Project 36/400 T350R

[Don1]

Looking at these numbers again, you out- perform a 4 litre! Amazing stuff. Looks like the S6 likes to breathe.

[WolfyJones]

Don1 said:

Looking at these numbers again, you out- perform a 4 litre! Amazing stuff. Looks like the S6 likes to breathe.

More torque at the top than a standard 4 litre as well, do we have a graph of a standard 4 S litre car, the advanced search system is still down.

[Don1]

I've got mine from a few years ago - will scan and put up at some point over the next few days.

[Don1]

As promised - the numbers from my old Sag engine.

[WolfyJones]

FFF 2
3000 260
3500 305
4000 340
4500 350
5000 360
5500 360
6000 355

4.5
3000 315
3500 330
4000 360
4500 370
5000 365
5500 355
6000 340

Racing 3.6
3000 260
3500 270
4000 270
4500 295
5000 310
5500 315
6000 320

Sag engine standard
3000 240
3500 250
4000 260
4500. 280
5000 285
5500. 290
6000 290

I know Joolz said his torque numbers were optimistic but still good when compared to a 4 litre, you can see from the above how much the fff2 and 4.5 engines have come on in terms of grunt (torque)

[DonkeyApple]

Would be useful to add CliveF's numbers as I believe his is a standard 4 but with heavily optimised breathing?

[RedSpike66]

DonkeyApple said:

Would be useful to add CliveF's numbers as I believe his is a standard 4 but with heavily optimised breathing?

clive f

Sagaris

4.0

GT cams RND,ported throttle bodies with thinned spindles, shorter inlet tract stainless steel airbox,custom injectors, lightened flywheel, decat, cross pipe, special exhaust.

417@7600rpm 340lb/ft@fly

Kits & Classics(Joolz, dyno dynamics)

Nov 2012

[WolfyJones]

RedSpike66 said:

clive f

Sagaris

4.0

GT cams RND,ported throttle bodies with thinned spindles, shorter inlet tract stainless steel airbox,custom injectors, lightened flywheel, decat, cross pipe, special exhaust.

417@7600rpm 340lb/ft@fly

Kits & Classics(Joolz, dyno dynamics)

Nov 2012

Need to see full graph to make a proper comparison.

[clive f]

here you go.

[Don1]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am loving the fact TVRs are now getting better and better. And Joolz, your numbers are stunning. Kudos.

[WolfyJones]

FFF 2
3000 260
3500 305
4000 340
4500 350
5000 360
5500 360
6000 355

4.5
3000 315
3500 330
4000 360
4500 370
5000 365
5500 355
6000 340

Racing 3.6
3000 260
3500 270
4000 270
4500 295
5000 310
5500 315
6000 320

Sag engine standard
3000 240
3500 250
4000 260
4500. 280
5000 285
5500. 290
6000 290

Clive F 4litre (special sag)
3000. 290
3500. 295
4000. 315
4500. 325
5000. 330
5500. 340
6000. 330

[WolfyJones]

How much would you say that extra punch has cost you Clive?

[DonkeyApple]

Don1 said:

I don't know about anyone else, but I am loving the fact TVRs are now getting better and better. And Joolz, your numbers are stunning. Kudos.

Too right. And who knows, one day in the near future we might even start matching the original factory claims.

I'm finding it really interesting seeing what can be achieved by addressing the in and out of an S6 before modding the engine itself, it seems to really show what a good design lies underneath the original cost cut build.

[clive f]

thats a tought one as I did it all myself, along with Joolz expertise on the airbox design and mapping wizardry,to try and summarise what I did buy,

lightened flywheel £380? from memory
bigger injectors £280
camshafts £300
plus 1 1/2 days on Joolz dyno, and a lot of time spent myself making the exhaust system,airbox and porting throttle bodies and thining spindles etc.

all done over the last 12 months, learning what to try next as you go along.

[WolfyJones]

As a Sag owner would like to see a Sagaris speed six RR shoot out,

Dons fff2 Sag (racing green)
Deans 4.5 ss Sag (power)
GV 4.3 Sag (str8six)
clives 4.0 Sag
Standard factory Sag

Same day same rolling road, I would contribute to the cost and I'm sure other Sag owners would as well so the guys wouldn't be out of pocket.

[WolfyJones]

Don1 said:

I don't know about anyone else, but I am loving the fact TVRs are now getting better and better. And Joolz, your numbers are stunning. Kudos.

What is the difference between your Sag and jonRB Sag, your Sag seems to perform better on the RR, do you know why this is?

[Don1]

In a word, breathing. I have the carbon ACT airbox with trumpets, and a (de)cat-back ACT exhaust. Jon is standard apart from decats.

As for the shoot-out - I'd prefer to go a step beyond. Get a 'known' motoring journalist to test them back to back, and then do a piece. Only then can people understand the differences between them. The FFF boys can talk about the smoothness of the engine, and how it revs, and the Power/Six boys can talk about the torque and the energy of the engine, but until an independant wordsmith actually does a piece about it, it's faceless people on the interweb nailing their colours to their mast of choice.

I wouldn't say it's needed to see who's is best, but rather what are the differences, to make them so much more than the (brilliant) original.

[DonkeyApple]

Don1 said:

In a word, breathing. I have the carbon ACT airbox with trumpets, and a (de)cat-back ACT exhaust. Jon is standard apart from decats.

As for the shoot-out - I'd prefer to go a step beyond. Get a 'known' motoring journalist to test them back to back, and then do a piece. Only then can people understand the differences between them. The FFF boys can talk about the smoothness of the engine, and how it revs, and the Power/Six boys can talk about the torque and the energy of the engine, but until an independant wordsmith actually does a piece about it, it's faceless people on the interweb nailing their colours to their mast of choice.

I wouldn't say it's needed to see who's is best, but rather what are the differences, to make them so much more than the (brilliant) original.

Glue some Porsche badges on them and Monkey might do it.

[WolfyJones]

It's a great idea but then you bring set up/dampers/tyres etc into the mix, it would be refreshing to see monkey test something less German.

[Don1]

Can Chris behave himself in cars? I ask this honestly, as he and Tiffney Dell need to have a powerslide-off....

As for the tyres/suspension - yes, totally agree. That'll be something for the journo to sort out...