Discussion
...and it's not just the level of grip!
About six months ago I needed two new back tyres on my BMW 328. However I had the car up for sale at the time so was reluctant to shell out £300 to directly replace the (excellent) Michelin Pilots that were on the car at the time.
So I had a chat with a couple of tyre suppliers to choose a suitable "budget" tyre that would still be up to handling the performance of the car. I won't say the name of the tyre I bought, but suffice it to say it was a "known" brand, priced approximately midway between the cheapo ones and the Michelins.
With those fitted the car was scary! There was still a good amount of grip, but despite having the same speed rating I reached the conclusion that the cheaper tyres weren't as stiff in the sidewall. With them fitted to the back of the car the effect was that any steering input now produced instability, and the faster you went the worse it got. Steering was initially very dead, then suddenly the car turned in more than you expected so you had to get the lock back off quick. Just changing lanes at 70mph required you to correct two or three times to get the car straight again!
I played around with the tyre pressures but to no avail. In the end I came up with my theory about sidewall stiffness and swapped the tyres onto the front. Now the car was much more predictable, though the previously sharp steering was now much more imprecise and "mushy".
Now it may well have been that a set of 4 of these tyres would have been fine, but the mixture of two of these plus two "premium" tyres was disastrous!
Apart from anything else, I can certainly understand why people say they'd rather have a front tyre blow out than a rear!
About six months ago I needed two new back tyres on my BMW 328. However I had the car up for sale at the time so was reluctant to shell out £300 to directly replace the (excellent) Michelin Pilots that were on the car at the time.
So I had a chat with a couple of tyre suppliers to choose a suitable "budget" tyre that would still be up to handling the performance of the car. I won't say the name of the tyre I bought, but suffice it to say it was a "known" brand, priced approximately midway between the cheapo ones and the Michelins.
With those fitted the car was scary! There was still a good amount of grip, but despite having the same speed rating I reached the conclusion that the cheaper tyres weren't as stiff in the sidewall. With them fitted to the back of the car the effect was that any steering input now produced instability, and the faster you went the worse it got. Steering was initially very dead, then suddenly the car turned in more than you expected so you had to get the lock back off quick. Just changing lanes at 70mph required you to correct two or three times to get the car straight again!
I played around with the tyre pressures but to no avail. In the end I came up with my theory about sidewall stiffness and swapped the tyres onto the front. Now the car was much more predictable, though the previously sharp steering was now much more imprecise and "mushy".
Now it may well have been that a set of 4 of these tyres would have been fine, but the mixture of two of these plus two "premium" tyres was disastrous!
Apart from anything else, I can certainly understand why people say they'd rather have a front tyre blow out than a rear!
r32 said:
Interesting topic. As I have a company car the leasing company pays for the tyres. I recently thought they were looking a bit worn, so took the car to have them checked.
Fronts were down to 1.7mm & 1.8mm - yet when the tyre company rang the leasing company - they said they wouldnt replace them until they were down to 1.6mm.
So if i went on a long trip and the tyres went below 1.6 - i assume i would still be to blame!!??
p.s. 5 minutes after having the tyres checked i was back to have them checked again, and amazingly they were at 1.6mm
Yes can confirm that some leasing companies have a very strange attitude to tyre replacement, after all it's not their lives or licences.
At one time it got so bad that some chains, eg Kwak-Pharte wouldn't even ring them unless the wear indicator bars were level with the tyre surface. By my reckoning at that point the tyre has already been illegal for some distance.
Anyone that took that attitude with our fleet is no longer a supplier. It's better today, still some cheapskates about though.
Totally endorse what Iolaire says re Continental, Dunlop and :shudder: remoulds. Having said that there are a set of OEM fit Firestones on Madame's Fabia which seem to hang on in all conditions very well, giving good feedback and wearing quite well so far. F590s which are a budget tyre, fairly impressed so far, but low powered car admittedly.
Whatever the remould manufacturer says about how they check the carcasses it's not enough. Plus matched carcasses are impossible to achieve. Just not worth it.
FiF
>> Edited by Flat in Fifth on Tuesday 28th September 09:46
Surely its better to fit a "budget" tyre with full grip than run on an illegal or nearly illegal "premium". I've also heard that many of the budget tyres use "last years" premium tyre designs, apparently the big boy sell them off as each new generation is launched.
I would assume the BiB would treat a tyre offence as it is presented, eg obviously bald for a long time 3 points. Just gone below the limit get it sorted (or the offical name for it).
I've always liked pirelli but the michellins on the car at the moment seem pretty good.
I would assume the BiB would treat a tyre offence as it is presented, eg obviously bald for a long time 3 points. Just gone below the limit get it sorted (or the offical name for it).
I've always liked pirelli but the michellins on the car at the moment seem pretty good.
ben_london said:
Well I have......
Continental Low Profile Sports on mine I believe, about £70 each, is that cheap and nasty?? I fully admit to not having a clue about tyres.
Not a clue about tyres?
Peep at this:
www.tyresave.co.uk/tyreinfo.html
Good huh? And not far from me.........
turbobloke said:
If you're driving a standard everyday car and don't look like you're good for a soakin you'll probably get a vehicle defect rectification notice. If you're driving a car that's perceived to be flash you'll probably get £1000 per tyre fine and 3 points (per tyre also, IIRC).
The way that I and others Trafpols work is as follows.
I never give out VDRS.....its either a warning or prosecution, regardless of the type of car.
In the example, if it was 2 dodgy tyres, i would give an endorsable ticket for 1 and verbally warn for the other.
However, if there were more defects, i would prosecute and PG9.
This is how it is in the real world......never mess around with tyres but i do believe that you have to be firm but most of all, very fair.
Tonyrec said:
If you're driving a standard everyday car and don't look like you're good for a soakin you'll probably get a vehicle defect rectification notice. If you're driving a car that's perceived to be flash you'll probably get £1000 per tyre fine and 3 points (per tyre also, IIRC).
The way that I and others Trafpols work is as follows.
I never give out VDRS.....its either a warning or prosecution, regardless of the type of car.
In the example, if it was 2 dodgy tyres, i would give an endorsable ticket for 1 and verbally warn for the other.
However, if there were more defects, i would prosecute and PG9.
This is how it is in the real world......never mess around with tyres but i do believe that you have to be firm but most of all, very fair.
tony, if its someone with a car which is in good order and the tyres have just gone over, would u really nick.,.? whats the point ? surely a nick is just a score card.
getting the tyres changed and proving it has been done, by presenting one self at the local police station must be enough ... However making that a policy rather than the whim/grace of the individual policeman is a no hoper.. That's where it sll falls down..
if the car is a general wreck and altogether dodgy, nick away..
rgds
bill
billhol999 said:
tony, if its someone with a car which is in good order and the tyres have just gone over, would u really nick.,.? whats the point ? surely a nick is just a score card.
Depends on what you mean by just gone over.
If they were borderline (51% illegal) then it would be a warning....as ive said, you have got to be fair.
From my point of view i would do as much writing for a VDRS as for say, a ticket.
Many years ago, everything i did was VDRS and when it comes to Tyres they would simply ' borrow a wheel'. dont laugh, it does go on.
However, if the tyres down to the Cord/Ply or the vehicle is a minicab etc then ive got no sympathy and certainly none would be given.
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