. That is what we are trying to do with the information we issue and that we display on our website.
Street
West Yorkshire's Safety Camera Partnership states:
You might be surprised at how many concerned individuals, community groups and neighbourhood representatives contact us every month to ask if we can help improve local conditions by setting up safety cameras.
In all cases, we will see if the roads concerned meet the Government's criteria for the installation of fixed or mobile cameras. If they don't, there may be other engineering-based solutions that we can offer. Or we can put people in touch with useful organisations.
We are concerned to hear from anyone with a view on speed control safety cameras and road safety. It is only with consensus that we can move forward in reducing road deaths and injuries. If you disagree with what we're trying to achieve, it does matter to us and we must find a way to debate the issues fully. That is what we are trying to do with the information we issue and that we display on our website.
Street
I think it only matters to them since it became so steamingly obvious that the bloody things were quite so unpopular.
After all - if the proles just keep tearing them down when they get put up it costs money to replace them.
I also am deeply suspicious of the motives of individuals requesting cameras...although I do believe that there are people who really do want them.
Why exactly do they want the camera? If there had been accidents there would already be one there. If the site met the critera surely in an attempt to maximise revenue the partnerships would already have installed one!
So it's not likely to be prangs.
More likely its that the complainers want to exact some revenge on the motorists near them for some reason. Perhaps the noise. Maybe its difficult to cross the road and there's no justification for a crossing (these are *really* hard to justify!). It may simply be a case of NIMBYism.
I've been to council meetings where the "justifications" for traffic calming, cameras and new lower speed limits were utterly spurious and based on nothing but prejudice - no scientific basis at all!
After all - if the proles just keep tearing them down when they get put up it costs money to replace them.
I also am deeply suspicious of the motives of individuals requesting cameras...although I do believe that there are people who really do want them.
Why exactly do they want the camera? If there had been accidents there would already be one there. If the site met the critera surely in an attempt to maximise revenue the partnerships would already have installed one!
So it's not likely to be prangs.
More likely its that the complainers want to exact some revenge on the motorists near them for some reason. Perhaps the noise. Maybe its difficult to cross the road and there's no justification for a crossing (these are *really* hard to justify!). It may simply be a case of NIMBYism.
I've been to council meetings where the "justifications" for traffic calming, cameras and new lower speed limits were utterly spurious and based on nothing but prejudice - no scientific basis at all!
Hmms - and they will be first to complain when they get nicked by them
But then again - should someone not tell these "concerned neighbourhoods" that they do indeed qualify - and the speed cam should have been sited in their are in the first place - but that their area is not very lucrative as it would serve to fine and penalise themselves a couple of times whenever they blip over by small margin.
So much better
to put the scam where it earns the mostest, and fulfils a lip service to "doing something" when in reality - they should be promoting COAST. Shall write to them again pointing this out 
>> Edited by WildCat on Thursday 14th October 12:05
Scamerati said:
You might be surprised at how many concerned individuals, community groups and neighbourhood representatives contact us every month to ask if we can help improve local conditions by setting up safety cameras.
I'm not surprised that everyone wants a magic accident reducing machine.
I'm not surprised that the scamerati claim to be offering magic accident reducing machines.
I'm not surprised that significant numbers of the public believe that there's such a thing as a magic accident reducing machine.
So all in all, it's a great shame that there's no such thing as a magic accident reducing machine.
I'm afraid in my coreespondence with the person in charge of West yorks scameras(Hello Philip), I did not feel he took any note of my concerns and objections regarding his "Scameras". He merely sent out pre-prepared emails in response to my reasonable questions. I was also warned by other PH'ers that in the past he has also passed on email addresses to "spammers" in order to get them off his back. Not exactly the person you would want in charge!
member of public: i want a speed camera at an accident blackspot.
authorative institution: but that won't make money and pay for itself, so lets put one on a busy road where people travel in thousands at 35 to 40 mph in a 30 zone where there was a serious accident in 1918 when mr smith was hit at 20mph and broke both legs, we have the excuse lets use it.
Just because people request speed cameras doesn't mean they get the ones they want.
authorative institution: but that won't make money and pay for itself, so lets put one on a busy road where people travel in thousands at 35 to 40 mph in a 30 zone where there was a serious accident in 1918 when mr smith was hit at 20mph and broke both legs, we have the excuse lets use it.
Just because people request speed cameras doesn't mean they get the ones they want.
Dibble said:
...it's a great shame that there's no such thing as a magic accident reducing machine.
Yes there is. Me. And other TrafPol.
Standing by to get flamed for such huge arrogance. But surely I'm better than complete automation?
No Dib, it's not arrogance, I would wholeheartedly agree with you, as long as you don't spend most of your shift hitting speeders with FPs.
This is all the more reason why you and your colleagues should be kicking up hell about cameras; they're making you redundant!
Dibble said:
...it's a great shame that there's no such thing as a magic accident reducing machine.
Yes there is. Me. And other TrafPol.
Standing by to get flamed for such huge arrogance. But surely I'm better than complete automation?
Of course you are Liebchen!
You are the one who explains why as well, and offers advice.
We want you lot on the roads and not great forests of useless tins...... and we do not really need talivans either.
Drivers see cop car and majority automatically concentrate on the road properly - because despite what you perceive, the greater majority actually respect the police.... and speed cams are now beginning to compromise this ...
Streetcop said:
The numbers of safety camera partnerships, Gatsos, Truvelos and SPECS will continue while people keep asking for them..
West Yorkshire's Safety Camera Partnership states:
You might be surprised at how many concerned individuals, community groups and neighbourhood representatives contact us every month to ask if we can help improve local conditions by setting up safety cameras.
Typical "safety" camera meaningless bullshit. "You might be suprised"? So, how many is it? I might be suprised that it's none at all.
Dibble said:
...it's a great shame that there's no such thing as a magic accident reducing machine.
Yes there is. Me. And other TrafPol.
Standing by to get flamed for such huge arrogance. But surely I'm better than complete automation?
Dibble.
I agree 100%. The key thing, for me anyway, in trying to change driver behaviour is to have much more TrafPol. Personally, I have no prolem with many more unmarked cars on the road. AS LONG AS, they target driving which is safety related and not just illegal.
While numties keep being told that speed is teh only cause of accidents they will believe it.
And they will continue to belive they dont have to be aware of whats around them becuase "they are not speeding so they are safe"
it dosnt suprise me that some people ask for speed camera's they are being fed bullshit and most people are busybodies who just like jumping on bandwagons
And they will continue to belive they dont have to be aware of whats around them becuase "they are not speeding so they are safe"
it dosnt suprise me that some people ask for speed camera's they are being fed bullshit and most people are busybodies who just like jumping on bandwagons
I want more traffic police...
...employed by the constabularies;
...patrolling the roads (yes, even in unmarked's);
...stopping people for offences other than speeding;
...generally doing anything other than manning static speed traps (SCP vans or hand-helds)
In other words, doing what they're supposed to and INCREASING road safety. Not saying that obvious speeders aren't a danger, but that flesh-and-blood coppers, when free of political orders, can a lot better decide what is actually dangerous than can an inanimate box, and, more importantly, can "prioritise" (e.g. laden, old, smoky Transit tailgating at 75mph, vs modern rep-mobile at 90mph leaving large gaps)
But that's an expensive solution which would tear apart a lot of very successful quango's, whose members will fight that suggestion to the bitter end just to preserve their jobs, regardless of the "right" answer to the problem.
I WANT COPS, NOT BOXES. And I WILL pay more tax if someone promises we'll get them (and promises to tear down the inappropriate "boxes").
...employed by the constabularies;
...patrolling the roads (yes, even in unmarked's);
...stopping people for offences other than speeding;
...generally doing anything other than manning static speed traps (SCP vans or hand-helds)
In other words, doing what they're supposed to and INCREASING road safety. Not saying that obvious speeders aren't a danger, but that flesh-and-blood coppers, when free of political orders, can a lot better decide what is actually dangerous than can an inanimate box, and, more importantly, can "prioritise" (e.g. laden, old, smoky Transit tailgating at 75mph, vs modern rep-mobile at 90mph leaving large gaps)
But that's an expensive solution which would tear apart a lot of very successful quango's, whose members will fight that suggestion to the bitter end just to preserve their jobs, regardless of the "right" answer to the problem.
I WANT COPS, NOT BOXES. And I WILL pay more tax if someone promises we'll get them (and promises to tear down the inappropriate "boxes").
Let me describe what the vast majority of motorists (those that have no convictions, points anything, the ones that have been driving for "donkeys years") do when they see a camera. I have witnessed this many times as a passenger and observer.
Despite travelling at or below the speed limit shown, they spot the camera, their attention is immediately diverted from the road, they brake without warning, looking at their speedometer constantly shifting between speedo and camera as they drive past, then looking in their mirror to see if it flashes after driving past.
As I say I have witnessed this and it's because these normally safe drivers and totally safe before camera's were installed are scared of getting any kind of criminal record or fine in a completely unblemished driving life.
I wonder how many cameras have caught rear-ender shunts when the first car brakes without warning........oh, of course they won't because they wouldn't have been going above the limit in the first place
I see no point to camera's even outside schools as everyone who's got a brain watches their speed in these areas, anyone who doesn't would still drive though too fast even if there was a camera there because they have no observation skills anyway.
As for dangerous junctions/bends etc.... if the highways authority actually cuts the grass regularly, makes hedge & road adjustments for better visibility for junctions on corners, installs proper roadsigns warning of what's ahead then this will cut the deaths far more effectively than a camera.
Despite travelling at or below the speed limit shown, they spot the camera, their attention is immediately diverted from the road, they brake without warning, looking at their speedometer constantly shifting between speedo and camera as they drive past, then looking in their mirror to see if it flashes after driving past.
As I say I have witnessed this and it's because these normally safe drivers and totally safe before camera's were installed are scared of getting any kind of criminal record or fine in a completely unblemished driving life.
I wonder how many cameras have caught rear-ender shunts when the first car brakes without warning........oh, of course they won't because they wouldn't have been going above the limit in the first place
I see no point to camera's even outside schools as everyone who's got a brain watches their speed in these areas, anyone who doesn't would still drive though too fast even if there was a camera there because they have no observation skills anyway.
As for dangerous junctions/bends etc.... if the highways authority actually cuts the grass regularly, makes hedge & road adjustments for better visibility for junctions on corners, installs proper roadsigns warning of what's ahead then this will cut the deaths far more effectively than a camera.
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