Idiots straddling lanes on a merge
Discussion
Getragdogleg said:
Better organised, YES. they have seen the signs, they have slowed and are already in the lane that is to remain open, they are going with the flow and are coming into the cones that narrow the road to one lane and OH, whats this ? oh its a arse that is still doing 70, hammering down the other lane and he is about to come past all of us and force his way in, Now he is on the brakes and has tried to get in front of that car, bloody hell now she has got all nervy and stopped completely, Great, now another one is doing it, FFS I am going to be here a while while my lane sits still and this lot come past.
So yes, some drivers could be under the impression they are better organised and driving properly but get slowed by those who dont fancy merging early.
As for my use of English I see worse from others and its not an English test so I will carry on.
Hole digging, no, I am bored and felt like pushing the point over the top to show up the fact that the misinterprtation was not all my fault.
Better organised.... So yes, some drivers could be under the impression they are better organised and driving properly but get slowed by those who dont fancy merging early.
As for my use of English I see worse from others and its not an English test so I will carry on.
Hole digging, no, I am bored and felt like pushing the point over the top to show up the fact that the misinterprtation was not all my fault.
Seen the signs......
Best use both lanes then.....
Ranger 6 said:
Getragdogleg said:
Better organised, YES. they have seen the signs, they have slowed and are already in the lane that is to remain open, they are going with the flow and are coming into the cones that narrow the road to one lane and OH, whats this ? oh its a arse that is still doing 70, hammering down the other lane and he is about to come past all of us and force his way in, Now he is on the brakes and has tried to get in front of that car, bloody hell now she has got all nervy and stopped completely, Great, now another one is doing it, FFS I am going to be here a while while my lane sits still and this lot come past.
So yes, some drivers could be under the impression they are better organised and driving properly but get slowed by those who dont fancy merging early.
As for my use of English I see worse from others and its not an English test so I will carry on.
Hole digging, no, I am bored and felt like pushing the point over the top to show up the fact that the misinterprtation was not all my fault.
Better organised.... So yes, some drivers could be under the impression they are better organised and driving properly but get slowed by those who dont fancy merging early.
As for my use of English I see worse from others and its not an English test so I will carry on.
Hole digging, no, I am bored and felt like pushing the point over the top to show up the fact that the misinterprtation was not all my fault.
Seen the signs......
Best use both lanes then.....
I live in Cornwall, we dont have those signs at the few places local to me that merging seems to be a problem.
Edited by Getragdogleg on Wednesday 29th July 16:57
Ranger 6 said:
A couple of things which made me laugh, firstly that there was STILL!! a long queue in lane 1 - I think they couldn't read.
There is no law that says you must get out of the left lane and go into the other lane if the queue is longer in the lane that will remain after the merge point. Some people might not want to get out of line and then have to merge slightly further on. I would read the sign as "you are allowed to use both lanes in a queuing situation" NOT "you must use both lanes and make damn sure the same number of cars are in both lanes and zip merging or we will shoot you at dawn". Edited by Getragdogleg on Wednesday 29th July 17:05
Getragdogleg said:
Lengthening traffic queues is a bad idea, BUT what about when you have a contraflow/merge with 20 or so cars in it all in the left lane moving slowly but smoothly and one car comes out of the back of the queue and passes all the others and forces his way in the front making the nervy micra driver stop and this holds up the flow, is that ok ? then a couple more do it and before long the queue is bigger because everyone is stop start.
I'll not bother commenting further that I and others had difficulty understanding what you wanted to express. The fact is we did, where the fault lies I'll leave for others to decide.Back on topic with the example you give if everyone just uses both lanes and merges neatly in turn then the problem doesn't exist ie there is no queue to jump.
Getragdogleg said:
fluffnik said:
It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane.
The title of the thread is : "idiots straddling lanes on a merge"I am discussing this.
I am not answering a topic titled : "Is is wrong to block a lane ?"
...and the effect of straddling lanes is to block open lanes.
Getragdogleg said:
I dont block lanes. I do discuss the reasons why people might do this. in the interests of debate, Debate is the art of putting your point across, typing "yes it is" is not a debate.
My debating position is that it is never right to wilfully obstruct an open lane.If there are two lanes approaching a pinch point you should always join the shorter queue, even if others have erroneously chosen the longer one; theirs is the error, not yours.
Just because some might use the wrong lane at a junction there is no excuse for obstructing an open lane, however strong your suspicion it is about to be misused.
In short: It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane.
In long: It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane, by straddling lanes or any other means.
Yeovilton Air Show day.
Big queues on eastbound A303 (I was going west), with Yeovilton traffic pretty effectively queuing in L1 and through traffic going past in L2.
For a mile or two anyway.
Then I started seeing occasional lorry drivers playing "L2 policeman" to stop what they perceived as queue-jumpers - but who were mostly through-travellers - getting by. After ~2 miles back it was two lanes of static traffic.
Morons, who should have their HGV licences revoked.
Big queues on eastbound A303 (I was going west), with Yeovilton traffic pretty effectively queuing in L1 and through traffic going past in L2.
For a mile or two anyway.
Then I started seeing occasional lorry drivers playing "L2 policeman" to stop what they perceived as queue-jumpers - but who were mostly through-travellers - getting by. After ~2 miles back it was two lanes of static traffic.
Morons, who should have their HGV licences revoked.
aquatix said:
Invisible man said:
fluffnik said:
MissElainesNeous said:
With regard to the Police, I was passing a queue of cars in lane 1 in slow moving traffic and a Police car pulled in front of me to block my path. Entering the path of another vehicle is the biggest cause of accidents (not speeding). His reasoning was that I would annoy other motorists. I made a complaint, they even conceded that I was a more qualified driver (IAM, bike, petrol head, no accidents) than the Police officer and that their officer was in the wrong. I received an apology from the Police who said that they would offer the driver some more training.
Well done you.
all hail the driving god ......Getragdogleg - I obviously misunderstood your post...apologies.
Edited by MissElainesNeous on Wednesday 29th July 19:11
fluffnik said:
Getragdogleg said:
fluffnik said:
It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane.
The title of the thread is : "idiots straddling lanes on a merge"I am discussing this.
I am not answering a topic titled : "Is is wrong to block a lane ?"
...and the effect of straddling lanes is to block open lanes.
Getragdogleg said:
I dont block lanes. I do discuss the reasons why people might do this. in the interests of debate, Debate is the art of putting your point across, typing "yes it is" is not a debate.
My debating position is that it is never right to wilfully obstruct an open lane.If there are two lanes approaching a pinch point you should always join the shorter queue, even if others have erroneously chosen the longer one; theirs is the error, not yours.
Just because some might use the wrong lane at a junction there is no excuse for obstructing an open lane, however strong your suspicion it is about to be misused.
In short: It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane.
In long: It is ALWAYS wrong to block an open lane, by straddling lanes or any other means.
cornishgirl said:
This is all well and good when queue(s) are moving at approximately the same slow(ish) speed and merging is relatively safe but really dangerous when you are approaching a set of roadworks at a reasonable speed where there are adequate advance warning countdown signs - the '400 yds', '200 yds' and so on and then some a
hole decides to pull out and race past in a desperate attempt to get to the front, swerving in at the last possible cone-kissing moment. 
This possibility only exists because people stupidly and wrongly join the longer queue just because it happens to be on the left.hole decides to pull out and race past in a desperate attempt to get to the front, swerving in at the last possible cone-kissing moment. Join the shorter queue, merge in turn at the pinch point - joining the longer queue helps no-one.
Ah, yes. This thread was fun a couple of months ago, until it became tedious, and then unbearably tedious.
In contrast, when someone puts only one side to a social question that contains some complexity, it is usually because he is incapable of understanding anything other than that one side, which not coincidentally is the side he came in with.
MissElainesNeous said:
Getragdogleg says that he is a professional driver; well, a shame to his profession by the sounds of it. Flemke unbelievable agrees with Getragdogleg and for some reason appears to believe that when someone puts two sides to an arguament, it them becomes reasoned. Hmm.
When someone puts two sides to a social question that contains some complexity, his analysis is not necessarily reasoned, although there is a high likelihood that it will be.In contrast, when someone puts only one side to a social question that contains some complexity, it is usually because he is incapable of understanding anything other than that one side, which not coincidentally is the side he came in with.
Getragdogleg said:
Ranger 6 said:
I live in Cornwall, we dont have those signs at the few places local to me that merging seems to be a problem.
Getragdogleg said:
Ranger 6 said:
A couple of things which made me laugh, firstly that there was STILL!! a long queue in lane 1 - I think they couldn't read.
There is no law that says you must get out of the left lane and go into the other lane if the queue is longer in the lane that will remain after the merge point. Some people might not want to get out of line and then have to merge slightly further on. I would read the sign as "you are allowed to use both lanes in a queuing situation" NOT "you must use both lanes and make damn sure the same number of cars are in both lanes and zip merging or we will shoot you at dawn".You've trumpeted the fact that you are simply debating the point - I suggest that you may be debating a point which, as there is now signage in use to instruct the stupid, that you may be debating a point which has become pointless as that signage completely contradicts your point of view.
Some LAs then also use signs which tell drivers to 'merge in turn' and if you want photos of those I can walk round the corner and get some....
People should realise (unfortunately!) that the days of politeness have f
ked off a long time ago and you have to be selective when you are polite otherwise you get stamped on... which I have to emphasise is sad, it's evident in too many situations these days - for an example look at an airport and the amount of queues you see there and what do people do to get round, jump or avoid those......109 Bob said:
Invisible man said:
Britain is a funny place,
No it's not 
It's probably our great and proud tradition of being able to queue in single file (which we would term an orderly fashion) that's creating the problem we have with being able to effectively and safely merge in turn. Merge in turn seems to go against the ingrained ideology we have of single file.
When someone pushes in-front of us in a shop queue, another will invariably ask them to stand aside. Furthermore the outspoken person in my scenario will be backed up by others in the queue and possibly the shop-keeper/barman/cashier. In middle Britain and in a non-busy bar it's likely that where there is doubt about who arrived at the bar first, both parties will look to concede first and appear to be polite.
The argument could be that; in the bar scenario we could be recognised easily or quickly gain a reputation for being impolite. There are probably lots of reasons why our behaviour changes when we get in a car; but how would change if we were instantly recognisable? What would we do if the person blocking out path was our friend/relative/neighbour? What would we do if the person tanking down the outside and aggressively merging in turn was our friend/relative/neighbour?
We have thousands of years practice of interacting with each other on a face-to-face basis and have got quite good at it, we have only just over 100 years of practice at interacting with each other inside cars, we have had even less time interacting on the internet (which is probably where some misunderstanding comes from).
One good thing can be said about everyone who has posted, we all want what is right. It is the interpretation of what is right that seems be up for debate.
Edited by MissElainesNeous on Thursday 30th July 12:31
^^ good post there MissElainesNeous.
The reason why so much miscommunication on the net is due to lack of body language.
It's almost as bad on the roads, though things can be done to give vehicle body language. For example as another said, the differential speed is important. Somebody creeping past and appearing to look for a space will be treated far more sympathetically than the person booting it past the others at v+ 40mph or more.
Personally I adopt a very philosophical view on things. Let's say I'm in the position, for some reason that I'm already in lane1 and people are going past. If I let 60 cars in front of me, then after the delay when everybody is all spaced out at 2 second intervals (yeah right as if THAT ever happens) then I'm only 2 minutes later than I would have been otherwise, which is nothing to get worked up about.
damn typos, must proof read before clicking post
The reason why so much miscommunication on the net is due to lack of body language.
It's almost as bad on the roads, though things can be done to give vehicle body language. For example as another said, the differential speed is important. Somebody creeping past and appearing to look for a space will be treated far more sympathetically than the person booting it past the others at v+ 40mph or more.
Personally I adopt a very philosophical view on things. Let's say I'm in the position, for some reason that I'm already in lane1 and people are going past. If I let 60 cars in front of me, then after the delay when everybody is all spaced out at 2 second intervals (yeah right as if THAT ever happens) then I'm only 2 minutes later than I would have been otherwise, which is nothing to get worked up about.
damn typos, must proof read before clicking post
Edited by F i F on Thursday 30th July 10:36
Ranger 6 said:
Traffic usually queues up in L1 way before this sign, there needs to be another one further back. Its a prime place for finding people who straddle both lanes though.
WRT "Merge In Turn" signs, perhaps that also is a comprehension issue. For a long time, I read them as "Merge in corner"
Why don't they make the 'merged' lane straddle the two lanes, rather than being a continuation of one or the other? That way no-one is already in the 'correct lane' prior to the merge, and hence no-one else is 'pushing in' and merge-in-turn will automatically take place?
You only need the merged bit to be straddling the lanes for a couple of hundred yards, then you could divert it to one of the lanes and close the other.
You only need the merged bit to be straddling the lanes for a couple of hundred yards, then you could divert it to one of the lanes and close the other.
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