Teaching youngsters to drive and associated hazards.
Discussion
gridgway said:
...They do not fear the consequences. Just like they don't fear the consequences of binge drinking, fighting and getting mixed up with plod on a friday night.
You raise some interesting points here. With regards to driving, I think that many young people feel invincible. It isn't until they have an accident that they get a wake-up call. Well, one would hope that they would.
I believe that many social problems stem from a lack of respect, respect for other people, authority, property and even self-respect. It isn't a problem peculiar to our country either. We appear to have developed a culture in which people want instant gratification, with little thought given to the long term consequences of their actions.
EmmaP said:
You raise some interesting points here. With regards to driving, I think that many young people feel invincible. It isn't until they have an accident that they get a wake-up call. Well, one would hope that they would.
I believe that many social problems stem from a lack of respect, respect for other people, authority, property and even self-respect. It isn't a problem peculiar to our country either. We appear to have developed a culture in which people want instant gratification, with little thought given to the long term consequences of their actions.
I believe that many social problems stem from a lack of respect, respect for other people, authority, property and even self-respect. It isn't a problem peculiar to our country either. We appear to have developed a culture in which people want instant gratification, with little thought given to the long term consequences of their actions.
Zero Risk Theory deals with your first point Emma. If there is no hurt there is no risk. Even an accident such as rolling a car may not change the behaviour. Usually a serious injury is required to reinforce the lesson.
The lack of respect might just be influenced in some way by seeing others not respecting guidelines such as the Highway Code and driving on the wrong side of the road. They may not be aware of the context and just see someone else breaking the rules. Misunderstood 'Advanced' driving that encourages people to disobey the Highway Code and fails to look at the bigger picture and social consequences is in its on small way partly to blame. An expert driver will take this into account and drive as an example to all.
If we are not socially responsible why should we expect others to be. How about a commitment from everyone on here to stick to the two second rule at all times?
We have a problem here.
It's to do with young people and growing up.
I was once young, I was immortal.
I explored the boundaries.
In many areas.
As a Society we have to recognise that the young will always do that.
Otherwise they will feel that they are not really living.
Deny the young those feelings and they will never be successful adults.
It's to do with young people and growing up.
I was once young, I was immortal.
I explored the boundaries.
In many areas.
As a Society we have to recognise that the young will always do that.
Otherwise they will feel that they are not really living.
Deny the young those feelings and they will never be successful adults.
BliarOut said:
I'm a successful adult. I died in a motorbike accident aged 19. Fortunately I'm feeling much better now 
It's one of the reasons I'm concerned as I too was invincible at that age. If I can prevent him spending a year learning to walk again as I had to then it has to be a good thing.
It's one of the reasons I'm concerned as I too was invincible at that age. If I can prevent him spending a year learning to walk again as I had to then it has to be a good thing.
I understand what you're saying, however, it is difficult to teach experience.
You will do what you can to try to impress the possible consequences of exploring the boundaries.
My view though is that risktaking is what has brought Humans to their current position.
The problem is defining acceptable risks.
What Columbus, you going to sail into the dark void?
You done a risk assessment on that?
Surely BlairOut is letting the lad explore, but with more experience and knowledge to help him *when* things go wrong?
To be honest I with I knew someone like BlairOut who would be prepared to go out with me and tell me what I was doing wrong and give some constructive criticism, rather than what people generally do which is scream
To be honest I with I knew someone like BlairOut who would be prepared to go out with me and tell me what I was doing wrong and give some constructive criticism, rather than what people generally do which is scream
I think Blairout is to be commended for his efforts....
I wasn't a particularly exuberant youth, and I only had a volvo 340 to hoon about it, but I got myself into tricky situations and crossed the line of safety a number of times in my first few years of driving. My dad did his best to help but he's not the best teacher (of driving) nor the best driver out there. I remember a couple of moments pre-test that basically made him stop getting in the car with me, which is the WRONG reaction! I remember being shocked after passing my test at how little I knew and had experienced. It's dark??? They didn't prepare me for that! Inner cities? They didn't teach me that! I wish that the learning curve had been softened by having someone wiling to help like Blairout.
Far too many young people are getting killed on out roads. I have no doubt that sober and progressive tuition, before and after the test could save hundreds of lives a year. The fact that you tend to pass your test at the age where you also want to go new places fast and impress girls/mates makes this even more important.
Bliarout: Keep up the good work. Maybe tone it down a little, build his experience gently, then begin to push the boundaries of his experience after he's passed DSA and you don't have to worry about that. You could be saving his life, and that of his friends and you can only be praised for that.
I wasn't a particularly exuberant youth, and I only had a volvo 340 to hoon about it, but I got myself into tricky situations and crossed the line of safety a number of times in my first few years of driving. My dad did his best to help but he's not the best teacher (of driving) nor the best driver out there. I remember a couple of moments pre-test that basically made him stop getting in the car with me, which is the WRONG reaction! I remember being shocked after passing my test at how little I knew and had experienced. It's dark??? They didn't prepare me for that! Inner cities? They didn't teach me that! I wish that the learning curve had been softened by having someone wiling to help like Blairout.
Far too many young people are getting killed on out roads. I have no doubt that sober and progressive tuition, before and after the test could save hundreds of lives a year. The fact that you tend to pass your test at the age where you also want to go new places fast and impress girls/mates makes this even more important.
Bliarout: Keep up the good work. Maybe tone it down a little, build his experience gently, then begin to push the boundaries of his experience after he's passed DSA and you don't have to worry about that. You could be saving his life, and that of his friends and you can only be praised for that.
BliarOut said:
I'm a successful adult. I died in a motorbike accident aged 19. Fortunately I'm feeling much better now
It's one of the reasons I'm concerned as I too was invincible at that age. If I can prevent him spending a year learning to walk again as I had to then it has to be a good thing.
It's one of the reasons I'm concerned as I too was invincible at that age. If I can prevent him spending a year learning to walk again as I had to then it has to be a good thing.
Hi Blairout..I`ve seen you popping in & out the biker banter forum a few times...I didn`t know you were a 2 wheels man....
Car control skills & hazard perception are crucial skills to give to the young....but despite some young drivers skill level...there remains IMO a natural desire to go too fast as a young driver....getting that out of their driving habits usually takes a few scares/moments or mistakes before the message sinks in around 21....but they do need extra information on the issues you`ve raised...New drivers like to think being in a car....it will protect them...It can be an eyeopener to see just how utterly mangled an apparently solid vehicle becomes when striking something solid and rooted to the ground like a tree or pole....2 of my pals from school upon passing the driving test managed to collide their car with a tree in the first week.. smashing both kneecaps each.
Best of luck with the young lad.
Edited by F.M on Friday 23 February 10:19
WeirdNeville said:
I remember a couple of moments pre-test that basically made him stop getting in the car with me, which is the WRONG reaction!
My mum still refuses to get into a car with me unless its absolutely necessary, and even then she just spends the whole journey whinging about my driving. This was after one slightly 'off' experience going through those traffic calming chicane things - apparently I was too close to one or something. [may have been mentioned before so ignore if so] BlairOut, have you thought about putting him through a CBT? My one years bike experience has taught me so much about adverse conditions, which has probably saved me a couple of times during the winter. It might just show him how vulnerable he is and to watch out for other road users, and it could be a very good day.
southpaw said:
WeirdNeville said:
I remember a couple of moments pre-test that basically made him stop getting in the car with me, which is the WRONG reaction!
My mum still refuses to get into a car with me unless its absolutely necessary, and even then she just spends the whole journey whinging about my driving. This was after one slightly 'off' experience going through those traffic calming chicane things - apparently I was too close to one or something. [may have been mentioned before so ignore if so] BlairOut, have you thought about putting him through a CBT? My one years bike experience has taught me so much about adverse conditions, which has probably saved me a couple of times during the winter. It might just show him how vulnerable he is and to watch out for other road users, and it could be a very good day.
southpaw said:
[quote=WeirdNeville][may have been mentioned before so ignore if so] BlairOut, have you thought about putting him through a CBT? My one years bike experience has taught me so much about adverse conditions, which has probably saved me a couple of times during the winter. It might just show him how vulnerable he is and to watch out for other road users, and it could be a very good day.
A lot of people say that riding a motorbike improves car driving ability, but I haven't found it to be so. I rode a 50cc moped for eighteen months but I don't feel it has made me a better car driver. Of course, I don't know what my driving would have been like had I not ridden a moped, but when I'm in my car I don't relate any of my riding experience to my driving. They feel like totally different things. Maybe you need to have a 'proper' bike to gain the benefit.
SamHH said:
southpaw said:
[quote=WeirdNeville][may have been mentioned before so ignore if so] BlairOut, have you thought about putting him through a CBT? My one years bike experience has taught me so much about adverse conditions, which has probably saved me a couple of times during the winter. It might just show him how vulnerable he is and to watch out for other road users, and it could be a very good day.
A lot of people say that riding a motorbike improves car driving ability, but I haven't found it to be so. I rode a 50cc moped for eighteen months but I don't feel it has made me a better car driver. Of course, I don't know what my driving would have been like had I not ridden a moped, but when I'm in my car I don't relate any of my riding experience to my driving. They feel like totally different things. Maybe you need to have a 'proper' bike to gain the benefit.
You're probably more aware of grip levels and the intentions of other drivers as a result of riding a bike. I found it gave me a very untrusting outlook towards cars as they often don't see you unless you position yourself so that they can.
When I started out behind the wheel of a car, my driving only started to "come together" when Dad took me out for long drives of over an hour on faster A and B roads heading between villages and dealing with manoeuvres as they came, rather than trundling around the urban environment searching for things to do. Bouncing around townscapes I was only ever getting better at DSA set pieces like parking and turning.
I don't think I developed anything close to an acceptable standard until I drove in Coventry and the surrounding area for a couple of years, including a lot of night driving in poor conditions. In a city you have to get things right and quickly with it, you can't just crawl slowly along hoping everything will be okay. Having a crap car with appalling brakes helped a whole lot, too.
Attitude is vital though, even at 24 I still find something to learn from nearly every drive. The second someone says, "I know everything there is to know about driving", they've made a turn towards Shit Driving Close (Cul-De-Sac).
I don't think I developed anything close to an acceptable standard until I drove in Coventry and the surrounding area for a couple of years, including a lot of night driving in poor conditions. In a city you have to get things right and quickly with it, you can't just crawl slowly along hoping everything will be okay. Having a crap car with appalling brakes helped a whole lot, too.
Attitude is vital though, even at 24 I still find something to learn from nearly every drive. The second someone says, "I know everything there is to know about driving", they've made a turn towards Shit Driving Close (Cul-De-Sac).
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