The Wattage Thread

[Dammit]

Due to a tragic lack of training my FTP is around 260 at the moment, which given my 80kg weight puts me in the "rubbish" category.

However, that's not really the point I wanted to make - which was that starting to do some weighted squats in the gym put 300 watts on my sprint in a matter of weeks.

[Dammit]

Although that's still a frankly risible 1,400 watts.

[okgo]

Pretty good really, not many folk can do that.

I think if I was to ditch anything longer distance and went for track events then I'd probably do a bit of gym stuff for that big peak, but there is still a lot of value in actually doing sprints on the bike to improve it.

[Ponk]

Yeah, that's solid! I hit nearly 1200 once this season. On a recovery ride that turned into a mash up ridiculously.

Also to the other dude, a 4 w/kg threshold hold is pretty immense for a first year 4th cat. Sure 1, 3 and 5 min efforts are probably more important but it puts you in a great place to start from. I say start, my season peak was 3.8 or thereabouts!

[nammynake]

Ponk said:

.... 1, 3 and 5 min efforts are probably more important but it puts you in a great place

I have a power meter on my bike and turbo so I'll be monitoring those closely over the next couple of months. My power curve does look a bit flat at shorter durations so will work on intervals and sprints to supplement my long rides.

[arcticnick]

nammynake said:

Thanks for the reply. My weight hovers around the 63kg mark when I'm riding regularly so I have reasonable power-to-weight at threshold (4.1 W/kg) but my absolute power itself is not great (260W FTP), particularly my short-term power (I can barely hit 800W for even a few seconds). I'm hoping to race this year so need to increase my power if I stand any chance of picking up points. Initially circuit races then some road races in the Spring.

I'm going to take a look at the plans on TrainerRoad to see what kind of training will help me adapt and improve.

Your bio looks very similar to mine - FTP 260-267, 63kgs, sprint around 800w. There's a great Sufferfest video to try, "Violator" - I used that along with Revolver as my main race-specific tuning workout last season, and I managed plenty of podiums / top 5s in French UFOLEP 2nd cat in one of the flattest regions of France.

Work to your strengths - you are probably more streamlined than a lot of others in the peloton, so you may be able to stay out of the wind and put down less outright power than other more powerful riders. I compared my race data with a stronger clubmate over the season and I would spend 50%+ more time in active recovery than him in a 2 hour race, which gives you more options when you need it. (I have to focus on my raw straight line pace over 3-5 minutes, as 350+ watts over that time is rarely enough to stay away from the pack by oneself.)

But, it's not just long climbs you have to hope for. I have a big advantage on any sort of uphill/false flat sprint finish (2%+), it's a case of a) training your weaknesses and b) racing to your strengths.

Good luck for the coming season.

[okgo]

Was bored earlier so tried to find some numbers to try and get an idea of what Cancellara may be able to do for an hour. Found some SRM data from a 4 min prologue in 2008 for him at 629W on a TT bike with corners, even if he has my 4 min > 20 min drop (which is about 20%) that would give him a realistic 20 min figure of around 500-510W. If we assume that on a 4 min climb all out on a roadbike he might be able to do another 5% and get that 4 min number up to 650W or so and his drop is probably better than mine then we're looking at around 530W for 20 mins giving him probably an FTP of just shy of 500W - this stacks up well with Boonen apparently avging around 440W for the last hour ish of Roubaix where he broke away solo for the win. Lots of folk were impressed when he avg'd 285W for 6.5 hours to win 2010 Roubaix, but clearly that number is a piece of piss for a man with that at his disposal.

[Ponk]

That's just plain scary.

I did 3 w/kg for two hours yesterday and I was chuffed with that. 😄

[neenaw]

okgo said:

Was bored earlier so tried to find some numbers to try and get an idea of what Cancellara may be able to do for an hour. Found some SRM data from a 4 min prologue in 2008 for him at 629W on a TT bike with corners, even if he has my 4 min > 20 min drop (which is about 20%) that would give him a realistic 20 min figure of around 500-510W. If we assume that on a 4 min climb all out on a roadbike he might be able to do another 5% and get that 4 min number up to 650W or so and his drop is probably better than mine then we're looking at around 530W for 20 mins giving him probably an FTP of just shy of 500W - this stacks up well with Boonen apparently avging around 440W for the last hour ish of Roubaix where he broke away solo for the win. Lots of folk were impressed when he avg'd 285W for 6.5 hours to win 2010 Roubaix, but clearly that number is a piece of piss for a man with that at his disposal.

Those numbers are just insane!
I know when Jens Voigt did his hour record they were saying that he averaged 440W for the hour and I thought that was impressive.

[okgo]

412W for Jens for the hour, Wiggins around 440W.

[Talksteer]

okgo said:

412W for Jens for the hour, Wiggins around 440W.

Wiggins claims 460-70w in a one hour time trial. Suspect that the difference is due to the corners, the lack of any recovery time going downhill or into corners and a more extreme aero position.

[E65Ross]

Those are indeed insane numbers. Rode into work today and it's amazing what difference a headwind can make. Last week I did my exact same commute into work as I did this morning. Last week I averaged exactly the same Watts as today (but with a higher IF) but last week I averaged 16mph, today I averaged 17.5mph with an IF of 0.718. Wonder what I could average on a flat 1 hour TT.... Not sure I'm too willing to find out just yet

[okgo]

Talksteer said:

Wiggins claims 460-70w in a one hour time trial. Suspect that the difference is due to the corners, the lack of any recovery time going downhill or into corners and a more extreme aero position.

He avg'd 456W at the worlds apparently, a lot of his previous numbers were from using osy rings which inflate readings by a fair margin. But yes, 440w on the track at nearly 30 deg on a fixed gear is pretty good going, and his position was certainly more aggressive from where I was standing - pissed at the sideline!

[E65Ross]

Okgo, what is your FTP and, if I may ask what's that in watts per kg?

Clearly there's a point where it's not just about watts/kg and power comes into it more. For example 4W/kg at 50kgs would likely be slower than 4W/kg at 75kgs over a flat course.... Do you agree?

Half of me thinks I should put some weight on (I lost a reasonable amount after my surgery and I'm still around 2kgs down but have stabilised) but I'm finding it difficult to put it on healthily (ie avoiding too much in the way of chocolate, biscuits etc!) and I'm not convinced if I do put more weight on.... That I'll be able to increase my power accordingly!

[okgo]

370-380 on roadbike probably, about 79kg currently.

W/kg is all but worthless in this country save for a handful of climbs. Luckily races I do do not take those in, and in time trialling w/kg matters generally even less (with exception of hill climbs).

[Ponk]

Are you trying to depress us all?

[whatleytom]

Finally a bit happier with regard to watts this year after doing 340w for just under 17mins last week. 15w down on my 2015 peak and 50w higher than this time last year.

Now to stop being fat.

[E65Ross]

okgo said:

370-380 on roadbike probably, about 79kg currently.

W/kg is all but worthless in this country save for a handful of climbs. Luckily races I do do not take those in, and in time trialling w/kg matters generally even less (with exception of hill climbs).

I'm not so sure it's totally worthless. A friend of mine weighs a similar amount to you his FTP is higher than mine, but I'm producing more watts per kg and in general over the rides we do I don't think he's ever been quicker than me. He weighs around 75kgs and I think he's around 275 if I remember,which is a fair bit more than my 219,but I'm just shy of 54kgs!

What do you think RE weight gain? I'm only 5ft 5 but clearly a very low bmi.... Not that I particularly mind. I'm quite happy with how I am in general and at least with a power meter I can monitor my own progress which will still improve my speed.... But may be worth trying to put on a couple of lbs.

[okgo]

E65Ross said:

I'm not so sure it's totally worthless. A friend of mine weighs a similar amount to you his FTP is higher than mine, but I'm producing more watts per kg and in general over the rides we do I don't think he's ever been quicker than me. He weighs around 75kgs and I think he's around 275 if I remember,which is a fair bit more than my 219,but I'm just shy of 54kgs!

What do you think RE weight gain? I'm only 5ft 5 but clearly a very low bmi.... Not that I particularly mind. I'm quite happy with how I am in general and at least with a power meter I can monitor my own progress which will still improve my speed.... But may be worth trying to put on a couple of lbs.

You have size on your side, you're obviously not punching a big hole in the wind, if you were taller it might be more marked.

I actually went out on a ride with someone who was 50kg or something mad, he is pretty strong for that size, similar numbers to you, but he was on his limit at all points other than up a steeper hill. In this country I would far rather be 75kg and 4wkg than 65kg.

You will probably find you'll struggle to gain power in line with weight, you clearly are of small build, I don't think its easy to change the fundamentals.

[Ponk]

whatleytom said:

Finally a bit happier with regard to watts this year after doing 340w for just under 17mins last week. 15w down on my 2015 peak and 50w higher than this time last year.

Now to stop being fat.

Great power. I'm 6 watts down on my summer peak at the moment and probably about a kilo off last season's race weight. All headed in the right direction for this time of the year.