RE: Limits for Learners
Discussion
Under powered cars can be more dangerous than adequately powered ones...
ie, pulling out of junctions, it is good to have enough welly to do it safely, agreed?
Quality motors have better brakes, and better handling.
Doesn't this make old bangers sound more dangerous than more sporty vehicles?
If a kid drives a wreck, s/he will have less respect for it that if it was a decent motor.
Motorways are our safest roads, and streets our least safe. If you were to use this as an argument, you'd ban people from driving in TOWN !!!!!
ie, pulling out of junctions, it is good to have enough welly to do it safely, agreed?
Quality motors have better brakes, and better handling.
Doesn't this make old bangers sound more dangerous than more sporty vehicles?
If a kid drives a wreck, s/he will have less respect for it that if it was a decent motor.
Motorways are our safest roads, and streets our least safe. If you were to use this as an argument, you'd ban people from driving in TOWN !!!!!
Yet another example of wooly thinking. If you just passed your test you're limited to what you drive by insurance. Also motorways are great places for mirror work. It seems mad to me that you will be able to drive on dual carrigeways not motorways and I believe in the long run will just increase the middle lane driver syndrome.
What's all this rubbish about motorways? Statistics prove that they're safer to drive on than ordinary roads, the traffic is all running in the same direction and is separated from opposing vehicles by armco. I'd be more inclined to wonder why there is no training and testing for driving during twilight and darkness - when most of our carnage was caused during the holiday period.
If there are to be any limits on learners let's make them during those times.
Motorways are the least of learners' problems - most cops and safety statisticians agree that local familiarity breeds such contempt that an inexperienced driver is more likely to have a smash popping round the corner for a curry than on the motorway.
If there are to be any limits on learners let's make them during those times.
Motorways are the least of learners' problems - most cops and safety statisticians agree that local familiarity breeds such contempt that an inexperienced driver is more likely to have a smash popping round the corner for a curry than on the motorway.
It would be interesting to see how Happy clappies barmy lot would enforce such a rule because if you are in a relatively new car and obeying the speed limit the chances of getting pulled on the motorway are almost nil. Or is this just an excuse to pull sports cars on the off chance they contain new drivers?
Pure madness,
Glad to see that herr Blair hasn`t changed since I went away on holiday, the nanny nation is again introducing rules and laws instead of solutions.
When I passed my test at 17 for 6 months I was the best driver around - then from 17.5 - 19.5 I rapidly became the most dangerous, and it took an accident for me to realise how bad I was.
Having had the dubious pleasure of driving with several people aged 17 - 19 I can confirm that they are all pretty much the same - male & female.
People here are still taught to pass the test, and not how to drive.
But then its more cost effective to penalise young drivers with fines, license endorsements and insuarnce then it is to train them properly.
Arr - its good to be back it the UK...
Yours in wonderland!
Haz
Glad to see that herr Blair hasn`t changed since I went away on holiday, the nanny nation is again introducing rules and laws instead of solutions.
When I passed my test at 17 for 6 months I was the best driver around - then from 17.5 - 19.5 I rapidly became the most dangerous, and it took an accident for me to realise how bad I was.
Having had the dubious pleasure of driving with several people aged 17 - 19 I can confirm that they are all pretty much the same - male & female.
People here are still taught to pass the test, and not how to drive.
But then its more cost effective to penalise young drivers with fines, license endorsements and insuarnce then it is to train them properly.
Arr - its good to be back it the UK...
Yours in wonderland!
Haz
One thing I would like to point out is that the number of times I have had to take evasive action on the roads because I am obeying the highway code and some other 
does not think it applies to them is beyond belief.
I would assume that a lot of people who just pass their test still obey the code and that can cause them some concern and if they are limited to some 2hp car for 6 months then they won't even have the power to get away from the Experienced road user who does not think that (insert your own situation here) apply to them.
does not think it applies to them is beyond belief. I would assume that a lot of people who just pass their test still obey the code and that can cause them some concern and if they are limited to some 2hp car for 6 months then they won't even have the power to get away from the Experienced road user who does not think that (insert your own situation here) apply to them.
quote:
in northern ireland there is already a system for restricting new drivers. they have to carry an "R" plate on the vehicle which limits them to a max of 45mph on any road for 12 months.
In my view 45 on some NSL roads and all motorways (except M25) is very dangerous. These young people should sue the crown.
So we only teach half the skills needed to drivers before we let them loose on the road.
Wonderful, if we don't teach them how to drive properly on fast roads and motorways all we have to do is keep them pottering around town for a few months and they will develop the necessary skills by osmosis or something. Which potato-head dreamed that one up?
Let's try that on pilots. We can't afford to teach you properly so potter around in this Tiger Moth for a couple of months and then you should be ready to have a crack at flying a 747 to New York.
Or surgeons. Warm up on a few ingrowing toenails and just let us know when you have mysteriously developed the ability to do a triple bypass.
This probably explains why most of the driving you see on British motorways is better suited to Sainsbury's car park.
Steve
Wonderful, if we don't teach them how to drive properly on fast roads and motorways all we have to do is keep them pottering around town for a few months and they will develop the necessary skills by osmosis or something. Which potato-head dreamed that one up?
Let's try that on pilots. We can't afford to teach you properly so potter around in this Tiger Moth for a couple of months and then you should be ready to have a crack at flying a 747 to New York.
Or surgeons. Warm up on a few ingrowing toenails and just let us know when you have mysteriously developed the ability to do a triple bypass.
This probably explains why most of the driving you see on British motorways is better suited to Sainsbury's car park.
Steve
Scrapping the existing driving test is the only answer. Even the advanced test isn't rocket science but at least it teaches the driver awareness of his or her environment - particularly if the driver elects to do a running commentary. In virtually every other walk of life if someone is to be put in a situation where others are at risk - comprehensive training is given covering most eventuallities.
When we go to the track we are tutored on car control etc and similarly so when applying for an one of a number of racing licences yet the standard driving test for the road doesn't even incorporate motorway driving - total madness.
Regular retests wouldn't be a bad idea either - although an administrative nightmare - I personally wouldn't have any qualms about getting my driving reassessed.
A more radical approach would be to leave the carnage of road accidents for a few days after the accident rather than clearing it up straight away. I'm sure that constant reminders in the form of mangled metal at the side of the road would cause a few to reconsider their driving abilities. (I realise that this is impracticable and would probably cause more carnage as people slowed down to take a look but I did say it was radical!)
The fundamental problem is that people feel too cosseted in their cars and this leads to a feeling of invulnerability. In this sense experienced drivers who overate their own abilities are often as dangerous as inexperienced drivers. At the end of the day we trade a certain amount of risk for the convenience and freedom that our cars give us and no matter how good our driving is there is always the other bloke.........
When we go to the track we are tutored on car control etc and similarly so when applying for an one of a number of racing licences yet the standard driving test for the road doesn't even incorporate motorway driving - total madness.
Regular retests wouldn't be a bad idea either - although an administrative nightmare - I personally wouldn't have any qualms about getting my driving reassessed.
A more radical approach would be to leave the carnage of road accidents for a few days after the accident rather than clearing it up straight away. I'm sure that constant reminders in the form of mangled metal at the side of the road would cause a few to reconsider their driving abilities. (I realise that this is impracticable and would probably cause more carnage as people slowed down to take a look but I did say it was radical!)
The fundamental problem is that people feel too cosseted in their cars and this leads to a feeling of invulnerability. In this sense experienced drivers who overate their own abilities are often as dangerous as inexperienced drivers. At the end of the day we trade a certain amount of risk for the convenience and freedom that our cars give us and no matter how good our driving is there is always the other bloke.........
quote:
A more radical approach would be to leave the carnage of road accidents for a few days after the accident rather than clearing it up straight away. I'm sure that constant reminders in the form of mangled metal at the side of the road would cause a few to reconsider their driving abilities. (I realise that this is impracticable and would probably cause more carnage as people slowed down to take a look but I did say it was radical!)
In Tobago they do this (mainly cause they can't be bothered or don't have the kit to move the crashed car) and just leave the car by the side of the road. This does nothing to deter the locals who still insist that a blind bend with a two hundred foot sheer drop off is a nice safe place to overtake (with 11 kids on the back of the truck - I kid you not) even in the rain.
Did somebody say facism?
(ahem)
seriously, anyone whos ever been outside a 6th from collge at 4pm may well have seen Novas and XR2s handbraking out the car park, but who can say that about sports cars. Plus all the young ENTHUSIAST drivers I know (inc. myself) have a fair idea what to do when something unexpected happens (the obligatory wet leaves for instance) [rant, rave, rant....] obviously the government are just pissed of that young people don't vote and thus trying to punnish them and hopefully gain some of the grey vote for it!
(ahem)
seriously, anyone whos ever been outside a 6th from collge at 4pm may well have seen Novas and XR2s handbraking out the car park, but who can say that about sports cars. Plus all the young ENTHUSIAST drivers I know (inc. myself) have a fair idea what to do when something unexpected happens (the obligatory wet leaves for instance) [rant, rave, rant....] obviously the government are just pissed of that young people don't vote and thus trying to punnish them and hopefully gain some of the grey vote for it!
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