The Running Thread Vol 2
Discussion
smn159 said:
It's two weeks now since London and my legs still felt like they had lead in them as I struggled around a slow 10k this morning
Marlow 5 next week; hopefully legs will co-operate by then.
Just signed up to Marlow 5 this morning. PB of 29:40ish was set back in about 2007 so hoping to blast through that next weekend...... Just got to go to NY and back with before that Marlow 5 next week; hopefully legs will co-operate by then.
Cybertronian said:
Question for everyone: how short would a race have to be before you would no longer consider it eligible?
I'm looking for a fast September half marathon due to a baby on its way in October, and the Lake Vyrnwy Half Marathon looks like it ticks all the boxes. However, looking at many people's Strava records of it, it consistently comes up as low as 12.98 miles and as long as only 13.05 miles. It is on runbritain and Power of 10, so is licensed, but I can't shake the feeling that it probably is short.
I'd have thought it's more likely that part of the course has bad or no GPS reception so people GPS tracks don't follow the route properly, especially if its twisty. Plus if it's hilly GPS will under read as it's only recording the horizontal distance.I'm looking for a fast September half marathon due to a baby on its way in October, and the Lake Vyrnwy Half Marathon looks like it ticks all the boxes. However, looking at many people's Strava records of it, it consistently comes up as low as 12.98 miles and as long as only 13.05 miles. It is on runbritain and Power of 10, so is licensed, but I can't shake the feeling that it probably is short.
RizzoTheRat said:
I'd have thought it's more likely that part of the course has bad or no GPS reception so people GPS tracks don't follow the route properly, especially if its twisty. Plus if it's hilly GPS will under read as it's only recording the horizontal distance.
It's a pretty flat route, though looks like there may be a few spots where GPS isn't as sensitive as it should be. I've taken another look at the route and decided to replot it. Comes out as 13.09 to 13.11 based on minor adjustments to the start and finish lines.Reviewing a number of the Strava traces, turns out there are a few corners that are regularly cut. Decided to go with it and the 1pm start means I can sleep in my own bed and avoid an overnight stay.
Cybertronian said:
It's a pretty flat route, though looks like there may be a few spots where GPS isn't as sensitive as it should be. I've taken another look at the route and decided to replot it. Comes out as 13.09 to 13.11 based on minor adjustments to the start and finish lines.
Reviewing a number of the Strava traces, turns out there are a few corners that are regularly cut. Decided to go with it and the 1pm start means I can sleep in my own bed and avoid an overnight stay.
Been meaning to run this for many years, and now live close enough. Funny you mention the distance, as over the years many competitors have put in suspiciously fast times. If it looks like a duck...Reviewing a number of the Strava traces, turns out there are a few corners that are regularly cut. Decided to go with it and the 1pm start means I can sleep in my own bed and avoid an overnight stay.
On that, I used to target the suspiciously fast races around London / Essex. Annoyingly one of my clubmates I was competitive with at the time was the founder of Athleticsdata (now AKA Power of 10). As soon as he saw my results / GPS he'd mark the course short for that and previous years. Wiped off many PBs including Hatfield Broad Oak, the Derby midweek 4.98km, Shinfield (not quite) 10km, and the Sidcup 'almost' 10.
Whilst with every short course there are those who, in desperation to keep their shiny PB, claim GPS is not accurate etc, when enough traces read under, there's no smoke without fire.
With courses 2m per km longer than the 'on the tin' distance, and the aggression that I see course measurers take the tangents (taking curves I could not possible run at pace), and that many people start some way behind the start line, I'd fully expect GPS to come out a little over distance 99% of the time.
onedsla said:
Been meaning to run this for many years, and now live close enough. Funny you mention the distance, as over the years many competitors have put in suspiciously fast times. If it looks like a duck...
On that, I used to target the suspiciously fast races around London / Essex. Annoyingly one of my clubmates I was competitive with at the time was the founder of Athleticsdata (now AKA Power of 10). As soon as he saw my results / GPS he'd mark the course short for that and previous years. Wiped off many PBs including Hatfield Broad Oak, the Derby midweek 4.98km, Shinfield (not quite) 10km, and the Sidcup 'almost' 10.
Whilst with every short course there are those who, in desperation to keep their shiny PB, claim GPS is not accurate etc, when enough traces read under, there's no smoke without fire.
With courses 2m per km longer than the 'on the tin' distance, and the aggression that I see course measurers take the tangents (taking curves I could not possible run at pace), and that many people start some way behind the start line, I'd fully expect GPS to come out a little over distance 99% of the time.
Useful thoughts - thank you! Will you enter the race? Registration just opened this morning.On that, I used to target the suspiciously fast races around London / Essex. Annoyingly one of my clubmates I was competitive with at the time was the founder of Athleticsdata (now AKA Power of 10). As soon as he saw my results / GPS he'd mark the course short for that and previous years. Wiped off many PBs including Hatfield Broad Oak, the Derby midweek 4.98km, Shinfield (not quite) 10km, and the Sidcup 'almost' 10.
Whilst with every short course there are those who, in desperation to keep their shiny PB, claim GPS is not accurate etc, when enough traces read under, there's no smoke without fire.
With courses 2m per km longer than the 'on the tin' distance, and the aggression that I see course measurers take the tangents (taking curves I could not possible run at pace), and that many people start some way behind the start line, I'd fully expect GPS to come out a little over distance 99% of the time.
I completely agree that when there's too many people with short GPS traces, there's possibly-probably a problem with the distance. I've managed to find a few people with 13.09 and 13.10 miles recorded, though it's still far from the 13.14 to 13.18 miles you often see with most half marathons. Looking at the best case GPS examples, there still appears to be one particular sharp turn where all of the GPS traces fail to follow the course, whether it's the satellite imagery map view or normal map view.
I recall a few years ago where I ran a massive 10k PB, beating what I thought was realistically achievable. My instincts were right and a marshal had placed a switchback cone in the wrong place, resulting in a race that was some 150m+ short. Frustratingly, I still would have narrowly achieved a PB that day if the course was correct and it took months before I had another chance on a similarly flat and fast course to better that day's erroneous result.
Challo said:
I have Edinburgh at the end of the month, and attempted my last long run yesterday in the heat. Slight error of going out late morning as was very hot and only lasted 3hours (20miles). Was hoping to get up to 22miles but heat was too much and felt exhausted at the end.
Fingers crossed that won’t cause too many problems on the big day. Hoping for a sub 4hr
I'm doing it too, my third Edinburgh. Looking forward to seeing the new start/route alteration. It's about as flat a course as you can get after mile 4, so I'm sure you'll be fineFingers crossed that won’t cause too many problems on the big day. Hoping for a sub 4hr
An absolutely superb three days mountain running in the Lakes on the Silva Great Lakeland 3 Day, I've never seen the lakes looking so good and although water got marginal at times there were a few pubs around to keep you refreshed! The event is very laid back so pick and choose your courses/effort levels, food and beer available at the camps and superb organisation as usual for Ohrea events. A great entrée for full on mountain marathons or a hard challenge on the expert course - you decide! Can't think of a better way to spend a long weekend, and doing it with my wife on our 22nd anniversary made it even more special.
Overnight at Buttermere -
Overnight at Buttermere -
I have a 'regular' 10K trail route that I was doing once every couple of weeks through last summer. Went for a trot along it yesterday and found it very hard going as it was quite overgrown in places and still waterlogged and muddy in other spots while being rock-hard and clear elsewhere. Surprisingly tiring!
Cybertronian said:
Useful thoughts - thank you! Will you enter the race? Registration just opened this morning.
Just seen the date and it clashes with a race I'm running for my kid's school to raise a memorial fund for a kid who died in a traffic accident last year. The school head master plus multiple teachers & parents are running, so would be rude not to. Lake Vyrnwy will still be there next year (if a little longer by then).Logistically I could do both, but don't think it's a great idea given I'll be in 5000m training through the summer!
Bounced back quite well from London and ran a Northern League 5000 on Saturday. Was a tough week with a midweek 20 and a couple of tempo runs thrown in. Went off cautiously given my lack of running under 5:40 pace and was pleased to be able to accelerate through the race with mile splits of approx 5:17, 5:14, 5:09 to work through the field and finish a distant 2nd (and the only runner not to be lapped by the winner).
Having managed another 2.5hr run in the sunshine yesterday, I've decided to give the Liverpool marathon a shot. Will provide the opportunity to experiment a little, with minimal taper, long runs closer to race day and a couple of track races thrown into the final 15 days. Hopefully I have an endurance boost from London and the Northern weather should be a little kinder (though not if this weekend was anything to go by). Never raced marathons closer than ~6 months apart before, so curious to see how it goes.
mon the fish said:
Challo said:
I have Edinburgh at the end of the month, and attempted my last long run yesterday in the heat. Slight error of going out late morning as was very hot and only lasted 3hours (20miles). Was hoping to get up to 22miles but heat was too much and felt exhausted at the end.
Fingers crossed that won’t cause too many problems on the big day. Hoping for a sub 4hr
I'm doing it too, my third Edinburgh. Looking forward to seeing the new start/route alteration. It's about as flat a course as you can get after mile 4, so I'm sure you'll be fineFingers crossed that won’t cause too many problems on the big day. Hoping for a sub 4hr
Also my girlfriend is coming up to watch, but I have no idea where is good for her to go and try and see me on the course. Any recommendations?
VEA said:
feef said:
In looking at pace, I find myself more interested in seeing if I can go for longer, rather than go faster. Anyone else just not inspired by chasing a faster pace?
Yup, me. I also really don't enjoy running with others or at organised events.
Maybe I'm odd.
When I was cycling more, I did, for example, the 4-Shires Sportive which had a 60mile and 100mile option. I had done weekly club runs with my local cycling club of 40 miles, and occasionally done an additional 20 miles on my own later in the day so knew 60 miles was well within my ability, so I chose the 100mile loop. Averaged 15mph and finished in 7:46. Certainly not the fastest, but I was happy with it.
Similarly with running, after the Wimpole Half Trail in October, I expect I'll be more interested in finding something longer rather than doing it again and trying to go faster
Interesting about running further rather than faster. I took up running later having been an amateur footballer and had the fitness and some speed but focused on getting a marathon done.
Now in my 40's I am getting quicker even over the shorter speeds (albeit with not amazing times, but good enough for me) In a race, I am not racing others but racing myself as it's times I want to beat rather than people. That said, most of my running is not training, it's just going for a jog and enjoying it either alone or with friends.
Sometimes I just like to be out there on my own and sometimes, I like to belt out mile reps . Each to their own, as long as people enjoy it
Now in my 40's I am getting quicker even over the shorter speeds (albeit with not amazing times, but good enough for me) In a race, I am not racing others but racing myself as it's times I want to beat rather than people. That said, most of my running is not training, it's just going for a jog and enjoying it either alone or with friends.
Sometimes I just like to be out there on my own and sometimes, I like to belt out mile reps . Each to their own, as long as people enjoy it
ker 
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