Why do so few people ‘use all of the road’?

[waremark]

Monkeylegend said:

That was the premise of the thread title and opening post, hence my reason for getting involved.

We all maybe use the "racing line" on occasions but normally it will generally be within the confines of our lane which in itself is no issue, but to be completely on the other side of the road as a regular driving habit as suggested by the OP is fraught with danger in my opinion, when so many people of differing skill levels are using the same bit of tarmac, but going in the opposite direction.

People are constantly calling for ongoing driving tests/ assessments for the over 70's, can you imagine what they would do if they were faced by somebody coming round a corner on their side of the road, which would happen, if it was a method of driving many adopted.

We exist in a general state of order, so we usually know what to expect when we leave our front doors, I think its best we keep it that way as much as we can

I think this post illustrates the risk of being dangerously misunderstood when we discuss this topic. A good driver would only use the offside to improve visibility or stability if he already had a good enough view to be confident that no opposite direction traffic could be alarmed or confused.

Are there still any traffic cops out there? If so, I expect they will be pleasantly surprised if they see someone driving the way they have been trained themselves.

[wazztie16]

GOATever said:

I’m often driving early in the morning, or late at night. The roads are (typically) quieter than at other times of the day. As long as there are no solid white lines, and I can see what’s ahead clearly, I ‘use all of the road’ but I find that most people I know, religiously stick to the left lane, even when it was clear to use the other carriageway, on a twisty for example. Why do they not use the available road, to it’s full potential? I find it odd.

I use all of the road when I can, and my friend does when they're driving their bus at work, on certain bits of the route.

They tell me they're just slightly worried that a passenger may complain about them doing it, or they may be caught on camera if the cctv is pulled for any reason.

It's a shame that that's the way the world is nowadays.

[wazztie16]

Possibly slightly OT, is it legal to cut give way markings when turning into a junction? But not a solid Stop line.

If so, how many people, including advanced drivers, would know this?

I'm sure I read a news article which stated this, when a lady was run over by a driver cutting a give way.

It was emphasised that the action of cutting the junction WASN'T illegal itself, but obviously not advised.

I believe it was early morning, so not particularly busy.

[Dr Jekyll]

akirk said:

- if there are other people using the same tarmac but going in the other direction, then you wouldn’t be off-siding
- no-one over 70 is going to come around a corner to find mrs biggins barelling down at them on their side of the road...
you off-side simply to extend vision, which gives you the ability to see further ahead, and more time to spot other drivers... this means that you will be back on your own side of the road before the opposing traffic have even noticed that you exist...

just ask yourself the question - single lane NSL with no hazards and 10 miles clear view and no other traffic - does it matter which side of the road you are on? clearly not....

now - hairpin bends with solid hedging - clearly you are constantly on your own side...

it doesn’t take too much effort to work out that roads and bends come in all flavours in-between and that there are some where remaining on your side makes sense, and others where off-siding can increase view - in some cases, minimally (so don’t bother), in others, providing a dramatic improvement in sight-lines...

you say that you are not an advanced driver, yet seem convinced that your rigorous view is correct - others posting on here are, have had a lot of coaching and understand that learning more about driving means that you learn to adapt / make intelligent decisions continually as you drive - what is appropriate for one corner doesn’t work for the next / what works for this corner today, may not tomorrow in the rain and rush-hour...

+1 This

It isn't a question of 'advanced drivers' (horrible term) being encouraged to drive round corners on the offside as opposed to the nearside and to ignore the interests of other road users.

It's a question of being encouraged to be situationally aware and to look for opportunities to improve safety margins and minimise the chance of upsetting other road users. Which may mean offsiding on the approach to an open left hander with good but not perfect visibility and nobody coming the other way, or it might mean hugging the kerb on the approach to a blind left hander on a narrow road. As opposed to sticking to a fixed idea of what always constitutes the correct side of the road in all circumstances.

Which is why it's so infuriating when someone objects to a perfectly safe move on the basis that if the situation had been totally different it would have been the wrong thing to do.

[SOL111]

mrfunex said:

...but making progress is not making progress if you're having to stop and have a chat with a traffic officer for 20mins to explain why you consider yourself to be in the right, whilst they also needlessly run quick background checks on your tax, insurance, vehicle ownership, driving licence, tyres and probably breathalyse you for being 'all over the road'.

As mentioned before - why on earth would you even consider it?

I don't think you've been reading this discussion if you're having to ask the question tbh.

Don't mean to sound rude but.....

[mrfunex]

SOL111 said:

I don't think you've been reading this discussion if you're having to ask the question tbh.

Don't mean to sound rude but.....

The question “why on earth would you even consider it?” was, of course, regarding demonstrating your skills *whilst a police car was behind you and observing your behaviour*. This is as opposed to using all the road to improve many metrics on other occasions, which I agree with!

I’d suggest the best way to ‘make progress’ is to demonstrate all these skills but, unfortunately, to drive like any other normal chump when the 5-0 is right behind you. Sure, you may find that the officer concerned is in awe of the symphony of your road positioning, application of speed, appreciation of the limit point etc, but you’re equally likely to encounter one who cannot think beyond the ‘motorist was all over the road’ junk.

I have read the thread, I’m just being a realist. Other opinions may vary...

[SOL111]

mrfunex said:

The question “why on earth would you even consider it?” was, of course, regarding demonstrating your skills *whilst a police car was behind you and observing your behaviour*. This is as opposed to using all the road to improve many metrics on other occasions, which I agree with!

I’d suggest the best way to ‘make progress’ is to demonstrate all these skills but, unfortunately, to drive like any other normal chump when the 5-0 is right behind you. Sure, you may find that the officer concerned is in awe of the symphony of your road positioning, application of speed, appreciation of the limit point etc, but you’re equally likely to encounter one who cannot think beyond the ‘motorist was all over the road’ junk.

I have read the thread, I’m just being a realist. Other opinions may vary...

My answer is 'why not?'. Why would I possibly modify my driving because of police presence?

AD imo is not about peacocking 'skills' so feel like you're missing the point about 'awe' etc. If a police driving instructor has taught me to make use of the road then I'd argue that it'd be odd that an officer would pull someone over for doing exactly that.

I get the feeling that you're deliberately misinterpreting 'using the road' for something else, despite what's already been discussed here.

[mrfunex]

SOL111 said:

My answer is 'why not?'. Why would I possibly modify my driving because of police presence?

AD imo is not about peacocking 'skills' so feel like you're missing the point about 'awe' etc. If a police driving instructor has taught me to make use of the road then I'd argue that it'd be odd that an officer would pull someone over for doing exactly that.

I get the feeling that you're deliberately misinterpreting 'using the road' for something else, despite what's already been discussed here.

...because a police driving instructor is awfully better trained than the average bobby? I’m not deliberately misinterpreting anything - my point is not to invite undue attention.

[SOL111]

mrfunex said:

...because a police driving instructor is awfully better trained than the average bobby? I’m not deliberately misinterpreting anything - my point is not to invite undue attention.

How, by driving in a manner in which they've been taught?

It's only your perception that it would attract attention. Unless you're a police officer then I think I'd rather listen to someone who trains those who drive police cars.

Happy to stand corrected but I fail to see how a traffic officer would pull me over for crossing a centre line by some small arbitrary margin to gain better visibility. As previously mentioned, with possibly the exception of the op, no-one is taking about clipping the opposite kerb.

[nonsequitur]

Cliftonite said:

CABC said:

illegal in NZ. you can cross broken white lines solely to overtake.

That is sad! Soon to be part of the U.K.'s dumbed-down motoring experience when it occurs to the likes of Brake ?

Sorry Cliff, that can only be a good thing.

[nonsequitur]

Dogwatch said:

DocSteve said:

The principles involved here are:

- Link speed to available vision and grip
- Maximise visibility without compromising safety (and that includes 3rd party perception and their potential responses)

I don't find it bizarre that the average motorist doesn't do it - they are not thinking about what they are doing.
.

Not just on the public highway. There's a garden centre locally which has a one-way exit road with a wiggle in it. Easy and safe to 'straighten out' the wiggle but never seen anyone else do it.

I wonder why that is...

[nonsequitur]

Monkeylegend said:

What does the Highway Code say about "offsiding " ?

Keep left unless overtaking, I hope.

[Cliftonite]

nonsequitur said:

Cliftonite said:

CABC said:

illegal in NZ. you can cross broken white lines solely to overtake.

That is sad! Soon to be part of the U.K.'s dumbed-down motoring experience when it occurs to the likes of Brake ?

Sorry Cliff, that can only be a good thing.

.

This is an Advanced Driving thread, Woody!

Watch and learn!

[GOATever]

waremark said:

Monkeylegend said:

That was the premise of the thread title and opening post, hence my reason for getting involved.

We all maybe use the "racing line" on occasions but normally it will generally be within the confines of our lane which in itself is no issue, but to be completely on the other side of the road as a regular driving habit as suggested by the OP is fraught with danger in my opinion, when so many people of differing skill levels are using the same bit of tarmac, but going in the opposite direction.

People are constantly calling for ongoing driving tests/ assessments for the over 70's, can you imagine what they would do if they were faced by somebody coming round a corner on their side of the road, which would happen, if it was a method of driving many adopted.

We exist in a general state of order, so we usually know what to expect when we leave our front doors, I think its best we keep it that way as much as we can

I think this post illustrates the risk of being dangerously misunderstood when we discuss this topic. A good driver would only use the offside to improve visibility or stability if he already had a good enough view to be confident that no opposite direction traffic could be alarmed or confused.

Are there still any traffic cops out there? If so, I expect they will be pleasantly surprised if they see someone driving the way they have been trained themselves.

Quite right. I wasn’t advocating completely moving over to the right, unless it was definitely clear to do so, the conditions dictated it was safe to do so, there was a reason to do so, etc etc etc.

[nonsequitur]

Put simply, straightlining or moving to the right over the line, is a poor driving technique.
Because one day, not tomorrow not next week not even next year, someone you haven't seen will be coming the other way, in the other lane...

[waremark]

nonsequitur said:

Put simply, straightlining or moving to the right over the line, is a poor driving technique.
Because one day, not tomorrow not next week not even next year, someone you haven't seen will be coming the other way, in the other lane...

Well, if there is a person coming the other way in the other lane, and you haven't been able to see them when you thought you had seen that there wasn't anyone there (otherwise you would not have used the other lane) then perhaps you are equally likely to run into a vehicle in the nearside lane because you haven't see them.

[Dr Jekyll]

nonsequitur said:

Put simply, straightlining or moving to the right over the line, is a poor driving technique.
Because one day, not tomorrow not next week not even next year, someone you haven't seen will be coming the other way, in the other lane...

Is moving over the line to overtake poor technique?

[nonsequitur]

Dr Jekyll said:

nonsequitur said:

Put simply, straightlining or moving to the right over the line, is a poor driving technique.
Because one day, not tomorrow not next week not even next year, someone you haven't seen will be coming the other way, in the other lane...

Is moving over the line to overtake poor technique?

Of course not That is a considered and positive move (we hope). Straightlining is an opportunists folly.

[Dr Jekyll]

nonsequitur said:

Dr Jekyll said:

nonsequitur said:

Put simply, straightlining or moving to the right over the line, is a poor driving technique.
Because one day, not tomorrow not next week not even next year, someone you haven't seen will be coming the other way, in the other lane...

Is moving over the line to overtake poor technique?

Of course not That is a considered and positive move (we hope). Straightlining is an opportunists folly.

Either CAN be an opportunists folly, or can be a considered and positive move.

[otolith]

Does not follow. Appropriate!