Sold a car with faulty thermostats - my rights?

[JM]

TroubledSoul said:

Thanks guys.

I've had a hell of a day today and this has just been another layer of stress piled on.

I will speak to the AA warranty about the work and gather my options. From there I can decide what to do re: chase the dealer or whatever.

Thanks all.

It's nothing to do with your AA warranty.



Chase the dealer who sold you a faulty car.

[lbc]

TroubledSoul said:

Hi folks. My new (to me) E60 BMW 535d has knackered thermostats and doesn't get up to full operating temp when on the move.

Have you owned a diesel before?

Diesel engines do take a long time to warm up, several miles usually.

Are you looking for a problem that does not exist?

[valais]

lbc said:

Have you owned a diesel before?

Diesel engines do take a long time to warm up, several miles usually.

Are you looking for a problem that does not exist?

This is a good point. Big engine, big block, can take a while to get to temp.

[Roo]

If the fault is that obvious, and one of which you have prior knowledge, did it not show up on the test drive?

Given it's a problem you know of did you not then check for it on the test drive?

[TroubledSoul]

I didn't check, no. I asked him in advance and took it at face value as I couldn't remember how to access the hidden menu to check the temp.

I tested it on a 24 mile commute. This is my 2nd BMW diesel.

[lbc]

valais said:

This is a good point. Big engine, big block, can take a while to get to temp.

And as we approach winter, it is only going to get worse for a diesel with warm up times.

Fuel consumption on a diesel also increases big time in very cold weather as they never warm up properly.

[4rephill]

As some others have posted, the selling dealer has to be given the opportunity to fix the problem and the customer does not get to dictate where the work is carried out.

The dealer does not have to use a BMW Dealership or even a BMW specialist garage. If they want to, they can have the work carried out by "Joe Bloggs' back-street garage" if they wish. The only stipulation is that the repair must be carried out to the manufacturers standard.

[Roo]

TroubledSoul said:

I tested it on a 24 mile commute. This is my 2nd BMW diesel.

So there was nothing amiss when you test drove it.

[TroubledSoul]

Roo said:

So there was nothing amiss when you test drove it.

You misunderstand me. I tested the thermostats this morning on my 24 mile commute.

[Roo]

TroubledSoul said:

Roo said:

So there was nothing amiss when you test drove it.

You misunderstand me. I tested the thermostats this morning on my 24 mile commute.

So what happened when you test drove it?

[Davie_GLA]

You nerd to go to a good Indy. I had an e60 with the same issues. It's not a difficult job and can be done at a fifth of the quoted price. If you knew about the hidden menu you should have used it pre sale.

It really is no big deal.

[DrDeAtH]

Ok, just get it fixed at a trusted garage. Then move on with your life. It's a thermostat, they have moving parts, they fail eventually.


All this talk of suing the dealer is the new PH thing. For something this trivial, why bother.

[TroubledSoul]

DrDeAtH said:

Ok, just get it fixed at a trusted garage. Then move on with your life. It's a thermostat, they have moving parts, they fail eventually.


All this talk of suing the dealer is the new PH thing. For something this trivial, why bother.

I am not going to be suing the dealer

It's a bit extreme, isn't it?

I should have checked pre-sale and will likely just get it done myself. I'm just a bit miffed that he said it was all good. The problem I have is that he is going to fob me off repeatedly. He has even said if the warranty won't cover it then get the garage I use to claim for something else instead. Seriously, wtf?

I'm really not sure I can be bothered to fight over a couple of hundred quid, with the car not getting sorted until it is all resolved etc.

I've actually done this very job myself before. It's not particularly difficult and I expect the indy I have contacted to come back with a sub £300 quote.

[Swervin_Mervin]

Should have got an N52

[mercfunder]

So all in all a completely pointless thread.

Tales like this make me wonder why anyone would want to sell cars for a living.

[Noisy]

Parts are less than 100 quid for gen BMW items, shouldn't take much more than a couple of hours labour.

Is a common problem though and BMW's should get up to temperature on a run. I've seen cars that drop back down to 70 degrees once on the open road, that will lead to decreased fuel economy and potential dpf issues as stated by the OP.

[surveyor]

mercfunder said:

So all in all a completely pointless thread.

Tales like this make me wonder why anyone would want to sell cars for a living.

To be fair to the OP, the dealer is being shabby and if there is a fault, and he'd put his hand up and said sorry mate drop it back and I'll get it sorted there would not be a problem or a thread.

[ThunderSpook]

Not sure if this helps at all but I had the thermostats replaced on my E61 when I bought it. It was £216 inc vat from the BMW main dealer. You're getting ripped off at over £500.

[4rephill]

mercfunder said:

So all in all a completely pointless thread.

Tales like this make me wonder why anyone would want to sell cars for a living.

It's not really a pointless thread!

At least one person (the OP), has learnt that if you buy a car from a dealer and it develops a fault, you cannot simply take the car to the garage/Dealership of your choice, get the car fixed and then send the bill to the place where you bought it from!

(Unless of course, you see educating people as being pointless! )

[Blue Oval84]

DrDeAtH said:

Ok, just get it fixed at a trusted garage. Then move on with your life. It's a thermostat, they have moving parts, they fail eventually.


All this talk of suing the dealer is the new PH thing. For something this trivial, why bother.

Don't know if you had my post in mind or not, but I cut straight to the point earlier as these threads always go the same way, some people say that small faults are to be expected on a used car, some say SOGA is the equivalent of a gold-plated warranty which means it must be virtually perfect, and of course every opinion in between.

Rather than go through the usual rigmarole I thought I'd lay out that in my non-legal opinion, the only options anyone in OP's position has is-

1) Ask the dealer to put it right
2) If the above fails (or they offer an unsatisfactory suggestion to fix) then fix it yourself
2a) If you had to go with option 2 and believe you have a reasonable case under SOGA (and the dealer is still not playing ball) then you can launch an action to claim the money from them in court.

I laid it out clearly not because I believe in suing people, but because all of the talk on the internet in recent years has suggested that SOGA means everyone has a warranty. In actual fact all they really have is a stick to threaten someone with and, if this doesn't work, a legal means to launch an action against the dealer if they feel they have breached SOGA. It's up to a court to decide if they have or not and then award compensation accordingly.

I'm sure a legal bod can probably pull the above to bits, but as a layman, that's how I see it. I certainly don't buy into the belief that SOGA gives much protection for anything other than big problems quite simply because if I take a car back because the spring didgerydoo has failed in the flux capacitor and the dealer tells me to jog on, I can stand and shout "SOGA" across his pitch, but unless I actually sue him then there's not much going to happen!