Lost driver fined for M-way stop
Discussion
Being a recovery driver, I visit the hard shoulder several times a day rescuing broken down motorists & have had 5 motorist stop to ask me directions on the hard shoulder in the past year, the stupidity of the average motorist is truly staggering, the danger they put themselves & others in is well...., £30 fine, I think she got off lightly.
I've often thought that..... It couldn't be though, could it?..... I mean they wouldn't, would they?....... 
Peter Ward said:
However, as regards the signing. If she was around the M6/M6-toll junction I'm not surprised she was confused. It almost seems deliberate that the signs are confusing to get people onto the toll road. And some of the signs on the roundabouts approaching the motorways are even worse. Yes, get a better map, get satnav, get something, but I do think we should be able to trust the signs.
Hear Hear!!!! I'm not exactly a driving virgin averaging 30-35K a year for the last 30 years but I will be the first to admit I get confused by the signage in that particular area and often thought myself it may be deliberate.
What backs this up are two examples of deliberately misleading signage directing people over the Severn Bridge which is also a Toll Road.
Travel west into Wales and the first indication that a Toll is ahead is AFTER the alternative route via the M5/M50 which is admitedly longer if you're going to South Wales. The worse one is travelling south on the M5 where just before J8(?) the M50 turn off, South Wales is signed as stright down the M5 and over the Toll bridge 'Unless the lights are flashing' to indicate the bridge is closed. Following this route is a fair bit further and takes longer than taking the M50 so why send people that way.
Only answer I can think of is to raise the income from the Bridge!!!!!
//edit got a bit mixed with my east and west
>> Edited by BigBob on Wednesday 4th January 08:17
BigBob said:That's quite a journey, but surely you'll see some signposts between Pembroke Dock and the Severn Bridge?
Travel east into Wales
I find the M6 Toll badly signed and I use it regularly, since I live at one end and my dad lives at the other. But it doesn't excuse stopping on the hard shoulder to ask directions. She could always have simply got off at the next junction and checked a map or asked then; it's not like she was going to be able to turn round if she'd gone the wrong way.
It is easy to miss the M6/Toll divide, you don't expect to have to peel off to continue on the road you were on. It is totally done that way to increase traffic on the toll road and boost revenue. My better half did it just last week.
That said, she had the sense to continue on the toll road and pay the price for her inattention, rather than stop on the motorway for "directions".
This is another side to the "speed kills" message really; by stopping on the hard shoulder, speed was zero, therefore completely safe. Obviously. NOT!!!!! Sadly, the only "safety" message that permeates down through the conciousness of those who are as terminally stupid as this is the twee "Speed Kills" soundbite. Anything else is just too difficult. I mean, she is too stupid to realize how stupid she is - why else would she be on national TV bleating about the Police response?
Edited to add: I did come across someone even more stupid the other day, believe it or not. I was waiting to fill up and the guy in front, already at the pumps, popped the bonnet and jumped out WITH A PAIR OF JUMP LEADS IN HIS HANDS! Even worse, the guy at the next pump when asked maneouvred alongside idiot No 1 to provide a jump! I was making plans for a rapid getaway when an attendant came rushing out to point out the error of their ways. What the hell is wrong with people these days?
>> Edited by victormeldrew on Wednesday 4th January 02:35
That said, she had the sense to continue on the toll road and pay the price for her inattention, rather than stop on the motorway for "directions".
This is another side to the "speed kills" message really; by stopping on the hard shoulder, speed was zero, therefore completely safe. Obviously. NOT!!!!! Sadly, the only "safety" message that permeates down through the conciousness of those who are as terminally stupid as this is the twee "Speed Kills" soundbite. Anything else is just too difficult. I mean, she is too stupid to realize how stupid she is - why else would she be on national TV bleating about the Police response?
Edited to add: I did come across someone even more stupid the other day, believe it or not. I was waiting to fill up and the guy in front, already at the pumps, popped the bonnet and jumped out WITH A PAIR OF JUMP LEADS IN HIS HANDS! Even worse, the guy at the next pump when asked maneouvred alongside idiot No 1 to provide a jump! I was making plans for a rapid getaway when an attendant came rushing out to point out the error of their ways. What the hell is wrong with people these days?
>> Edited by victormeldrew on Wednesday 4th January 02:35
SJobson said:
Travel east into Wales
I find the M6 Toll badly signed and I use it regularly, since I live at one end and my dad lives at the other. But it doesn't excuse stopping on the hard shoulder to ask directions. She could always have simply got off at the next junction and checked a map or asked then; it's not like she was going to be able to turn round if she'd gone the wrong way.
Post edited to read " west into Wales"
victormeldrew said:
It is easy to miss the M6/Toll divide, you don't expect to have to peel off to continue on the road you were on. It is totally done that way to increase traffic on the toll road and boost revenue. My better half did it just last week.
That said, she had the sense to continue on the toll road and pay the price for her inattention, rather than stop on the motorway for "directions".
A Question... is there the opportunity to leave the Toll section before the tollgate if you don't want to use the tollroute? If not and the signs are badly placed, I believe you'd be within your rights to refuse to pay the toll..... haven't been oop there so don't know this new road, yet.....
PS toll roads MUST supply a receipt by EU law (local by-laws are not allowed to "unhinge" EU law; always have fun with this a Dartford tunnel/Forth Road Bridge and block the gates for a time!) as this is a legal transaction for which a receipt is obligatory!!!!!
JMGS4 said:
A Question... is there the opportunity to leave the Toll section before the tollgate if you don't want to use the tollroute?
No the first exit has a toll booth and used to cost 50p in the days when the full toll was £2. Dunno what the minimum is now, I avoid it like the plague.
All the road layout and signing, including the overhead matrix signs, are deliberately set to try and increase toll traffic.
FFS the road has even been renamed M6T to remove the Toll label in that New Labour way of renaming things in the belief that the public is so dumb they will forget that its still the same thing repackaged and the concept was crap and always will be. Perhaps that is why they renamed themselves New Labour. :ahem:
For example even when there are no delays the matrix signs blast out with "No delays on M6T" nothing about "No delays anywhere! Full stop, Rule off."
Yes the road layout IS momentarily confusing if not prepared, if not awake, if car in gear, brain in neutral, thumb up bum. Same at both ends of the toll road in that if you are just blatting along in right hand two lanes you end up on toll road.
FiF
Slightly (but only just) off-topic - does stopping on the hard shoulder because a small child needs the toilet count as an emergency or is it a finable offence ?
Its easy to say 'just keep going to the next exit or service station' but anyone with small children knows that they cant plan wee-wee stops more than 30 seconds in advance and invariably the call comes precisely 1 foot after the last stopping opportunity and 10 miles before the next one
>> Edited by njwc on Wednesday 4th January 12:11
Its easy to say 'just keep going to the next exit or service station' but anyone with small children knows that they cant plan wee-wee stops more than 30 seconds in advance and invariably the call comes precisely 1 foot after the last stopping opportunity and 10 miles before the next one
>> Edited by njwc on Wednesday 4th January 12:11
njwc said:
Slightly (but only just) off-topic - does stopping on the hard shoulder because a small child needs the toilet count as an emergency or is it a finable offence ?
Its easy to say 'just keep going to the next exit or service station' but anyone with small children knows that they cant plan wee-wee stops more than 30 seconds in advance and invariably the call comes precisely 1 foot after the last stopping opportunity and 10 miles before the next one
>> Edited by njwc on Wednesday 4th January 12:11
Well I'm not sure, but according to a certain high-profile football manager's case, it's legal to speed and drive on the hard shoulder in order to get to the toilets more quickly. I guess that should address your needs?
njwc said:
Slightly (but only just) off-topic - does stopping on the hard shoulder because a small child needs the toilet count as an emergency or is it a finable offence ?
Its easy to say 'just keep going to the next exit or service station' but anyone with small children knows that they cant plan wee-wee stops more than 30 seconds in advance and invariably the call comes precisely 1 foot after the last stopping opportunity and 10 miles before the next one
Not sure about the legality of toilet stops on the hard shoulder. I guess it depends on whether you want to risk being ploughed into by a 38 tonne lorry. Stopping to ask a copper for directions on the hard shoulder is stupidity beyond belief! If I'm going somewhere unfamiliar I plan the route with military precision rather than having some hazy notion where my destination is like this daft cow.
Another point; why should BiB be expected to give directions to lost motorists?
I think the officer did exactly how he should, and the more public the stupidity of the woman is known then perhaps that may go some way to educating the proportion of drivers who have no common sense and somehow passed their test with little knowledge of the highway code.
This story could have been:
Police officer killed and woman paralysed from the neck down after being ploughed into my a car whilst officer gave road directions from the hard shoulder of the motorway.
Police confirm the tragedy and confirm that the hard shoulder is only for emergencies. Woman's family is now fighting for undisclosed compensation.
This story could have been:
Police officer killed and woman paralysed from the neck down after being ploughed into my a car whilst officer gave road directions from the hard shoulder of the motorway.
Police confirm the tragedy and confirm that the hard shoulder is only for emergencies. Woman's family is now fighting for undisclosed compensation.
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