RE: Driving licences at risk from state offensive
Discussion
cptsideways said:
The police state is upon us
Time to leave the country
My one way ferry ticket to the Replublic Of Ireland is sitting in front of me now - 11 days and counting and this will all be history for me.
I'm so saddend at the way this country is being run that I now want nothing more to do with it.
All of those left behind have me deepest sympathies.
best
Ex
article said:how exactly does any form of camera reduce careless, anti-social and dangerous driving?
....the fast-spreading rash of speed and traffic light cameras is only the start of an all-out onslaught on careless, anti-social and dangerous driving.....
article said:At 300k per cam
The older GATSO cameras, which require film and are not always switched on, are set to be replaced with far more sophisticated digital cameras that will operate 24 hours a day, seven days a week
, the government will ensure these will catch a lot of people so that they will get a decent return on their investment. www.fleetnewsnet.co.uk/news/view_article.asp?art_ID=35517
yet it is us who have to pay for these :rant:
The more laws you create, the more criminals you create, simple as.
When a scrote breaches an ASBO, s/he is tagged so they can be monitored to ensure they can't breach the peace. Normal people don't have them because they're not criminals and can be trusted without having taxpayers money spent on their surveillance.
Black boxes= motorist guilty until proven more guilty.
When a scrote breaches an ASBO, s/he is tagged so they can be monitored to ensure they can't breach the peace. Normal people don't have them because they're not criminals and can be trusted without having taxpayers money spent on their surveillance.
Black boxes= motorist guilty until proven more guilty.
"Police are to be allowed to access mobile phone records to check whether they were in use at the time a road traffic offence was committed"
So are they planning on making it an offende to use even a hands free phone, or are they just interesting in gathering the info in order to fabricate some more misleading statistics. How about some other "safety devices"
Sensors at points on the steering wheel to ensure both hands never leave the 10 to 2 position unless co-inciding with a gear change.
Additional sensors to monitor body temperature to ensure maximum revenue generation from newly introduced "driving whilst mildly under the weather" restrictions.
Weight sensors in seat to ensure no food or drink is consumed while driving.
etc etc.
Ultimately it is ineveitable that all cars will have transmitters sending out GPS information, allowing the state to know everthing about our driving habits. Speeding, illegal right turns, U turns all detectable immediately without the need for any cameras or police. Of course this has not been done before as it would probably contravene all Civil Liberty Laws. But all of these intermediate measures seem to be getting past these, and eventually the final step to 24/7 monitoring will be a very small one which yet again will go unchallenged.
So are they planning on making it an offende to use even a hands free phone, or are they just interesting in gathering the info in order to fabricate some more misleading statistics. How about some other "safety devices"
Sensors at points on the steering wheel to ensure both hands never leave the 10 to 2 position unless co-inciding with a gear change.
Additional sensors to monitor body temperature to ensure maximum revenue generation from newly introduced "driving whilst mildly under the weather" restrictions.
Weight sensors in seat to ensure no food or drink is consumed while driving.
etc etc.
Ultimately it is ineveitable that all cars will have transmitters sending out GPS information, allowing the state to know everthing about our driving habits. Speeding, illegal right turns, U turns all detectable immediately without the need for any cameras or police. Of course this has not been done before as it would probably contravene all Civil Liberty Laws. But all of these intermediate measures seem to be getting past these, and eventually the final step to 24/7 monitoring will be a very small one which yet again will go unchallenged.
andrews said:
It just makes me so angry, I think my rights are being abused and there seems to be no body prepared to stick up for the poor bloody motorist, black boxes, timing between two camera's etc it just feels all wrong, instead of all this technology being deployed to stop speeding why not use it to allow speeding with adaptive limits, if the sun is shining and the road is clear, then the limits should be adjusted accordingly, they already seem to do it on the M25.
It's nothing to do with the motorist, particularly.
The whole country is going this way.
It's just that the motoring/camera stuff is very prominent.
But vast areas of other stuff is being regulated, inspected and monitored out of sight. You just don't see it if you aren't working in it.
And it all generates statistics but does nothing.
It's like all those stats Streetcop posted a while back about various forces efficiency. I would bet my house there is no correlation with any real worthwhile data values.
You won't get the same sort of protest as you did with the Poll tax as the "organised protesters" (Unions, Socialists, ...) have been emasculated even further, and won't want to offend what friends they still have in the labour government.
So, because we're now a nation of sheep who are put to sleep each night by a steady diet of "Pap Idol", soaps, and inaccurate docu-dramas, we're going to take it until we squeak, and then some.
To paraphrase a modern messiah:- "Go back to sleep, Britain, your government is lying to you. Go back to sleep, Britain - here, have 57 more channels of reality TV."
Where did I put my passport...
So, because we're now a nation of sheep who are put to sleep each night by a steady diet of "Pap Idol", soaps, and inaccurate docu-dramas, we're going to take it until we squeak, and then some.
To paraphrase a modern messiah:- "Go back to sleep, Britain, your government is lying to you. Go back to sleep, Britain - here, have 57 more channels of reality TV."
Where did I put my passport...
Why is it that the liberal gobsh*tes spend so much time bleating avout the civil liberties of the truly criminal minded, whilst our powerless police use what little money they have to persecute normal people going about their business in order to generate more funds.
It is the criminally intent, money motivated parasitical human rights lawyers (please include Mrs Bleurgh!!! in this rant) who are all in favour of promoting the rights of the scum that throw fireworks/bricks/pet rabbits at passing cars (no joke, it has happened virtually outside my house-the police had no one to deal with it!!).
What about MY human rights!! Can I sue these imbeciles for breaching the human rights of my 2 year old daughter while she tries to sleep in her bedroom, or for the cost of collecting their fag packets/beer cans from my garden?
My grandad says that if he had known the way that this country was going to go, he would have told them to go stick fighting the Germans!! I have to say I can see his point.
ers!!
It is the criminally intent, money motivated parasitical human rights lawyers (please include Mrs Bleurgh!!! in this rant) who are all in favour of promoting the rights of the scum that throw fireworks/bricks/pet rabbits at passing cars (no joke, it has happened virtually outside my house-the police had no one to deal with it!!).
What about MY human rights!! Can I sue these imbeciles for breaching the human rights of my 2 year old daughter while she tries to sleep in her bedroom, or for the cost of collecting their fag packets/beer cans from my garden?
My grandad says that if he had known the way that this country was going to go, he would have told them to go stick fighting the Germans!! I have to say I can see his point.
ers!!The other night on Anglia News the Nofolk Police were showing off their new handheld cameras - normal digital ones.
So the attitude now is that police on the beat are now there to get to places that the fixed cameras can't get. Not to actually deal with the people commiting the crimes!
Anybody fancy starting a REAL POLICE force? We can create the courts (under the symbol of the kangaroo), government, hospitals, army, the lot.
Alternatively overrun a political party and takeover the forces we have and start using for what they joined up to do.
So the attitude now is that police on the beat are now there to get to places that the fixed cameras can't get. Not to actually deal with the people commiting the crimes!
Anybody fancy starting a REAL POLICE force? We can create the courts (under the symbol of the kangaroo), government, hospitals, army, the lot.
Alternatively overrun a political party and takeover the forces we have and start using for what they joined up to do.
andrews said:
This just p*sses me off so much. How can this attack on law abiding motorists be stopped........ It feels like we're moving to a state like singapore where dropping chewing gum will get you thrashed.
Just a point Andrews ... by exceeding the speed limit you are no longer a law abiding citizen. It doesn't matter whether you agree with the "rules" or not - break them and you are *NOT* a law abiding motorist.
Don't break the rules and you have nothing to worry about ...
... of course I'm saying nothing on how long it took even my scabby diesel boat to get to BTAP at the weekend.
We live in a country with rules - if we decide to step outside those rules (no matter how innappropriate they seem) then we put ourselves in a position of facing possible punishment. It is our own individual choice whether we feel that the possible punishment is worth the risk, a choice we make each time we take a journey.
Phil
Problem with the lentilists who think this stuff up is that they see motoring as a breach of their moral code, and therefore, if they dress it up in enough ideological bull and present it to a control-freak government who like extracting cash by stealth, they've got a perfect outlet. You mention civil liberties once and they'll wheel out a crash victim and bleat on about their civil liberties. We can't wheel anyone out, and then we lose.
Got to take the emotions and the ideological nonsense out of it, or else we'll end up in a state where everyone is treated like a criminal and has a criminal record without having done any crimes.
In a 'know your enemy' exercise, I read some of the Grauniad's 'ethical makeover' features. Basically in order to live an 'ethical' life you have to sacrifice just about everything you enjoy and everything that helps you to get by in life, all in the name of barely making any difference in the grand scheme of things and supposedly benefitting some people somewhere else in society, who you'll never actually meet, in no discernable way.
My worry is that these people will get into power and their pathetic way of life will become law.
>> Edited by v8thunder on Tuesday 9th November 15:57
and present it to a control-freak government who like extracting cash by stealth, they've got a perfect outlet. You mention civil liberties once and they'll wheel out a crash victim and bleat on about their civil liberties. We can't wheel anyone out, and then we lose. Got to take the emotions and the ideological nonsense out of it, or else we'll end up in a state where everyone is treated like a criminal and has a criminal record without having done any crimes.
In a 'know your enemy' exercise, I read some of the Grauniad's 'ethical makeover' features. Basically in order to live an 'ethical' life you have to sacrifice just about everything you enjoy and everything that helps you to get by in life, all in the name of barely making any difference in the grand scheme of things and supposedly benefitting some people somewhere else in society, who you'll never actually meet, in no discernable way.
My worry is that these people will get into power and their pathetic way of life will become law.
>> Edited by v8thunder on Tuesday 9th November 15:57
V8Thunder - just to play devils advocate, the opposite of what you propose - outright hedonism and not caring about anyone else in society - also has a few problems...it's called rampant capitalism coupled to a crime-wave (genuine crimes here, not lentilista crimes)!
Not proposing we all grow our own lentils, here, but I firmly believe that there DOES need to be state intervention in society, otherwise society ceases to exist.
The fact that our current state intervenes in completely the wrong ways does not detract from the above statement at all.
Not proposing we all grow our own lentils, here, but I firmly believe that there DOES need to be state intervention in society, otherwise society ceases to exist.
The fact that our current state intervenes in completely the wrong ways does not detract from the above statement at all.
CRB1 said:
I met a new client today. Nice old chap. 86 years and looks good for it. Probably fought in the war. But he could be a money launderer so he has to go and get a copy of his passport photo to prove that he isn't.
Chris (Chartered Accountant)
I had to go to my girlfriend's work (travel agents) to get my holiday money as she couldn't get it all without showing her passport. Suprisingly enough she never normally takes her passport to work
We should all remember that this is OUR country. Not the government's, not the police force's, but OUR country.
In the same way that the Poll Tax protests had a direct effect on government policy, we should perhaps consider the effect that protests would have against current proposed legislation (and current laws).
Lets not forget, 'motorists' aren't some separate species of human, they're just people, who use a motor vehicle in their everyday life. Getting behind the wheel of a car doesn't automatically make you somebody else.
If you don't like things like this, there are steps you can take:
1) www.faxyourmp.com (a very very good site)
2) organise peaceful protests
3) write letters to your local/national newspapers
4) start a website
5) contribute money to safespeed or pepipoo
Those are just 5 things I plucked from my head. I'm sure there are other methods available. Some people even go as far to destroy the fixed speed cameras - while I don't condone this course, I can understand it. If this government can waste £1 000 000 000 on a big white dome in London, then why should we be worried about the cost of replacing speed cameras to the taxpayer? At £300 000 per digital camera (so somebody else estimated), how many cameras would be destroyed before the powers that be decided it was far too expensive?
Risk and danger are part of life. Its how nature functions, you can't wrap people up in cotton, it just makes us all weaker, and evolution stops. If somebody is daft enough to cross the road without looking, and gets wiped out by a car doing 5mph over the limit, thats not an offense, its Darwinism.
In the same way that the Poll Tax protests had a direct effect on government policy, we should perhaps consider the effect that protests would have against current proposed legislation (and current laws).
Lets not forget, 'motorists' aren't some separate species of human, they're just people, who use a motor vehicle in their everyday life. Getting behind the wheel of a car doesn't automatically make you somebody else.
If you don't like things like this, there are steps you can take:
1) www.faxyourmp.com (a very very good site)
2) organise peaceful protests
3) write letters to your local/national newspapers
4) start a website
5) contribute money to safespeed or pepipoo
Those are just 5 things I plucked from my head. I'm sure there are other methods available. Some people even go as far to destroy the fixed speed cameras - while I don't condone this course, I can understand it. If this government can waste £1 000 000 000 on a big white dome in London, then why should we be worried about the cost of replacing speed cameras to the taxpayer? At £300 000 per digital camera (so somebody else estimated), how many cameras would be destroyed before the powers that be decided it was far too expensive?
Risk and danger are part of life. Its how nature functions, you can't wrap people up in cotton, it just makes us all weaker, and evolution stops. If somebody is daft enough to cross the road without looking, and gets wiped out by a car doing 5mph over the limit, thats not an offense, its Darwinism.
parrot of doom said:
We should all remember that this is OUR country. Not the government's, not the police force's, but OUR country.
In the same way that the Poll Tax protests had a direct effect on government policy, we should perhaps consider the effect that protests would have against current proposed legislation (and current laws).
Lets not forget, 'motorists' aren't some separate species of human, they're just people, who use a motor vehicle in their everyday life. Getting behind the wheel of a car doesn't automatically make you somebody else.
If you don't like things like this, there are steps you can take:
1) www.faxyourmp.com (a very very good site)
2) organise peaceful protests
3) write letters to your local/national newspapers
4) start a website
5) contribute money to safespeed or pepipoo
Those are just 5 things I plucked from my head. I'm sure there are other methods available. Some people even go as far to destroy the fixed speed cameras - while I don't condone this course, I can understand it. If this government can waste £1 000 000 000 on a big white dome in London, then why should we be worried about the cost of replacing speed cameras to the taxpayer? At £300 000 per digital camera (so somebody else estimated), how many cameras would be destroyed before the powers that be decided it was far too expensive?
Risk and danger are part of life. Its how nature functions, you can't wrap people up in cotton, it just makes us all weaker, and evolution stops. If somebody is daft enough to cross the road without looking, and gets wiped out by a car doing 5mph over the limit, thats not an offense, its Darwinism.
Absolutely spot on. I agree, the devolution of man.
Grouch.
havoc said:
V8Thunder - just to play devils advocate, the opposite of what you propose - outright hedonism and not caring about anyone else in society - also has a few problems...it's called rampant capitalism coupled to a crime-wave (genuine crimes here, not lentilista crimes)!
Not proposing we all grow our own lentils, here, but I firmly believe that there DOES need to be state intervention in society, otherwise society ceases to exist.
The fact that our current state intervenes in completely the wrong ways does not detract from the above statement at all.
Not quite what I meant - state intervention is necessary, but it must be politically unbiased when it does so, with eyes firmly on the facts and nothing else.
Why should the "in the main" law abiding motorist care to even BE law abiding anymore when the cops cant be bothered to deal with REAL crime as defined by the public, ie robbery, burglary, muggings, criminal damage, yobbery, rape, murder?
All it seems the cops are really bothered about now is meeting the targets set for them (go out joe and nick me 120 speeders) etc, not go out joe and nick me 120 burglars, car theives or insurance fraudsters.
Nah, theyre more interested in sitting their portly butts in the back of a van pointing lasers and pulling in the overtime than dealing with PROPER CRIMINALS!!!!!!
Well if you treat us like criminals then we may as welling act like criminals!!!!
You have been warned. Either pull yourselves together or quit. Cos the simple facts are these: We dont want a police "service" we want a FORCE. We want a force to deal with the hardened criminals and scum that make our lives a bloody nightmare.
We dont want fat cops sitting in vans getting fatter while pointing lasers at us just to meet some pin-prick pencil pusher's "targets" and making light of "overtime" issues.
If you cops that are reading this are a part of the "target meeting" fraternity, and you dont agree with the direction its going, but havent got the balls to tell your superiors where to get off, then leave theing force! Its that bloody simple, cos youre sweet all use to anyone!
Why am i so angry today? Cos im sick and tired of having to do the cops JOB for em!
Im tired of running the scum bags "outa dodge" on my own. Im tired of phoning the cops for "assistance" to be told " im sorry, we havent got anyone available to deal with such a minor offence"....(theft from cars).
An insight into the Cops abilities to "detect" a crime.
A few weeks ago, i was awoken in the early hours of the morning by the sound of footsteps.(mark 1 earhole)
Two scrotes doing their early morning "shopping" as it happens.(mark 1 eyeball)
So, im out the house and have a spotlight on me, watching them to see where they go.
Up the street and theyre about to make a move on someones car when up the street comes a taxi, so they duck outa sight.
From off in the distance comes the sound of the police chopper (probably doing a speed check on someone) but unrelated to the 2 scrotes im watching.
As it circles overhead, the spotlight on it is directed some distance away. Ya know theyre always goin on about their "thermal camera" that theyve got? Well it musta been switched off that night, cos they didnt spot the two scrotes cowering behind the car theyd just flown right over.
By now the two scotes have decided to vacate the area and play it cool walking down the street while keeping a crafty eye on the chopper(he still hasnt seen em on his supposed superior optics).
As they pass the house they throw something into the bushes which i retrieve.
Two pairs of gloves and a screwdriver for popping out door locks.
I take these to the copshop next day (doing THEIR job again..detection anyone?) having made sure to preserve the integrity of the evidence, ie dna trace and prints.
Result? nada.nowt.zilch. Just too much trouble to process it mate.
Detect? What could they all detect?......pffffffffffff
Unimpressed i remain.
All it seems the cops are really bothered about now is meeting the targets set for them (go out joe and nick me 120 speeders) etc, not go out joe and nick me 120 burglars, car theives or insurance fraudsters.
Nah, theyre more interested in sitting their portly butts in the back of a van pointing lasers and pulling in the overtime than dealing with PROPER CRIMINALS!!!!!!
Well if you treat us like criminals then we may as well
ing act like criminals!!!! You have been warned. Either pull yourselves together or quit. Cos the simple facts are these: We dont want a police "service" we want a FORCE. We want a force to deal with the hardened criminals and scum that make our lives a bloody nightmare.
We dont want fat cops sitting in vans getting fatter while pointing lasers at us just to meet some pin-prick pencil pusher's "targets" and making light of "overtime" issues.
If you cops that are reading this are a part of the "target meeting" fraternity, and you dont agree with the direction its going, but havent got the balls to tell your superiors where to get off, then leave the
ing force! Its that bloody simple, cos youre sweet all use to anyone! Why am i so angry today? Cos im sick and tired of having to do the cops JOB for em!
Im tired of running the scum bags "outa dodge" on my own. Im tired of phoning the cops for "assistance" to be told " im sorry, we havent got anyone available to deal with such a minor offence"....(theft from cars).
An insight into the Cops abilities to "detect" a crime.
A few weeks ago, i was awoken in the early hours of the morning by the sound of footsteps.(mark 1 earhole)
Two scrotes doing their early morning "shopping" as it happens.(mark 1 eyeball)
So, im out the house and have a spotlight on me, watching them to see where they go.
Up the street and theyre about to make a move on someones car when up the street comes a taxi, so they duck outa sight.
From off in the distance comes the sound of the police chopper (probably doing a speed check on someone) but unrelated to the 2 scrotes im watching.
As it circles overhead, the spotlight on it is directed some distance away. Ya know theyre always goin on about their "thermal camera" that theyve got? Well it musta been switched off that night, cos they didnt spot the two scrotes cowering behind the car theyd just flown right over.
By now the two scotes have decided to vacate the area and play it cool walking down the street while keeping a crafty eye on the chopper(he still hasnt seen em on his supposed superior optics).
As they pass the house they throw something into the bushes which i retrieve.
Two pairs of gloves and a screwdriver for popping out door locks.
I take these to the copshop next day (doing THEIR job again..detection anyone?) having made sure to preserve the integrity of the evidence, ie dna trace and prints.
Result? nada.nowt.zilch. Just too much trouble to process it mate.
Detect? What could they all detect?......pffffffffffff
Unimpressed i remain.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff