speed-limits increased
Discussion
Right, after my slightly inaccurate topic title im all for increasing the speed limits on the motorways, and as mentioned in another thread, the other limits for urban areas should hold.
However dont you think that if the speed limits were increased to say 85, everyone would have a even bigger excuse to do 100, cos thats only 15 over the limit.... if you get caught at the moment doing 100 its sh*t hits the fan time.
Your comment matches that made by many of our wonderful public servants who set the limits, whereas there is a whole raft of evidence that indicates that drivers drive to the conditions, not the number on a tin plate. Hence the oft-ignored 85th percentile speed used to set limits.
If the limit were raised as you suggest, I doubt there would be much effect. My 406 will cruise at 100 but I much prefer to cruise at 80-85 for longer distances as that suits me and the car. I'm sure that applies to many other cars/drivers as well. I did once have to get from Nuremburg to Munich in a hurry so as not to miss my plane, which meant having to cruise my Avis Mercedes at 120mph. Although our German friends are more used to cars travelling at higher speeds on their autobahnen, it was plain hard work to drive at that speed. (Ok, the car wasn't brilliant) I wouldn't do it again although it was legal.
If the limit were raised as you suggest, I doubt there would be much effect. My 406 will cruise at 100 but I much prefer to cruise at 80-85 for longer distances as that suits me and the car. I'm sure that applies to many other cars/drivers as well. I did once have to get from Nuremburg to Munich in a hurry so as not to miss my plane, which meant having to cruise my Avis Mercedes at 120mph. Although our German friends are more used to cars travelling at higher speeds on their autobahnen, it was plain hard work to drive at that speed. (Ok, the car wasn't brilliant) I wouldn't do it again although it was legal.
I remember this debate took place at one of the first meetings of the ABD. It went along the lines that 80 or 90 was to be one of the ABD goals. Someone pointed out that the target needed to be more specific say 85. Its and old problem particularly when dealing with a mixture of ordinary politicians and the generally insane greenies who want a 10 mph blanket speed limit.
Perhaps the solution is to campaign for no speed limit on appropriate sections?
Perhaps the solution is to campaign for no speed limit on appropriate sections?
quote:
Perhaps the solution is to campaign for no speed limit on appropriate sections?
Unfortunately this is less likely as even in Germany (home of the fast road for many) a lot of areas are now setting motorway speed limits (I think 100mph)
And especially with this Govt..
I would be quite happy with a 100mph limit over here, and I personally am quite happy at 80-90mph (conditions permitting)
quote:
Unfortunately this is less likely as even in Germany (home of the fast road for many) a lot of areas are now setting motorway speed limits (I think 100mph)
And especially with this Govt..
I would be quite happy with a 100mph limit over here, and I personally am quite happy at 80-90mph (conditions permitting)
So would I, the problem is if you write to your MP and say so along with the entire motoring public, what you will get is a negotiated compromise. Hence the fuel protest failed because it should have requested zero tax on fuel and continued till rioting for food kicked in. If you ask for 80mph you get 75. If you demand no limit you might get 100 and leave us all smiling.
The Germans are not subject to the same medieval attitudes from the govt as we are. As we head toward a republic I am optimistic that the changes will suprise us.
I don't see how ditching the Royal Family will make any difference - are they still setting Government policy then? We have a Presidential type oligarchy at the moment, and President Blair is far too keen to be seen as soft, cuddly and caring to allow higher speed limits on any roads - his constituency is the chattering classes of Olde Englande, with their remnants of late 60's hippy ideology - do you really think we have a democratic process to our system of government?? 
quote:
I don't see how ditching the Royal Family will make any difference - are they still setting Government policy then? We have a Presidential type oligarchy at the moment, and President Blair is far too keen to be seen as soft, cuddly and caring to allow higher speed limits on any roads - his constituency is the chattering classes of Olde Englande, with their remnants of late 60's hippy ideology - do you really think we have a democratic process to our system of government??
Errr I think we just ditched them, no they don't set policy, errrr yes Blair is c**t and no we dont have a democracy
I was alluding to the notion that we are being dragged kicking ad screaming into the 21st century European state and all of the above mentioned tossers will become less and less relavent. 
What a great idea, why dont we adopt a european speeding law, that way we can almost do what we want.
Great idea about the Isle of man registered vehicles that was mentioned in another thread...ok the gatso cant touch you, cos they only got the reg plate to identify you but what about plod in trafic car after pulling you....im sure that they will say "this car is IOM registered you got UK licence so go away with these 3 points" after all its you they want not the car.
Anybody got a car registered in IOM and driving on UK licence? Have you got points from being pulled by plod v's Gatsos???
Great idea about the Isle of man registered vehicles that was mentioned in another thread...ok the gatso cant touch you, cos they only got the reg plate to identify you but what about plod in trafic car after pulling you....im sure that they will say "this car is IOM registered you got UK licence so go away with these 3 points" after all its you they want not the car.
Anybody got a car registered in IOM and driving on UK licence? Have you got points from being pulled by plod v's Gatsos???
I've read somewhere (could be on another thread) that Europe is considering a blanket speed limit, possibly 100mph or so. Even Germany will comply. All is not rosy over the pond either....
(I might think twice about buying that lightweight cellular speed blanket, then!!)
Edited by nubbin on Friday 4th January 10:26
(I might think twice about buying that lightweight cellular speed blanket, then!!)
Edited by nubbin on Friday 4th January 10:26
When was the 70mph limit set?
Surely braking technology and driver aids etc (I know this is a moot point to us TVR owners) have made it safer to travel at speeds higher than 70mph quite safely.
Its like braking distances, 315ft is quoted for 70mph in the highway code however my Viper could do it in about 100ft and a 911 Turbo can apparently do it in 70ft.
Why do road restrictions not evolve? Just a thought more than anything else really.
Matt.
Surely braking technology and driver aids etc (I know this is a moot point to us TVR owners) have made it safer to travel at speeds higher than 70mph quite safely.
Its like braking distances, 315ft is quoted for 70mph in the highway code however my Viper could do it in about 100ft and a 911 Turbo can apparently do it in 70ft.
Why do road restrictions not evolve? Just a thought more than anything else really.
Matt.
The problem is not one of all of us doing 100 mph, its that fact that if theres a limit of 100, all those people who can't drive (eg. 17 yr old in XR2) but think they can, will go charging round at 100 and then kill themselves and others..
we'd need a staged speed limit system with a 70mph test and a 100mph test perhaps...
Cheers
M@
we'd need a staged speed limit system with a 70mph test and a 100mph test perhaps...
Cheers
M@
The 70 mph limit was set in the late 50's, when there was a newpaper outcry when they found out Aston Martin were testing their le Mans cars on the M1 doing 170!! (I think that's right, but I can't quite rembember all the details).
If there were a 100mph motorway limit, I think I would still cruise along at 85-95, because it is still a comfortable speed. Over 100 and it requires a much higher level of concentration, which leads to tiredness. At least I wouldn't feel the need to constantly watch out for plod, and I would still drive at the speed limit in built up areas. The IOM idea of mandatory 30 in towns, and "go-for-it" elsewhere, is perfect, and would win the respect of most sensible motoring enthusiasts.
As for yoofs in their Corsa GSI's, they will do 100mph on a school playground if they get the chance, so will go nuts on motorways anyway...
Also, there's a psychological element to the 70 mph limit - it is exceeded so readily that it's ignored, and human beings are genetically designed as risk takers, and if presented with a "limit", will try to push the envelope of that limit. Make the envelope bigger, and less people will exceed it, because genetically determined risk-taking follows a 'bell-shaped' curve, with fewer and fewer people at the extremes. Cop that for an anthropological justification for raising speed limits!!
Edited by nubbin on Friday 4th January 11:17
If there were a 100mph motorway limit, I think I would still cruise along at 85-95, because it is still a comfortable speed. Over 100 and it requires a much higher level of concentration, which leads to tiredness. At least I wouldn't feel the need to constantly watch out for plod, and I would still drive at the speed limit in built up areas. The IOM idea of mandatory 30 in towns, and "go-for-it" elsewhere, is perfect, and would win the respect of most sensible motoring enthusiasts.
As for yoofs in their Corsa GSI's, they will do 100mph on a school playground if they get the chance, so will go nuts on motorways anyway...
Also, there's a psychological element to the 70 mph limit - it is exceeded so readily that it's ignored, and human beings are genetically designed as risk takers, and if presented with a "limit", will try to push the envelope of that limit. Make the envelope bigger, and less people will exceed it, because genetically determined risk-taking follows a 'bell-shaped' curve, with fewer and fewer people at the extremes. Cop that for an anthropological justification for raising speed limits!!
Edited by nubbin on Friday 4th January 11:17
quote:
The 70 mph limit was set in the late 50's, when there was a newpaper outcry when they found out Aston Martin were testing their le Mans cars on the M1 doing 170!! (I think that's right, but I can't quite rembember all the details).
AC used to claim that it was their tests of the Cobra that led to the (still officially temporary) 70mph speed limit. Further limits were imposed during the oil crisis to reduce fuel consumption. These were also supposedly temporary but seem to have stuck
Presumably if a blanket 100mph (160kmh surely) European limit was imposed we'd have to raise the limit here. Wouldn't that be a shame. Vive la Europe !
quote:
When was the 70mph limit set?
Surely braking technology and driver aids etc (I know this is a moot point to us TVR owners) have made it safer to travel at speeds higher than 70mph quite safely.
Its like braking distances, 315ft is quoted for 70mph in the highway code however my Viper could do it in about 100ft and a 911 Turbo can apparently do it in 70ft.
Why do road restrictions not evolve? Just a thought more than anything else really.
Matt.
That's assuming you're looking where you're going at the time. The laws need to take everyone into account and as much as we might thnk we're all great, some of us probably pay as little attention as that 17 year old in his XR2 or a housewife leaning over to tend to her screaming child. (Come on, who NEVER EVER uses their phone in the car or tunes the stereo?)
I think 70mph is enough unless they have different wet/bad weather and dry limits as they do in France. Most drivers do 85-90 and a lot of the time the police let it happen, only stopping those going even faster. Once the limit is raised to say 80mph everyone will get their calculator out ... 80mph plus 30mph add 10% (or whatever) and we'll all be travelling too fast - even in the fog/ice/heavy rain.
Also, if I'm driving along in my nice Porsche with ceramic brakes which stops from 100mph in 1 nanosecond what happens to the guy behind me in the Vectra? (and he may even be paying attention.) Reminds me of that Clarkson show where he went to India and they were explaining why they haven't introduced ABS and better brakes over there - one car would stop and all the rest would pile into it.
(Come on, who NEVER EVER uses their phone in the car or tunes the stereo?)
Me: I'm self employed and all my customers know that the phone is turned off or unanswered if I'm driving. My stereo if on (rarely) is tuned to one station that I listen to or cassettes which give me 45 mins of music each side very rare that my journeys are more than 45mins. I can change the tape without taking my eyes off the road as I know where the cassette player is by feel.
Most people fall into the less than 45 min journey. My previous car had no stereo fitted.
"I think 70mph is enough unless they have different wet/bad weather and dry limits as they do in France. Most drivers do 85-90 and a lot of the time the police let it happen, only stopping those going even faster."
Cameras do take your photo however at that speed even though conditions mean a performance car could go quite safely at that speed.
I agree that idiot drivers and white van drivers need some sort of guideline. The average familay car in the 50's would have a top speed of 100mph (with tail wind) and drove appallingly so most drivers would not do that kind of speed. I feel that an increase in the speed limit in accordance to the average familay cars performace is perfectly justified. A speed limit of 100mph IMHO is perfectly reasonable as most drivers now do 80mph as a standard. Myself, I wouldn't want to do more than 100mph on a long journey as it is too knackering having to watch for the morons pulling out in front of you.
Speed limits need to change as at the moment they are as antiquated as shopping on Sunday laws. One law I would like to see enforced with more vigore would be the middle lane hoggers that don't move to the left hand lane. Perhaps changing the speed limit would get them to move to the left or am I being too optimistic
Me: I'm self employed and all my customers know that the phone is turned off or unanswered if I'm driving. My stereo if on (rarely) is tuned to one station that I listen to or cassettes which give me 45 mins of music each side very rare that my journeys are more than 45mins. I can change the tape without taking my eyes off the road as I know where the cassette player is by feel.
Most people fall into the less than 45 min journey. My previous car had no stereo fitted.
"I think 70mph is enough unless they have different wet/bad weather and dry limits as they do in France. Most drivers do 85-90 and a lot of the time the police let it happen, only stopping those going even faster."
Cameras do take your photo however at that speed even though conditions mean a performance car could go quite safely at that speed.
I agree that idiot drivers and white van drivers need some sort of guideline. The average familay car in the 50's would have a top speed of 100mph (with tail wind) and drove appallingly so most drivers would not do that kind of speed. I feel that an increase in the speed limit in accordance to the average familay cars performace is perfectly justified. A speed limit of 100mph IMHO is perfectly reasonable as most drivers now do 80mph as a standard. Myself, I wouldn't want to do more than 100mph on a long journey as it is too knackering having to watch for the morons pulling out in front of you.
Speed limits need to change as at the moment they are as antiquated as shopping on Sunday laws. One law I would like to see enforced with more vigore would be the middle lane hoggers that don't move to the left hand lane. Perhaps changing the speed limit would get them to move to the left or am I being too optimistic
quote:
The problem is not one of all of us doing 100 mph, its that fact that if theres a limit of 100, all those people who can't drive (eg. 17 yr old in XR2) but think they can, will go charging round at 100 and then kill themselves and others..
M@
if they would only kill themselves, then I could live with it - natural selection
Rgds, WalterU
I think Stirling Moss suggested some years ago an excellent solution to the problem. He proposed a tiered driving licence based on power to weight ratio and a procedure for checking people out on thier new car. (A bit like a pilot when he changes plane).
This of course would all cost us money but I think it would be worth it.
This of course would all cost us money but I think it would be worth it.
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