Police Aggression at Car Meets

[BertBert]

Greendubber said:

There is however no excuses for being unnecessarily rude to people. There's a time and place for speaking to people in a manner which they will understand that includes swearing (it's not an offence)
I've worked lots of similar events and had nothing but abuse off idiots who are intent on ignoring requests to leave, car meets are an absolute nightmare if people start moving onto new spots.

OP - if you dont like it complain, maybe also think about leaving next time people start acting like idiots.

So you've explained it well. Plod have few things they can do here. Politely ask, shout a bit, issue S59s. If they get to the S59s then at least they have more things they can do next time.
If one goes to car meets which are anti-social, blame the anti-social element, not plod.
Bert

[mikal83]

See OP, its all YOUR fault!

[Greendubber]

zarjaz1991 said:

Greendubber said:

Quite possibly, especially if it's a regular meet on a public area and the locals are pissed off with it. Certainly sounds like a large meet if there were 6 police cars there from the off.


There is however no excuses for being unnecessarily rude to people. There's a time and place for speaking to people in a manner which they will understand that includes swearing (it's not an offence)
I've worked lots of similar events and had nothing but abuse off idiots who are intent on ignoring requests to leave, car meets are an absolute nightmare if people start moving onto new spots.

OP - if you dont like it complain, maybe also think about leaving next time people start acting like idiots.

OP - if you do complain, expect to be "targeted" by the police for "routine checks". When they can't find anything wrong with your car or your driving, they'lll simply make something up and prosecute you for it. After you inevitably lose in court, they'll follow you outside and threaten you in the court corridor.

I've seen lots of complaints made about police and never witnessed any of the stuff you claim to have suffered.

[Greendubber]

RedSwede said:

Greendubber said:

Well there you go, your loud car might sound OK to you but perhaps not everyone else wants to endure the noise.

Who knows if anyone else didn't want to endure the noise. All we can infer is that the police probably didn't appreciate the noise - for which there is no hard and fast limit anyway. It's pretty terrible that there is legislation which allows punishment to be dolled out on little more than a policeman's (or womans) feelings at the time. A bad mood can get you in trouble.

Seems to me like the kind of thing you need when people loose respect for law enforcement - and it is certainly not the way to bring it back.

Would also be very interesting to see how many middle aged "respectable looking" people have been done for this in their Astons/AMGs etc - even though they are likely equally loud. I bet there's a bit of prejudice going on here too.

(BTW, I am not the kind of person to ever consider hanging around these meet ups, but I think a balanced view is important)

If Mrs Miggins has phoned up complaining about a loud car that's running outside her house then that's good enough, no 'noise limit' applies to Sec 59.

Personally I'd just ask him to turn it off and wouldn't even consider getting a pen out.

[GT03ROB]

kiethton said:

GT03ROB said:

kiethton said:

Got one alongside my speeding summons - apparently positioning to the OS of a lane is "bullying other cars out of the way"

What would you call it? You know why you took that position, I know why you took it, so did plod

Its a key part of AD - a gentle LH bend, you position right in the lane to gain better visibility...its also a key part to signalling intentions - nothing at all wrong with it.

However plod didn't agree.....clearly... despite them having you for speeding which should have sated their ravenous thirst for your blood .

I wasn't there so I'm probably completely wrong, you may well have been a long distance away from the car in front when taking the position you describe. Only you & plod were there. Only you know what your intentions were, but not thinking about how your actions may be interpreted, irrespective of what you meant is naïve.

[BertBert]

mikal83 said:

See OP, its all YOUR fault!

Clearly that's not what I said. What I said was that in the reality of the "powers" (yuk) available to the police and in the face of abuse and non-compliance from the majority of the people at the car meet (by the OP's description), plod chose the shouty route. OP shouldn't take it personally.
But of course if you have a better system for dealing quickly with an anti-social car-based meet up, do tell.
Bert

[Lemming Train]

[WJNB]

[quote=Flumpo ]
From what I can gather police training changed in the mid 90s. Now they are trained that everyone is a threat and behave accordingly. It’s that training coupled with 90% of the people they come across being scum bags that’s makes them like this- I think.quote]

And rightly so given how the country's population mix has changed for the worse putting us all at risk.

[kestral]

Aidancky said:

Hi all

I attended a car meet last night where I was wierdly singled out and spoken to in some interesting ways, despite me committing no crimes and being 100% polite at all times. I'm curious about the legalities of some things that were said.

So; a meet was planned on facebook by some local car group (who i dont know) - I attended since as it's getting to the time of the year where meets stop due to the weather.

A person was revving at the first location and around 6 police vehicles turned up just to keep an eye on things it seemed. Later on the meet moved to another location and I ended up going there to meet up with one of my friends.

Some of the attendees were driving like idiots in the carpark; and shortly after the police turned up and asked everyone to leave. Here's where my issues start:

A young male police officer walked past me, shouted "get back in your car, and fk OFF!", in a way that reminded me of a teenager having a tantrum. I didn't react to this, and started getting ready to leave. Me and my friend arranged another place to meet up to have a chat away from the meet.

A female police officer then approached me as I was sat in my car, and started to threaten me with a Section 59 offence, saying that I could have my car siezed and be fined. Bear in mind I was sat in a car with the engine turned off, had not done anything silly, or illegal.

So I said I was leaving, and drove to another carpark, just with my 1 other friend so we could have a chat. This officer approached me AGAIN, threatening both of us with Section 59's and our cars would be siezed.

I was 100% polite, friendly and compliant with these officers the entire time. The female officer even said I was the only person there who had not abused her.

Is this legal? I was being harrassed by 2 police officers very unprofessionally, i was being told to leave a public carpark when I had committed no offences or disturbance. Not even a rev of the car, I drove at 20mph or less in and out of these places.

- Can I be given a Section 59 for being near a car meet?
- Can my car be siezed for being parked 300m from a car meet in a carpark?
- Are police officers supposed to tell people to "fk off", wouldn't I have being possibly detained if i'd retaliated to that?

Edited by Aidancky on Sunday 1st December 23:42

Police talking a load off guff.

Without a doubt make a complaint to the Professional Standards department of the force involved. The abusive language alone warrants that.

[longblackcoat]

WJNB said:

From what I can gather police training changed in the mid 90s. Now they are trained that everyone is a threat and behave accordingly. It’s that training coupled with 90% of the people they come across being scum bags that’s makes them like this- I think.quote]

And rightly so given how the country's population mix has changed for the worse putting us all at risk.

That's just racist claptrap

[Paul Dishman]

A police officer telling a member of the public to fk off is not acceptable. If that had been said to me I would pursue a formal complaint just as hard as I possibly could. I certainly wouldn't be fobbed off with excuses about the officer being stressed or at the end of a long shift or whatever

[anonymous-user]

Section 5 offence isn't it? What's good for one is good for the other.

[Greendubber]

flashbang said:

Section 5 offence isn't it? What's good for one is good for the other.

No, not necessarily which is why I said earlier there is a time and a place to speak to people like that. There is a defence of it being reasonable to use such language.

If a police officer has to tell some drunk pain in the ass to fk off outside a pub at kicking out time after telling them 5 times to move on it's reasonable. If police have someone at gunpoint and shout "dont fking move" they're not committing an offence.

Much the same if you were being harassed as you walked down the street and resorted to telling someone to fk off you'd be fine. You've tried the nice way so it's reasonable that strong direct language can be used. Sometimes people just need swearing at so they get the message (not saying the OP did, just explaining why it's not always an offence)

[bluezedd]

Aidancky said:

Hi all

I attended a car meet last night where I was wierdly singled out and spoken to in some interesting ways, despite me committing no crimes and being 100% polite at all times. I'm curious about the legalities of some things that were said.

So; a meet was planned on facebook by some local car group (who i dont know) - I attended since as it's getting to the time of the year where meets stop due to the weather.

A person was revving at the first location and around 6 police vehicles turned up just to keep an eye on things it seemed. Later on the meet moved to another location and I ended up going there to meet up with one of my friends.

Some of the attendees were driving like idiots in the carpark; and shortly after the police turned up and asked everyone to leave. Here's where my issues start:

A young male police officer walked past me, shouted "get back in your car, and fk OFF!", in a way that reminded me of a teenager having a tantrum. I didn't react to this, and started getting ready to leave. Me and my friend arranged another place to meet up to have a chat away from the meet.

A female police officer then approached me as I was sat in my car, and started to threaten me with a Section 59 offence, saying that I could have my car siezed and be fined. Bear in mind I was sat in a car with the engine turned off, had not done anything silly, or illegal.

So I said I was leaving, and drove to another carpark, just with my 1 other friend so we could have a chat. This officer approached me AGAIN, threatening both of us with Section 59's and our cars would be siezed.

I was 100% polite, friendly and compliant with these officers the entire time. The female officer even said I was the only person there who had not abused her.

Is this legal? I was being harrassed by 2 police officers very unprofessionally, i was being told to leave a public carpark when I had committed no offences or disturbance. Not even a rev of the car, I drove at 20mph or less in and out of these places.

- Can I be given a Section 59 for being near a car meet?
- Can my car be siezed for being parked 300m from a car meet in a carpark?
- Are police officers supposed to tell people to "fk off", wouldn't I have being possibly detained if i'd retaliated to that?

Even though I support the police, I do believe you were treated badly as I've definitely experienced a couple of dicks in a traffic stop before. I've experienced similar attitude problems from police at a time when I was actually considering applying to join. E.g. I was once stopped by bike cop (well 2, but only one had a problem) with an attitude problem, because he stopped me while riding a 125cc bike while I had a full licence while I was with a friend. The first thing that was said when we were stopped was "so who's the one with the full licence?". When I had one and handed it over he didn't seem pleased, he then started looking for anything to do me for. I ended up with a £60 fine for not displaying a £15 tax disc (that was in my pocket).

I was nothing but polite to them, but I guess it must have been a bad day or something.

That experience put me off the job, but definitely was a good lesson to always lie to the police if it avoids giving them something. e.g. I could have just said it was on there this morning and it must have been stolen in the city.

That said, I have had much better experiences with them too in similar traffic stop situations.

Guess it's like any job, you'll no doubt get some assholes in any workplace. That said, everyone in my current workplaces have all been nice.

[A1VDY]

Not all but many coppers are just wkers for the sheer hell of it.
Having said that most car meets are full of wkers so it's not surprising the wkers going to these car meets are treated like wkers.
The car meet wkers then complain about the coppers attending these meets being wkers and so it goes on.
Idea- keep away from wky car meets..

[Countdown]

A1VDY said:

Not all but many coppers are just wkers for the sheer hell of it.
Having said that most car meets are full of wkers so it's not surprising the wkers going to these car meets are treated like wkers.
The car meet wkers then complain about the coppers attending these meets being wkers and so it goes on.
Idea- keep away from wky car meets..

Tbh, given the type of cretins that form the majority of "clientele" the Police have to deal with day in day out I'm surprised how they remain relatively calm and in control.

[anonymous-user]

Greendubber said:

No, not necessarily which is why I said earlier there is a time and a place to speak to people like that. There is a defence of it being reasonable to use such language.

If a police officer has to tell some drunk pain in the ass to fk off outside a pub at kicking out time after telling them 5 times to move on it's reasonable. If police have someone at gunpoint and shout "dont fking move" they're not committing an offence.

Much the same if you were being harassed as you walked down the street and resorted to telling someone to fk off you'd be fine. You've tried the nice way so it's reasonable that strong direct language can be used. Sometimes people just need swearing at so they get the message (not saying the OP did, just explaining why it's not always an offence)

That's a good response. But what happens if someone nearby, with nothing to do with the scenario, is offended by it?

[Antony Moxey]

flashbang said:

That's a good response. But what happens if someone nearby, with nothing to do with the scenario, is offended by it?

They’re offended. It’s not an offence to offend.

[anonymous-user]

Antony Moxey said:

flashbang said:

That's a good response. But what happens if someone nearby, with nothing to do with the scenario, is offended by it?

They’re offended. It’s not an offence to offend.

Cool. So by that the OP could have told the copper to fk off back then? Genuine question.

[Greendubber]

flashbang said:

Antony Moxey said:

flashbang said:

That's a good response. But what happens if someone nearby, with nothing to do with the scenario, is offended by it?

They’re offended. It’s not an offence to offend.

Cool. So by that the OP could have told the copper to fk off back then? Genuine question.

Two wrongs dont make a right in the circumstances given.

The OP would have been better off asking for the officers details than telling them to fk off.