Discussion
Trophy Husband said:
Sorry, I just don't get what justifies Eddie Jones talking about the All Blacks and beating them? Let's get it right. England beat Wales on two very dodgy penalty decisions and the linesman ruling North out of play when he slipped the winning inside pass at the death. Add the 5 minutes resetting the scrum under the posts due to constant England transgressions which I think is cynical foul play (Hence the moron Cole being binned eventually). Suddenly world beaters! My wobbly eye.
Hartley? A cheat. Every time the opposition weer penalised for not rolling away, he was there, doing nothing to contribute to the ruck except stopping the player moving away. I counted 4 occasions when he did this against Wales alone. If you are not active in the ruck WTF are you doing there if not to cheat?
OK I'll bite. I haven't heard about Jones and beating the AB's. BUT Wales were sHartley? A cheat. Every time the opposition weer penalised for not rolling away, he was there, doing nothing to contribute to the ruck except stopping the player moving away. I counted 4 occasions when he did this against Wales alone. If you are not active in the ruck WTF are you doing there if not to cheat?
te against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
a311 said:
OK I'll bite. I haven't heard about Jones and beating the AB's. BUT Wales were ste against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?
No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Knocked out of home world cup in group stage to "best in Europe" (end of) in 5 months. Despite still being ranked beneath Wales in world rankings.te against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Lets not get carried away.
el stovey said:
a311 said:
OK I'll bite. I haven't heard about Jones and beating the AB's. BUT Wales were ste against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?
No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Knocked out of home world cup in group stage to "best in Europe" (end of) in 5 months. Despite still being ranked beneath Wales in world rankings.te against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Lets not get carried away.
Will we beat the AB's if we played them tomorrow? No! Not a f
king chance, but are we the best team in an imperfect European game? Well, quite frankly yes we are. Wales will get the chance to beat us in May - and they could do it, they could fall. Who knows but until next year England are the champions and no amount of crying and whinging about 'not fair' will change that 
a311 said:
OK I'll bite. I haven't heard about Jones and beating the AB's. BUT Wales were ste against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?
No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Yep, there's a few Welshmen with some serious large blinkers on after the England match. I don't blame them.te against England for 60 mins and if England were a bit more clinical and less brain dead could have put 40 plus points on the board. What about your man staying on the pitch after making contact with someone's eye?No one here including myself is calling England world beaters, I think this team has a lot of potential though. For now they are the best team in Europe-end of!
Eddie Jones said:
Can we beat the All Blacks? Of course we can.
We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Not particularly controversial, surely?We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Kermit power said:
Given that the Irish rugby team has been one of the few things able to unite everyone in the island of Ireland in a positive fashion over the decades, why on earth would you want to break it up???
0000 said:
...
Yep, there's a few Welshmen with some serious large blinkers on after the England match. I don't blame them.
...
Possibly the most pleasing result of the 6 Nations. Everything is evidently OK in the world if the chippy provincials start whining about the English winning. Eddie Jones must think his work is already done Yep, there's a few Welshmen with some serious large blinkers on after the England match. I don't blame them.
...
As much as the World Cup suggested otherwise, in top tier sport the margins are relatively small. A small positive change in one team and a small negative in another can end up giving a big shift. I fully expect us to get little/nothing out of this year's tours, but...the Kiwis are without their two best players now. Look at what happened to Ireland when the same thing happened...I'm of course not seriously comparing the two sides, but change cuts all ways.
Building up to Japan is what it's all about. If we can get some more Grand Slams between now and then to upset the Welsh and the Scots, all the better
el stovey said:
Woah, where have all these England rugby fans come from, it wasn't like this during the World Cup. 
I think there were plenty of us around. Only for the group games though We were obviously very jealous of the extra 80 minutes the other home nations teams gots though.
Edited by London424 on Monday 21st March 16:08
All Black's winning the world cup makes them the best team in the world.
England winning the 6N makes them the best team in Europe currently until the next one.
Or am I missing something?
http://www.worldrugby.org/rankings#mru
England are now ranked at 4th in the world and Wales 5th. Argentina are ranked 6th. I believe if they played each tomorrow they'd be two close games with Argentina possibly shading it on their world cup form but who knows.
England are the the best team in Europe and 4th best in the world.
Wales are the second best team and 5th best in the world.
In conclusion England are better than Wales.
England winning the 6N makes them the best team in Europe currently until the next one.
Or am I missing something?
http://www.worldrugby.org/rankings#mru
England are now ranked at 4th in the world and Wales 5th. Argentina are ranked 6th. I believe if they played each tomorrow they'd be two close games with Argentina possibly shading it on their world cup form but who knows.
England are the the best team in Europe and 4th best in the world.
Wales are the second best team and 5th best in the world.
In conclusion England are better than Wales.
Come now, let's not bicker
I'd certainly agree that winning a Grand Slam is no guarantor of success against the Southern Hemisphere teams or in a World Cup (Wales have proved that beyond doubt in recent times). And I'd also agree that failing to win the Six Nations is no bar to beating the All Blacks or other Southern Hemisphere teams (England have proved that).
I'm sure we all agree.
I'd certainly agree that winning a Grand Slam is no guarantor of success against the Southern Hemisphere teams or in a World Cup (Wales have proved that beyond doubt in recent times). And I'd also agree that failing to win the Six Nations is no bar to beating the All Blacks or other Southern Hemisphere teams (England have proved that).
I'm sure we all agree.
Went to an away match on Saturday and found myself in a group of English, Irish and Welsh supporters, the first two nationalities having a gentle dig at the Welsh duo. I was brought in and confessed to being half English half Irish so would support anything the first two said.
A Welsh bloke, in good humour, said that the problem with the Irish and English is that when they win they are insufferably arrogant. Wanting to be fair, I asked, "What about the Scots?"
The whole group went quiet, looked to each other, shrugged and one said, "How would we know?"
The laughter was so loud and prolonged that others came up to ask what had been said.
It seemed hilarious at the time, and still quite good now that the matches have been played. The Welsh bloke said that he wasn't looking forward to the England match as he was sure they had the beating of the French. His tone was such that it set us all off again.
Despite my team losing, it was a good match with some old-fashioned supporters, clapping our tries when we made a strong, but unsuccessful, comeback.
A Welsh bloke, in good humour, said that the problem with the Irish and English is that when they win they are insufferably arrogant. Wanting to be fair, I asked, "What about the Scots?"
The whole group went quiet, looked to each other, shrugged and one said, "How would we know?"
The laughter was so loud and prolonged that others came up to ask what had been said.
It seemed hilarious at the time, and still quite good now that the matches have been played. The Welsh bloke said that he wasn't looking forward to the England match as he was sure they had the beating of the French. His tone was such that it set us all off again.
Despite my team losing, it was a good match with some old-fashioned supporters, clapping our tries when we made a strong, but unsuccessful, comeback.
Derek Smith said:
Despite my team losing, it was a good match with some old-fashioned supporters, clapping our tries when we made a strong, but unsuccessful, comeback.
Your lot were a bit of a rarity this weekend. Only that match and Sidcup/Havant finished in bonus point territory, and the average winning margin for the whole of London 1 South was over 32 points!!!Anyway, until there's a London 1 South thread, back to the Six Nations...
0000 said:
Eddie Jones said:
Can we beat the All Blacks? Of course we can.
We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Not particularly controversial, surely?We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Scotland: never beaten the ABs
Ireland: never beaten the ABs.
Wales: haven't beaten the ABs in over 50 years.
Hope springs eternal, and all that...
Greg66 said:
0000 said:
Eddie Jones said:
Can we beat the All Blacks? Of course we can.
We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Not particularly controversial, surely?We can't now but we will in the future. Why else play rugby if you don't think you can beat the All Blacks?
Scotland: never beaten the ABs
Ireland: never beaten the ABs.
Wales: haven't beaten the ABs in over 50 years.
Hope springs eternal, and all that...
radambc said:
Not necessarily. There is a proposal that instead of direct relegation, the bottom team would play a play-off over two legs against Georgia, thereby giving them a chance to redeem themselves.
The current situation of a glass ceiling for Georgia (or whoever else might win the European Nations Cup) is unsatisfactory, unfair and unsporting.
Having a play-off arrangement would give Georgia a crack at a chance of playing in the 6 Nations, but would also give Italy (or Scotland or France or whoever) a chance to save themselves. And if they fail to save themselves, then so be it. That's sport. It's not healthy to maintain the current cosy closed shop. If for example, Georgia beat Italy in a play-off over two legs then they deserve to be in the 6 nations and Italy don't.
The problem with that scenario is that you'd simply weaken Italian rugby even further, and hamper its development even more. Add the attrition of two extra test matches after a much more bruising tournament than the ENC.The current situation of a glass ceiling for Georgia (or whoever else might win the European Nations Cup) is unsatisfactory, unfair and unsporting.
Having a play-off arrangement would give Georgia a crack at a chance of playing in the 6 Nations, but would also give Italy (or Scotland or France or whoever) a chance to save themselves. And if they fail to save themselves, then so be it. That's sport. It's not healthy to maintain the current cosy closed shop. If for example, Georgia beat Italy in a play-off over two legs then they deserve to be in the 6 nations and Italy don't.
What needs to happen is that the European game needs to be broadened and strengthened and indeed preserved while simultaneously playing fewer matches, which hints at what someone said elsewhere about having two separate groups of teams which themselves could be interchangeable.
Basically, the 6 Nations is an anachronism. It's a great piss up but in terms of rugby development it's functionally useless and if the only reason we persist with it in its current format is tradition, then we deserve to be perennial runners up when it comes to setting standards in the game.
I think if Georgia, Romania et el continue to knock on the door then a play off with promotion and relegation is fair? Would it kill off the game in Italy or set it back, possibly. The issue is rugby in Italy's popularity if confined to a very small area. Argentina should be the blue print for success but I don't believe there will be a huge appetite for a franchise team from Georgia etc to break into the Pro 12 or similar although you'd think the Pro 12 would make most sense given it's not a national league.
Lots of people having a go at a tournament XV or Lions squad.
Coach: I think I'd like to see Joe Schmidt give it a go as a Kiwi who'll bring a lot attacking guile that Gatland won't. Hell let's get big Eddy involved too
1. McGrath
2. Hartley
3. WP Nel
4. Jones
5. George Kruis
6. Falateu/Itoje
7. John Hardie
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Murray
10. Farrell
11. Watson
12. Henshaw
13. Joseph
14. North
15. Hogg
Lots of people having a go at a tournament XV or Lions squad.
Coach: I think I'd like to see Joe Schmidt give it a go as a Kiwi who'll bring a lot attacking guile that Gatland won't. Hell let's get big Eddy involved too
1. McGrath
2. Hartley
3. WP Nel
4. Jones
5. George Kruis
6. Falateu/Itoje
7. John Hardie
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Murray
10. Farrell
11. Watson
12. Henshaw
13. Joseph
14. North
15. Hogg
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