Ultra rare mk 1 Escort at upcoming auction
Discussion
I don't mean to hijack the thread but i have a bit of a quandary with my escort and wonder what your opinions are?
I bought a 1978 rs2000 from a guy a couple of years back. Bare shell & V5. It's been rally prepared with tarmac arches, watts link towers, 4 link boxes, strengthening gussets everywhere(!), rear turrets, big tunnel, rear firewall etc. It came with a safety devices bolt in cage not fitted.
I'm building it into a fun road car with a duratec, rocket box, 6x link atlas axle. Sort of inspired by the irish tarmac rally cars, purely for fun on the wee highland roads. It's not going to be trimmed and carpeted, i might put a headlining in, maybe. I'm 6'4" and was worried about my head hitting the rollcage so had decided just to use the rear half of the bolt in cage. I will be using harnesses and bucket seats. I won't be rallying it but i might do a few track days and wouldnt mind trying a hillclimb or sprint...whether or not i ever do though, who knows?
In actual fact, with the seats in place, my head is a couple of inches from the rollcage so it would be probably be safe enough. I'd fit padding so if i am on track with a helmet on if i hit my head the padding should help.
The guy who is sorting the bodywork for me is trying to persuade me to put a full weld-in cage in. From the point of view that it will increase the value of the car and be stronger/stiffer. It will also let me fit the bars much closer to the roof and give me more headroom.
So, do you think it's better to fit a better cage and if i come to sell it in a few years will it add to the desirability/value of the car?
I bought a 1978 rs2000 from a guy a couple of years back. Bare shell & V5. It's been rally prepared with tarmac arches, watts link towers, 4 link boxes, strengthening gussets everywhere(!), rear turrets, big tunnel, rear firewall etc. It came with a safety devices bolt in cage not fitted.
I'm building it into a fun road car with a duratec, rocket box, 6x link atlas axle. Sort of inspired by the irish tarmac rally cars, purely for fun on the wee highland roads. It's not going to be trimmed and carpeted, i might put a headlining in, maybe. I'm 6'4" and was worried about my head hitting the rollcage so had decided just to use the rear half of the bolt in cage. I will be using harnesses and bucket seats. I won't be rallying it but i might do a few track days and wouldnt mind trying a hillclimb or sprint...whether or not i ever do though, who knows?
In actual fact, with the seats in place, my head is a couple of inches from the rollcage so it would be probably be safe enough. I'd fit padding so if i am on track with a helmet on if i hit my head the padding should help.
The guy who is sorting the bodywork for me is trying to persuade me to put a full weld-in cage in. From the point of view that it will increase the value of the car and be stronger/stiffer. It will also let me fit the bars much closer to the roof and give me more headroom.
So, do you think it's better to fit a better cage and if i come to sell it in a few years will it add to the desirability/value of the car?
Edited by Lefty on Thursday 8th October 14:48
Mark A S said:
Ha, wonderful stuff, appears reasonably priced, although when i started work in 1976 i was on,,,,,,,,,,, wait for it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 50p an hour!
Yeah! £2,000 with 5% a year inflation for 46 years is only £19k. Where can you buy a car like that for £19k now? GT86/BRZ is probably closest and they must be £30k?Lefty said:
I don't mean to hijack the thread but i have a bit of a quandary with my escort and wonder what your opinions are?
I bought a 1978 rs2000 from a guy a couple of years back. Bare shell & V5. It's been rally prepared with tarmac arches, watts link towers, 4 link boxes, strengthening gussets everywhere(!), rear turrets, big tunnel, rear firewall etc. It came with a safety devices bolt in cage not fitted.
I'm building it into a fun road car with a duratec, rocket box, 6x link atlas axle. Sort of inspired by the irish tarmac rally cars, purely for fun on the wee highland roads. It's not going to be trimmed and carpeted, i might put a headlining in, maybe. I'm 6'4" and was worried about my head hitting the rollcage so had decided just to use the rear half of the bolt in cage. I will be using harnesses and bucket seats. I won't be rallying it but i might do a few track days and wouldnt mind trying a hillclimb or sprint...whether or not i ever do though, who knows?
In actual fact, with the seats in place, my head is a couple of inches from the rollcage so it would be probably be safe enough. I'd fit padding so if i am on track with a helmet on if i hit my head the padding should help.
The guy who is sorting the bodywork for me is trying to persuade me to put a full weld-in cage in. From the point of view that it will increase the value of the car and be stronger/stiffer. It will also let me fit the bars much closer to the roof and give me more headroom.
So, do you think it's better to fit a better cage and if i come to sell it in a few years will it add to the desirability/value of the car?
If i was you, with what your intending to use it for, don't fit a weld in cage, yes they make the car Very strong, but your not going to be bouncing around a gravel rally stage are you I bought a 1978 rs2000 from a guy a couple of years back. Bare shell & V5. It's been rally prepared with tarmac arches, watts link towers, 4 link boxes, strengthening gussets everywhere(!), rear turrets, big tunnel, rear firewall etc. It came with a safety devices bolt in cage not fitted.
I'm building it into a fun road car with a duratec, rocket box, 6x link atlas axle. Sort of inspired by the irish tarmac rally cars, purely for fun on the wee highland roads. It's not going to be trimmed and carpeted, i might put a headlining in, maybe. I'm 6'4" and was worried about my head hitting the rollcage so had decided just to use the rear half of the bolt in cage. I will be using harnesses and bucket seats. I won't be rallying it but i might do a few track days and wouldnt mind trying a hillclimb or sprint...whether or not i ever do though, who knows?
In actual fact, with the seats in place, my head is a couple of inches from the rollcage so it would be probably be safe enough. I'd fit padding so if i am on track with a helmet on if i hit my head the padding should help.
The guy who is sorting the bodywork for me is trying to persuade me to put a full weld-in cage in. From the point of view that it will increase the value of the car and be stronger/stiffer. It will also let me fit the bars much closer to the roof and give me more headroom.
So, do you think it's better to fit a better cage and if i come to sell it in a few years will it add to the desirability/value of the car?
Edited by Lefty on Thursday 8th October 14:48
SD bolt in cages normally fit very well, i would have mounting blocks fabricated where the front and middle section bolt to the floor, so as it bolts to these rather than through the floor pan, then this will also enable you to tuck the cage up as far as poss.
I'm 6'2" never had a problem fitting in an Escort with a cage and Helmet on, just make sure you mount your seat in the correct position.
Good luck, and lets see some pics
aeropilot said:
Where's my Tardis to go back to Sept 1974.....might just get an order in time to get a Vista Orange RS1600 with Custom pack, radio, LSD, Bilsteins, Mag Minilites and Cibies before the last one was built in Nov 74.
My old Mex was built Nov 74 (PA build code) so one of the last, but not registered till Aug 75 on a 'P'. Pic from early 90's
Ken P said:
My old Mex was built Nov 74 (PA build code) so one of the last, but not registered till Aug 75 on a 'P'.
Pic from early 90's
The last RS1600 was built Nov 74, but Mex's and RS2's continued being made until end of Jan 75.Pic from early 90's
It amazing how many were P reg, much to the annoyance of the dealers who were desperate to get rid of the cars they had sold in June/July but the new owners wanted the new reg. By the time that these cars were registered on 1st Aug there was no cars left, all the dealer stock had gone.
aeropilot said:
The last RS1600 was built Nov 74, but Mex's and RS2's continued being made until end of Jan 75.
It amazing how many were P reg, much to the annoyance of the dealers who were desperate to get rid of the cars they had sold in June/July but the new owners wanted the new reg. By the time that these cars were registered on 1st Aug there was no cars left, all the dealer stock had gone.
You are definitely a mine of info, aero. I wonder how many Jan 75 built cars are left now?It amazing how many were P reg, much to the annoyance of the dealers who were desperate to get rid of the cars they had sold in June/July but the new owners wanted the new reg. By the time that these cars were registered on 1st Aug there was no cars left, all the dealer stock had gone.
Ken P said:
aeropilot said:
The last RS1600 was built Nov 74, but Mex's and RS2's continued being made until end of Jan 75.
It amazing how many were P reg, much to the annoyance of the dealers who were desperate to get rid of the cars they had sold in June/July but the new owners wanted the new reg. By the time that these cars were registered on 1st Aug there was no cars left, all the dealer stock had gone.
You are definitely a mine of info, aero. I wonder how many Jan 75 built cars are left now?It amazing how many were P reg, much to the annoyance of the dealers who were desperate to get rid of the cars they had sold in June/July but the new owners wanted the new reg. By the time that these cars were registered on 1st Aug there was no cars left, all the dealer stock had gone.
It is the Stardust Silver car in this photo taken at Bracknell Auto Sunday show in July 1984. Interesting photo as well, as the P-reg Modena Green RS2000 next to it was the very last RS2000 sold new by a RS dealer in last week of July 1975. And the car to the right is the unique one off, Special Build Mexico in Purple Velvet.
aeropilot said:
One of the guys in our local AVO OC group used to have a Jan 75 build code RS2000. It was actually a LHD German spec car, that never went to Germany, and was first registered to Ford Mo Co in the UK, and they were using it for whatever reason for 12 months or so before they sold it into the trade.
It is the Stardust Silver car in this photo taken at Bracknell Auto Sunday show in July 1984. Interesting photo as well, as the P-reg Modena Green RS2000 next to it was the very last RS2000 sold new by a RS dealer in last week of July 1975. And the car to the right is the unique one off, Special Build Mexico in Purple Velvet.
It is the Stardust Silver car in this photo taken at Bracknell Auto Sunday show in July 1984. Interesting photo as well, as the P-reg Modena Green RS2000 next to it was the very last RS2000 sold new by a RS dealer in last week of July 1975. And the car to the right is the unique one off, Special Build Mexico in Purple Velvet.
went to the shows with OJO 
Lefty said:
s m said:
Mark A S said:
Makes me wonder of how many of all the RS Escorts remained bog standard back in the day, i bet most were modded to some degree, it was very much the thing to do money permitting especially with the numerous choice of go faster "stuff" supplied by Fords and many other outlets, just another reason there so popular.
It makes me wonder though if the owners of these great little cars back in the day that kept them standard, little use etc had foresight into there values, a bit like people who bought dinky cars and never removed them from there boxes,,,,,,,,,,, i mean,,,,,,, where's the fun in that
I know my friend’s car from Mike Youngs was showroom standard still. Unfortunately for him, the buy in price ( double that of an RS2000 ) was such that he didn’t really have a load of spare cash to do anything with the engine and unlock its potential. Plus I think he was worried if it went pear-shaped it would be hassle/expense to have it rebuilt/fixed and may devalue the car and his money in it. Even then it was a fairly rare car and we were all only late teens/early twenties. It was harder to get info on stuff with no internet, down to reading mags, speaking to people, parts places etc. One thing rebuilding your Pinto or Xflow with your mates ( especially when you can get another engine from the scrapyard cheapish ....... but would you take on a much more valuable BDA yourself or try and find a specialist to do it from the local motor clubIt makes me wonder though if the owners of these great little cars back in the day that kept them standard, little use etc had foresight into there values, a bit like people who bought dinky cars and never removed them from there boxes,,,,,,,,,,, i mean,,,,,,, where's the fun in that
Certainly for RS2000s, Mexicos, Sports, GTs, Harriers etc the engines and parts were a fair wodge cheaper and more common so we had no qualms modding them.
I guess if we’d all been older and richer at the time we would have had more expensive cars or done a lot more tuning etc
Here’s some period RS1800 bumph
Even now, 115bhp in 900kg will feel spritely.
Anyone got a mk2 price list from late 70's?,
Edited by Lefty on Thursday 8th October 13:25
You’re right though, they shifted ok - not many small saloons were appreciably faster at that time
The RS2000 was down a bit on power compared to the 1800 but still close enough
aeropilot said:
And yet..........I remember, a mate and me went 'halves' on a Mexico, which we bought to flip......this would have been 1986/7 and it was a late custom pack Mex
I can remember driving it around for a week before it went into my mate's mates bodyshop, and I can remember thinking.....this is just lovely to drive around in, just as the factory intended............and also, why are we going to ruin it by putting new wings on and painting it.....but back then, that's what sold them, very few people were into 'survivor' cars, unlike today. That though was my 'lightbulb' moment about mods vs. standard.........except the follwoing year, I bought my Sunbeam-Lotus and of course set about modding it
I know what you mean - my RS2000s just felt ‘right’ straight as they came from the factory I can remember driving it around for a week before it went into my mate's mates bodyshop, and I can remember thinking.....this is just lovely to drive around in, just as the factory intended............and also, why are we going to ruin it by putting new wings on and painting it.....but back then, that's what sold them, very few people were into 'survivor' cars, unlike today. That though was my 'lightbulb' moment about mods vs. standard.........except the follwoing year, I bought my Sunbeam-Lotus and of course set about modding it
I noticed a few of the magazine comparison tests of the time mentioned the RS cars having a ‘racer-like’ feel out the box
Having said that, those Lotus Sunbeams have a bit to answer for. It was another friend getting one, and then modding it into a works rep ( with suitable power uplift
) ...that made the rest of us all want a bit more extra poke for our Escorts. The fact they handled upgrades so well/cheaply was all to the good too. 
Yes, when the Lotus Sunbeams came out, they were a fair bit faster than a standard RS Escort, indeed with a bit of head work plus cams, 200 bhp from a LS was a VERY nice upgrade, much more road friendly than a 200 bhp pinto! As you correctly said, not many modded the BD's for road use due to the expense.
Having had a couple of LS, one standard, one modded i always thought the Escorts handled better with a much better balance.
Aero, that purple Mex, is that the same colour as used on the 1300e's ? Those 3 Mk1's in your pic are quite special aren't they.
Having had a couple of LS, one standard, one modded i always thought the Escorts handled better with a much better balance.
Aero, that purple Mex, is that the same colour as used on the 1300e's ? Those 3 Mk1's in your pic are quite special aren't they.
Mark A S said:
Yes, when the Lotus Sunbeams came out, they were a fair bit faster than a standard RS Escort, indeed with a bit of head work plus cams, 200 bhp from a LS was a VERY nice upgrade, much more road friendly than a 200 bhp pinto! As you correctly said, not many modded the BD's for road use due to the expense.
Having had a couple of LS, one standard, one modded i always thought the Escorts handled better with a much better balance.
Having had a couple of LS, one standard, one modded i always thought the Escorts handled better with a much better balance.
Never got to drive the Lotus Sunbeam in standard or modded form but passengered in it a fair bit
So much quicker than the ti.
Even now the performance shows up a modern day 200bhp sporty car like the GT86 and its ‘skinny tyres’
Lotus managed better acceleration on 185s
Certainly gives an idea of how quick an Escort might have been with145/150bhp. We did notice as soon as we’d got our Escorts up to that performance he moved the goalposts by upping his Lotus to near 190/200bhp!
Mark A S said:
Having had a couple of LS, one standard, one modded i always thought the Escorts handled better with a much better balance.
Very much so. As much as I loved my SL (owned it for 16 years) the chassis wasn't as good as an Escort.Mark A S said:
Aero, that purple Mex, is that the same colour as used on the 1300e's ? Those 3 Mk1's in your pic are quite special aren't they.
Yes, same as a 1300E.The first owner went into a RS dealer wanting to buy a Mexico, and the story goes that there was a purple velvet 1300E in the showroom, and he said to the salesman, I want it like that.
Salesman phoned Aveley, and they said, sure, we'll do it through Special Build. So, the guy got his Mexico with Custom Pack, and that looked like a 1300E, even down to the 1300E style bumper overriders that you can just see in the photo.
Yes, all 3 were a bit special as a result. The Modena Green RS2000 also had a interesting drivetrain as it had a few engine tweeks by Oselli and a VERY special Quaife 'Rangechange' overdrive gearbox.
s m said:
Never got to drive the Lotus Sunbeam in standard or modded form but passengered in it a fair bit
So much quicker than the Ti.
Funnily enough........So much quicker than the Ti.
I owned a Series 2 Ti for 2.5 years before I had the Lotus. I bought the Ti to replace the stolen RS2000, as loosing my no-claims bonus with the RS2 theft, I couldn't afford to insure anything above Grp 4 insurance, and the Ti was only Grp.4, plus I knew the Sunbeam well enough having spannered for many of the guys in my motorclub that were running Sunbeams and Avengers as rally cars.
Anyway, when I went to view the Ti that I ended up buying, it had been a company car so had done nearly 80k miles (was only 5 years old) and the guy had the engine rebuilt with overbore, Grp A big valve head and cam etc., but he was hugely disappointed by the subsequent performance and was thus selling it to buy a Lotus instead.
Based on what I had learnt through spannering on rallies, I had my suspicions but didn't say anything, did the deal and sure enough, a few weeks later discovered that he just put the 80k mile knackered original carbs back on. The carb bodies were knackered you could see daylight past the butterflies, so a brand new set of DCOE's were bought, fitted and once Pete Baldwin had done his magic on them on his RR, we got 115 at the wheels from it........and 3 more than my mates RS1600 on the same RR session
I had a lot of fun with that car.
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