Castle Combe Sat / Sun
Discussion
ca092003 said:
Streetcop
Care to provide a reference for this exemption?
Thanks
The exemption is as follows, from the ACPO guidelines;
Contravention of speed limits, keep left signs, solid white lines etc are permitted if adherance to such would hinder the use of the emergency vehicle. However, no circumstances can justify contravention of such laws, whether exempted or not, which would endanger other road users
So it's a case of BiB can contravene such laws, but should a collision occur, it would be BiB who had the justification to explain.
Street
AdamS said:
Why are bikers targeted for Race Cans when anyone can buy any exhaust they like for their car and its perfectly legal and the plod dont seem to give a damn. If its noise most of these Nova boys have far louder exhausts?
What is the justification?
Indeed. When I had the blitz fitted to the Four, I looked up the regs.
I could find nothing that actually specified an upper limit. It was mearly "excessivly" loud.
Now, that's subjective. So, I get pulled. Officer gives me a HORT or whatever it is that means get it fixed, get it tested and show me proof.
I take it to my MOT station, who are petrolheads. They check for leaks, decide the exhaust is in A1 condition and sounds great.
Repeat.
Streetcop said:
Streetcop said:
If anyone travels around there with race cans, small plates etc....they shouldn't be surprised by any action taken against them..
Street
See this is what pisses a lot of people off and in my opinion (for what it's worth)loses the police support.
Yes we all know that tinted visors, race cans and small plates etc are illegal, but lets be realistic, are they really such a high priority?
What about riders with bald tyres, no license, no insurance, stolen bikes etc, I'm sure if you targeted these people you would get far more support
The no licence, bald tyres, no insurance, stolen bike brigade aren't likely to be at such events. Of course, that's not 100% true, but not far off. Those individuals will also be targetted, like they always are.
As for the others...the point was it's common sense to expect BiB on the roads around the event in their 100s, so to travel with things illegal on your bike is 'asking to get pulled' as the chances of a stop normally might be negligable.
I'm totally against small plates and race cans and deal with them in the appropriate manner when stopped.
Street
Friend of mine just got hit by a no insurance,no tax,no MOT twat,gave false address.Friend goes to police station to report said incident,they not interested,tell him to inform his insurance co not to bother them
Streetcop said:
Just yet more ammo for the argument "because it is illegal does not mean it is dangerous, therefore should it still be illegal?"
What??????
Are you saying that motorcyclist should be allowed to disobey solid white lines....
There are far too many two wheeled deaths already, without giving them more reasons to end up in a box.
Street
Oh dear. We went through this at some length a few weeks ago and I came under fire for suggesting that it was not necessarily dangerous to contravene the double white line system. I stand by that view.
Exactly the same principle applies to:
Exceeding speed limits.
Using mobile phones while driving.
It appears that we are confusing legalities with the practicalities of safe driving.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
Streetcop said:
Streetcop
Care to provide a reference for this exemption?
Thanks
The exemption is as follows, from the ACPO guidelines;
Contravention of speed limits, keep left signs, solid white lines etc are permitted if adherance to such would hinder the use of the emergency vehicle. However, no circumstances can justify contravention of such laws, whether exempted or not, which would endanger other road users
So it's a case of BiB can contravene such laws, but should a collision occur, it would be BiB who had the justification to explain.
Street
Sorry, StreetCop, I should have been more specific. Can you provide a reference to the relevant Act of Parliament? Guidelines are fine, but they are not the law. Only the Act is the letter of the Law.
Streetcop said:
Just yet more ammo for the argument "because it is illegal does not mean it is dangerous, therefore should it still be illegal?"
What??????
Are you saying that motorcyclist should be allowed to disobey solid white lines....
There are far too many two wheeled deaths already, without giving them more reasons to end up in a box.
Street
What? Motorcyclists disobey solid white lines in the same way that vehicles that are being used for police purposes can?
ca092003 said:
Sorry, StreetCop, I should have been more specific. Can you provide a reference to the relevant Act of Parliament? Guidelines are fine, but they are not the law. Only the Act is the letter of the Law.
There isn't an act of parliament. The police can break the traffic laws in the event of an emergency, if to abide by them would hinder their progress. Like them being able to speed, or run red lights etc etc. All does swimmingly, until a collision, then the BiB will be in hot water and justification will have to be found.
Street
TripleS said:
Streetcop said:
gh0st said:
Just yet more ammo for the argument "because it is illegal does not mean it is dangerous, therefore should it still be illegal?"
What??????
Are you saying that motorcyclist should be allowed to disobey solid white lines....
There are far too many two wheeled deaths already, without giving them more reasons to end up in a box.
Street
Oh dear. We went through this at some length a few weeks ago and I came under fire for suggesting that it was not necessarily dangerous to contravene the double white line system. I stand by that view.
Exactly the same principle applies to:
Exceeding speed limits.
Using mobile phones while driving.
It appears that we are confusing legalities with the practicalities of safe driving.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
Every now and then I find myself in a situation on the bike where I can very safely make an overtaking manoevre across solid lines. Road markings are not determined by people who have the performance capabilities of a 150+ bhp motorcycle in mind.
However, if I choose to do this I know that I am breaking the law, and if I get caught doing it I will accept the punishment.
I have to say that of the bikes in the pic provided here by Streetcop, the front one appears to have completed the manoevre with a good sight line, well before the corner. I think the second bike (the one closest to the camera) has left a bit too much to chance though. Both are very guilty of not making sure there's no BiB behind them before breaking the law!
>> Edited by Mon Ami Mate on Tuesday 28th September 09:06
Mon Ami Mate said:
Every now and then I find myself in a situation on the bike where I can very safely make an overtaking manoevre across solid lines. Road markings are not determined by people who have the performance capabilities of a 150+ bhp motorcycle in mind.
However, if I choose to do this I know that I am breaking the law, and if I get caught doing it I will accept the punishment and not argue.
Yep...I find myself in the same spot regularly and know one road that has solid white lines and a clear view ahead...but I don't as it's a law which I just can't bring myself to break.
Street
The double white line system is a set standard that 90% of the time is correct, the same system throughout euroland too.
However recently where camera partnerships are targetting truckers on A roads exceeding the 40mph rule they are putting blanket double white line to deter overtaking. Northamptonshire springs to mind.
This means the trust in the system is being eaten away as any trained driver can see it's safe to pass. But legally its not. This is starting to erode the whole concept of reliance on the road markings.
However recently where camera partnerships are targetting truckers on A roads exceeding the 40mph rule they are putting blanket double white line to deter overtaking. Northamptonshire springs to mind.
This means the trust in the system is being eaten away as any trained driver can see it's safe to pass. But legally its not. This is starting to erode the whole concept of reliance on the road markings.
cptsideways said:
The double white line system is a set standard that 90% of the time is correct, the same system throughout euroland too.
However recently where camera partnerships are targetting truckers on A roads exceeding the 40mph rule they are putting blanket double white line to deter overtaking. Northamptonshire springs to mind.
This means the trust in the system is being eaten away as any trained driver can see it's safe to pass. But legally its not. This is starting to erode the whole concept of reliance on the road markings.
If you cry wolf enough people start to ignore you! And that is a problem we are starting to face today, as more and more roads become double white lines people in their frustrations start to overtake in places where they wouldn't normally in order to make safe and legal progress.
Streetcop said:
Sorry, StreetCop, I should have been more specific. Can you provide a reference to the relevant Act of Parliament? Guidelines are fine, but they are not the law. Only the Act is the letter of the Law.
There isn't an act of parliament. The police can break the traffic laws in the event of an emergency, if to abide by them would hinder their progress. Like them being able to speed, or run red lights etc etc. All does swimmingly, until a collision, then the BiB will be in hot water and justification will have to be found.
Street
Streetcop
What about the Road Traffic Act 1988? This explicity states that vehicles used for police purposes are exempt from speed limits. I have not been able to find such an exemption for the same vehicles to permit them to cross solid white lines. I suspect that there is no such exemption.
If there is or isn't such dispensation from the pope, who polices the police? That vid still looks familiar, not sure if it's the same (or just similar) to one from a PePiPoo case. I think that one had a successful outcome - for the biker - and the issue of a following police vehicle also crossing the solid line was deemed highly relevant.
Streetcop said:
There is an exemption in the respect that the officer performing the action won't be prosecuted if no accident occurs....Same with contravention of red lights, stop signs..
Street
What definitive source do you claim for that position?
If it is not in the relevant Act of Parliament then I cannot see how it is anything other an aspiration.
I've done answering your questions on that subject now....
What remains to be said is this...
If on an emergency run, a BiB crosses a solid white line, another BiB wont report him, his bosses wont report him and any complaint by the public wont be taken as a complaint.
If that BiB hits another car during a solid white line overtake, the BiB runs the risk of being done for due care or dangerous driving...
The End.
Street
What remains to be said is this...
If on an emergency run, a BiB crosses a solid white line, another BiB wont report him, his bosses wont report him and any complaint by the public wont be taken as a complaint.
If that BiB hits another car during a solid white line overtake, the BiB runs the risk of being done for due care or dangerous driving...
The End.
Street
Streetcop said:
I've done answering your questions on that subject now....
What remains to be said is this...
If on an emergency run, a BiB crosses a solid white line, another BiB wont report him, his bosses wont report him and any complaint by the public wont be taken as a complaint.
If that BiB hits another car during a solid white line overtake, the BiB runs the risk of being done for due care or dangerous driving...
The End.
Street
Clearly, there isn't an exemption.(Believe me, I've looked for one.) I do accept that there is an exemption for *some* activities (i.e. exceeding speed limit)
I googled and found this:
www.bespokedrivertraining.co.uk/response_legislation.htm
So at least another organisation seems to be of the opinion that there are no exemptions for certain activities.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff