RE: Gatsos generate £20 million 'stealth tax'
Discussion
james_j said:
crazydave said:
Fool. It's not willfull speeding or excessive speeding we're referring to. Just being a couple of mph over the limit is enough to get caught.
...which to me suggests a lack of concentration to your driving. Anyway, it's never just a couple of miles over the speed limit is it - it's normally 35mph in a 30 zone which is 16% over.
crazydave said:
What's better? Concentrating on exactly what you're doing or staring at your speedo?
Anyone who can't do both shouldn't be driving.
Perhaps you should check the facts.
The RAC has released the results of a study which shows the type of driver most likely to be caught for driving above set limits: it's the most safe driver (i.e. with the least accidents). Those who are least caught (the young and the elderly) are the most accident-prone.
Now that may go against what you "feel" should be the truth, but if you were to apply your mind to what may be happening, i.e. the safest driver is not looking at their speedo so much as a means to judge "safe driving" but is driving at a speed appropriate to all of the conditions at the time, you may be able to see things in a way such that your opinions are formed after consideration of the facts.
Exactly the whole policy is driven by the gadjet (Gatso) without it deaths would have fallen and the road would have been safer, It will be road pricing next alot sooner than some think mabe even after the next election
crazydave said:
The signs that flash up telling you that you're speeding are far more effective than a fine dropping on your doormat two weeks later!
Yesterday, driving through a village in Wiltshire or Gloucestershire, I was a bit over the 30 limit so a sign lit up and reminded me to slow down. A short distance further on was what looked like an unoffical 30 mph repeater sign with the words 'Thank You' underneath it.
When I drive through a village I try to be quiet and considerate in any case, but that sort of sign seemed to me indicative of a much better attitude than the scamera mentality. I can go along with that.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
m0thr4 said:
I've been driving for 16 years and never once had an endorsement despite repeatedly driving over the speed limit. I'm not sure how you all manage to get caught out - perhaps you're not concentrating hard enough or something.
Aye well that's OK, but be patient. You've still got plenty of time to get caught.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
m0thr4 said:
...carelessness is recklessness in a motor vehicle and there's no excuse for it. And I'm the first to admit I drive recklessly from time to time. Just this morning in fact.
May I suggest you put a bit more effort into avoiding the recklessness, rather than worrying quite so much about speed?
Best wishes all,
Dave.
blademan said:
Not just luck. Judgement also has a lot to do with it. I don't speed through built up areas where there are likely to be pedestrians and cars exiting side roads. I do admit to speeding in national limits but only if the conditions prevail.
Spot on CD. Thats exactly the way I drive as well.
Is there room for another member in your gang?
Best wishes all,
Dave.
Streetcop said:
Leave blatting for the NSL...conditions, vehicle, experience considered
Quite so. I had a funny experience yesterday evening on the way home though.
I was on a virtually deserted A169 doing my usual thing
when I found myself catching up with another vehicle. There was very long range visibility and he must have been almost a mile ahead when I first saw him. Anyhow when I got closer it turned out to be a police van travelling at just under 60 mph (curses) so I followed at a discreet distance. Next thing is I'm caught up by another car, so I thought OK you have a look and see what you elect to do, so I gave a couple of left turn flashes, and he whizzed past me, and immediately braked hard and tucked in front of me when he saw the police van. 
Then the police van pulled into the lay-by on the top straight approaching Blue Bank, and as soon as we had passed he came out again and followed me. The guy that had passed me then increased speed a bit and left us, while I dutifully continued at 60 mph. Makes a change eh?
Best wishes all,
Dave.
TripleS said:
Yesterday, driving through a village in Wiltshire or Gloucestershire, I was a bit over the 30 limit so a sign lit up and reminded me to slow down. A short distance further on was what looked like an unoffical 30 mph repeater sign with the words 'Thank You' underneath it.
When I drive through a village I try to be quiet and considerate in any case, but that sort of sign seemed to me indicative of a much better attitude than the scamera mentality. I can go along with that.
I can relate to that, speed cameras, bumps, obstacles and the dangerous force-you-into-the-other-lane methods always provoke annoyance and I have to use the horn to warn people I'm there. The 30 signs that light up produce a quiet and relaxed 28mph trundle - it's a respect thing.
If I'm following a numptie at 40mph on an NSL and they carry on like that through a respectful village I'll flash them too, they usually slow down (probably not sure if I'm plod).
Streetcop said:
m0thr4 makes some valid points...
The fact that so many drivers don't have the self discipline to adhere to the posted speed limits in 30s,40s and 50mph zone...is a poor show...
It's not necessarily lack of self-discipline. Such drivers (who are getting caught most often) are likely to be experienced accident-free drivers of many years' standing.
A great many 30, 40 and 50 limits are pathetically low and generate disrespect for those imposing them.
Maybe these drivers are in fact more disciplined and decide for themselves to concentrate on the quality of their driving, hence their good driving record.
james_j said:
Maybe these drivers are in fact more disciplined and decide for themselves to concentrate on the quality of their driving, hence their good driving record.
We'll have to agree to disagree then James...
If you break a posted 30/40/50 limit and get caught..you have only yourself to blame. Yes, you might feel that the limit is too low etc...but you make that decision to break the limit.
Like I've said before.....the best roads are the NSLs and the twisties....Any numptie can blast through a residential or town area...
Streetcop said:
Maybe these drivers are in fact more disciplined and decide for themselves to concentrate on the quality of their driving, hence their good driving record.
We'll have to agree to disagree then James...
If you break a posted 30/40/50 limit and get caught..you have only yourself to blame. Yes, you might feel that the limit is too low etc...but you make that decision to break the limit.
Like I've said before.....the best roads are the NSLs and the twisties....Any numptie can blast through a residential or town area...
Maybe you've been a bit selective there Gary. If 30/40/50 mph speed limits are being exceeded, it does of course indicate a lack of discipline in that respect.
Even so, what James said is valid. It is still arguable that in overall driving terms a high level of discipline is being maintained in the key factors that govern the safety or otherwise of one's driving, and slavish adherence to speed limits is not one of them.
Appropriate speed is important. Speed limits are not.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
Streetcop said:
Maybe these drivers are in fact more disciplined and decide for themselves to concentrate on the quality of their driving, hence their good driving record.
We'll have to agree to disagree then James...
If you break a posted 30/40/50 limit and get caught..you have only yourself to blame. Yes, you might feel that the limit is too low etc...but you make that decision to break the limit.
Like I've said before.....the best roads are the NSLs and the twisties....Any numptie can blast through a residential or town area...
Street Cop, in an earlier post you clearly advocate speeding in an NSL zone yet maintain that we must stick to the limit in 30,40,50 zones? Surely if you belive that speed kills then speed is just as dangerous in the countryside as it is in urban areas?
Sure, if I make the decision to speed in any zone then I know the consequences. However, it doesnt mean I have to bend over and take it up the arse without raising any objections. I object strongly to blanket speed restrictions - they should be there as an advisory speed only and speeding fines should be issued only by traffic police and in situations where someone is driving recklessly for the prevailing conditions - just like they were prior to the introduction of speed cameras (when, incidently our KSI figures were in decline). Speed cameras are ineffective at making people drive slower (see recent RAC study), there is no proper evidence that they improve safety on our roads, they divert attention away from worthy road safety measures, they criminalise drivers, and quite frankly I think its a disgrace.
Streetcop said:
yep..like I said before..stick to the 30s, 40s and 50s...even if dual carraigeways...
Leave blatting for the NSL...conditions, vehicle, experience considered
Advocating/ turning a blind eye whats the difference? Sorry but as I read it, the implication of that statement is that its ok to speed in an NSL.
Why is it suitable to speed in NSL and not in a 50 limit? Whats the difference between going 40mph in a 30mph zone as opposed to doing 70mph - 80mph in a NSL? Maybe 2/3rds of fatalities occur in built up areas but how many of them are due to excessive speed? Does anyone have a reliable figure?
Of course, I'm not suggesting we go driving like maniacs around town but I'm sure we all know stretches of 30mph limit roads where it is perfectly safe to do 40mph+. On the other hand I'm sure we all know other roads where doing anything like 30mph would be reckless. Its this blanket speed restriction policy that gets me. If the area has street lighting we are forced to drive at 30mph everywhere, regardless of road layout, weather, traffic flow, time of day etc. And god help your license/wallet if you stray so much as 5mph over the limit! (or less in some cases).
I think all speed limits should be abolished really, this would force everyone to actually make up their own minds and actually think about what they're doing and how fast they're going for the conditions.
Anyway, we all seem to be roughly on the same side so I'll stop the in-fighting now
>> Edited by jamiet on Tuesday 8th February 14:15
Jamie..
The reason for the statement is 3 fold.
If you drive your TVR Griff along a 30,40,50 speed limit...the chances are there will be junctions, houses, etc etc.
In addition the likelihood of cameravans is quite high.
Finally, there is no excitement in travelling at speed in towns. In the countryside, you have to use your skills of observation, long distance planning, cross views, camber awareness, cornering principles etc etc.
That's what driving is all about isn't it? Not hoofing it up to the next set of lights and slamming on the brakes.
Having said all that...if I follow you in a NSL and you're exceeding the limit by a great amount and don't appear to be reading the road, or driving to the particular arena you're in...I WILL stop you and will 'book' you.
Those are the reasons for the post that I made.
The reason for the statement is 3 fold.
If you drive your TVR Griff along a 30,40,50 speed limit...the chances are there will be junctions, houses, etc etc.
In addition the likelihood of cameravans is quite high.
Finally, there is no excitement in travelling at speed in towns. In the countryside, you have to use your skills of observation, long distance planning, cross views, camber awareness, cornering principles etc etc.
That's what driving is all about isn't it? Not hoofing it up to the next set of lights and slamming on the brakes.
Having said all that...if I follow you in a NSL and you're exceeding the limit by a great amount and don't appear to be reading the road, or driving to the particular arena you're in...I WILL stop you and will 'book' you.
Those are the reasons for the post that I made.
Streetcop said:
...there is no excitement in travelling at speed in towns. In the countryside, you have to use your skills of observation, long distance planning, cross views, camber awareness, cornering principles etc etc.
That's what driving is all about isn't it? Not hoofing it up to the next set of lights and slamming on the brakes.
I don't go in for hoofing it and then slamming brakes on anyhow.
My style of progress is often quite boring, at least that's what Eileen has complained about sometimes. She preferred my somewhat more flamboyant style of earlier years. Streetcop said:
...if I follow you in a NSL and you're exceeding the limit by a great amount and don't appear to be reading the road, or driving to the particular arena you're in...I WILL stop you and will 'book' you.
Fair enough. I would expect to be OK then - with you at least. Problem is, I wouldn't know it wasn't you until it was too late.
I don't suppose you could put a big 'Streetcop' sign on the top of your plod car? 
Best wishes all,
Dave.
>> Edited by TripleS on Tuesday 8th February 17:47
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