When "helpful" is a bad idea on the road.
Discussion
InitialDave said:
AyBee said:
She wasn't in the road, she was waiting to cross. He made the turning and then stopped to let her cross.
That sounds correct."[You should] give way to pedestrians crossing or waiting to cross a road into which or from which you are turning"
AyBee said:
I guess that depends on your definition of where the junction is. This link shows a picture of what they mean and the car has stopped before making the turn. Having already made the turn and then randomly jamming on the anchors to let someone cross is a recipe for being rear-ended IMO, as it would be if I just decided on a straight road to stop for someone to cross. If your indicator is on, people anticipate you doing something so slow appropriately, if it's not on, they don't.
No link, but since it caused you a problem at the junction I think it is at least arguable that where he stopped was close enough to the junction to be at the junction.It's a stupid rule. Most drivers didn't know before that they were supposed to give way to people crossing at a junction and most won't know now that the HWC has added the recommendation to give way to those waiting to cross - but those few of us who know and who are conscientious will try to do what the HWC says.
I don't know if it's linked to the publicity made about how you shouldn't run people over, even when you are turning into the road they are already crossing, but recently I've noticed an uptick in people stopping to wave pedestrians over the road.
Seems daft to be moaning about people being courteous but they have been doing it in daft places where pedestrians aren't expecting it.
I fear we'll see people getting run over by impatient cretins overtaking the over-courteous cretins... One of the RIP grandad videos this week had a near miss where someone waved bemused pedestrians across a two lane road.
Seems daft to be moaning about people being courteous but they have been doing it in daft places where pedestrians aren't expecting it.
I fear we'll see people getting run over by impatient cretins overtaking the over-courteous cretins... One of the RIP grandad videos this week had a near miss where someone waved bemused pedestrians across a two lane road.
waremark said:
AyBee said:
I guess that depends on your definition of where the junction is. This link shows a picture of what they mean and the car has stopped before making the turn. Having already made the turn and then randomly jamming on the anchors to let someone cross is a recipe for being rear-ended IMO, as it would be if I just decided on a straight road to stop for someone to cross. If your indicator is on, people anticipate you doing something so slow appropriately, if it's not on, they don't.
No link, but since it caused you a problem at the junction I think it is at least arguable that where he stopped was close enough to the junction to be at the junction.It's a stupid rule. Most drivers didn't know before that they were supposed to give way to people crossing at a junction and most won't know now that the HWC has added the recommendation to give way to those waiting to cross - but those few of us who know and who are conscientious will try to do what the HWC says.
AyBee said:
waremark said:
AyBee said:
I guess that depends on your definition of where the junction is. This link shows a picture of what they mean and the car has stopped before making the turn. Having already made the turn and then randomly jamming on the anchors to let someone cross is a recipe for being rear-ended IMO, as it would be if I just decided on a straight road to stop for someone to cross. If your indicator is on, people anticipate you doing something so slow appropriately, if it's not on, they don't.
No link, but since it caused you a problem at the junction I think it is at least arguable that where he stopped was close enough to the junction to be at the junction.It's a stupid rule. Most drivers didn't know before that they were supposed to give way to people crossing at a junction and most won't know now that the HWC has added the recommendation to give way to those waiting to cross - but those few of us who know and who are conscientious will try to do what the HWC says.
After a while, I saw no other option than to edge gently forward and, as respectfully as I could, break the queue. The death stares I got were quite scary!
Other than the above, normal rules apply:
a) On approach, take in the information required, front, sides, andrear. Anticipate having to stop.
b) Adjust the speed accordingly. If someone is tailgating, then the speed should adjusted accordingly, in anticipation of a stop and with a pressure so as avoid being rear-ended. The speed will probably/definitely be slower than for someone following at a safe distance. The speed may be an irritation, but irritation trumps collision.
c) If there is reason to stop, stop before turning as the brake lights are seen more easily and the vehicle is not facing the pedestrians if your vehicle is hit.
Chamon_Lee said:
Honestly this annoys me a lot. Stopping a whole flow of traffic behind you to let one person out.
What's even worse is when you are the only car behind them and there is nothing coming the other way. Where it would be quicker and safer for both cars to pass the junction and then the driver who needs to join the main road can do so safely and, more importantly, when THEY feel it is safe to do so.It is a real pet hate of mine when people try and make decisions for other road users. The highway code is there for a reason, if everybody works to the same set of rules, everything will go smoothly and efficiently.
BertBert said:
Mandat said:
Misplaced courtesy causes confusion and accidents.
A well known maxim taught in advanced driving.
But I've never seen an incident caused it nearly cause by it.A well known maxim taught in advanced driving.
We've all encountered situations where someone thinks they're being courteous but in reality they should have just kept going, at a *constant speed if appropriate* and just let you sort it out.
The * is to highlight that it's not just flashing or physically stopping that creates confusion but noticeable speed and position changes can result in unhelpful messages. Just as speeding up to close down space is unhelpful, also there are times when slowing down significantly can send a message that you're going to let someone go when in reality you're not.
Having said that there are situations where easing off eases traffic flow, and it's a complicated situation where easing off to give yourself more time in a situation with obvious and/or numerous potential hazards can be misinterpreted. Guess partly talking about the sort of situations seen in so many YT videos where the cammer turns pretty much a non event into something by either speeding up or flagrantly maintaining full pace into a place when a minor lift off the gas would fix things.
The * is to highlight that it's not just flashing or physically stopping that creates confusion but noticeable speed and position changes can result in unhelpful messages. Just as speeding up to close down space is unhelpful, also there are times when slowing down significantly can send a message that you're going to let someone go when in reality you're not.
Having said that there are situations where easing off eases traffic flow, and it's a complicated situation where easing off to give yourself more time in a situation with obvious and/or numerous potential hazards can be misinterpreted. Guess partly talking about the sort of situations seen in so many YT videos where the cammer turns pretty much a non event into something by either speeding up or flagrantly maintaining full pace into a place when a minor lift off the gas would fix things.
R56Cooper said:
Mandat said:
Misplaced courtesy causes confusion and accidents.
A well known maxim taught in advanced driving.
One of my favourites (sad I know). A well known maxim taught in advanced driving.
People seem to think that being flashed out means the person trying to help has checked there’s no traffic approaching from any angle, which often isn’t the case.
mattyprice4004 said:
True though - I live in a town full of dodder’s pensioners and the amount of minor scrapes and bumps for flashing people out of junctions when entirely inappropriate must be huge.
People seem to think that being flashed out means the person trying to help has checked there’s no traffic approaching from any angle, which often isn’t the case.
You must have seen some or maybe many then if they are that prevalent.People seem to think that being flashed out means the person trying to help has checked there’s no traffic approaching from any angle, which often isn’t the case.
Really grinds my gears when people (on the major road) slow or stop to let someone out from a minor road, creating the gap in the traffic they need.
But if they had paid attention to their mirrors, they would see that there is a gap already, behind them. And the best thing they could do to help the car trying to pull out, is just get a move on and carry on the way they were travelling!
But if they had paid attention to their mirrors, they would see that there is a gap already, behind them. And the best thing they could do to help the car trying to pull out, is just get a move on and carry on the way they were travelling!
Olivergt said:
You only have to watch any of the "Bad Driving" videos on YT to see plenty of examples where misplaced courtesy causes a crash.
Did that search, chose the top one, got to 8:47 before running out of the will to live and couldn't see any misplaced courtesy incidents in however many there are in the first 8mins and 47 seconds! Just supports my view that it really isn't a very common thing!Chamon_Lee said:
Honestly this annoys me a lot. Stopping a whole flow of traffic behind you to let one person out.
Absolutely! There are occasions when you can, sensibly, let someone out, without holding the vehicles behind you up, at least not stopping them, and that's not a bad thing, but if the person to whom you've been "kind" then trundles along at 35mph when there's no hope of overtaking...911hope said:
We've seen a situation where a road user tries to be kind to another, but creates unintended risk elsewhere.
An example being.
Braking to let someone out of a side road, when cars are following behind. The kind one has inflicted a risk on to theirself and those behind.
Any other similar cases?
Have this all the time where it would have been faster for everyone if they'd just carried on and I waited and pulled out as normal.An example being.
Braking to let someone out of a side road, when cars are following behind. The kind one has inflicted a risk on to theirself and those behind.
Any other similar cases?
1. Kind lady stopped to let me reverse out of a parking bay at the local shops. Problem: a MkIII Focus is a lot longer than the space she had allowed me, And she wouldn't reverse until I got out and explained. Sadly we parted on somewhat frosty terms.
2. Slow traffic through road widening works (long overdue). Cone central. Ambulance on blues-and-twos coming up behind as best he can but little room for overtaking. Bloke up ahead - ironically just about to exit the works - spots blues in his mirror and hits the brakes. Everything stops.
2. Slow traffic through road widening works (long overdue). Cone central. Ambulance on blues-and-twos coming up behind as best he can but little room for overtaking. Bloke up ahead - ironically just about to exit the works - spots blues in his mirror and hits the brakes. Everything stops.
Gassing Station | Advanced Driving | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff