New job or wait for pay review - how to approach?
Discussion
Interesting. May look into that. The more I think about it, though, the more I'm tempted to move on after 12 months. The department I'm in won't 'need' me as much. I've steadied the ship, the results are the highest they've ever been by miles, and I've put in place a plan to maintain them (approximately, with any luck) through a strategic combination of standard WJEC English exams and Cambridge iGCSE courses, which I didn't do last year. I've installed some good people there, though! Need to find out more about the staff at the advertising school and why they're running a school with similar numbers with 1.5 fewer English staff - can't take a job on if they won't put money or resources into it. I made that clear at my last interview that I had to effectively be given carte blanche and, mostly, they obliged, despite the horrendous situation with staffing we were in from February onwards.
Quoted in isolation? Of course. Everything is about context.
I'm a descriptivist, anyway.
SV8Predator said:
spud989 said:
I took over an English department with dire results in January,
You're an English teacher and you start with an ambiguous statement like that?I'm a descriptivist, anyway.
I'm still struggling with the concept of telling your current employer about any external job application, before you're in receipt of a written offer and intend to hand in your notice.
What do you see as being the benefit in informing your current manager before, or during, your application?
Are things really different in the world of academia?
What do you see as being the benefit in informing your current manager before, or during, your application?
Are things really different in the world of academia?
As reference requests are normally sent to your existing school before you arrive at the interview, it's just the done thing. Reference requests are part of the process the panel goes through pre- and post-interview, rather than being a sort of 'confirmation of the interview decision', as I gather it tends to be in the private sector.
Else otherwise you could end up in a situation where you've not asked for a reference and your head gets a request for one on a Tuesday morning saying that you're due to attend an interview on the Wednesday and could he give his thoughts. It would really annoy most of them as it would be the first they've heard of it. Then if you don't get it you've sort of shat on your own doorstep a bit.
Else otherwise you could end up in a situation where you've not asked for a reference and your head gets a request for one on a Tuesday morning saying that you're due to attend an interview on the Wednesday and could he give his thoughts. It would really annoy most of them as it would be the first they've heard of it. Then if you don't get it you've sort of shat on your own doorstep a bit.
spud989 said:
As reference requests are normally sent to your existing school before you arrive at the interview, it's just the done thing. Reference requests are part of the process the panel goes through pre- and post-interview, rather than being a sort of 'confirmation of the interview decision', as I gather it tends to be in the private sector.
Else otherwise you could end up in a situation where you've not asked for a reference and your head gets a request for one on a Tuesday morning saying that you're due to attend an interview on the Wednesday and could he give his thoughts. It would really annoy most of them as it would be the first they've heard of it. Then if you don't get it you've sort of shat on your own doorstep a bit.
Ok, thanks.Else otherwise you could end up in a situation where you've not asked for a reference and your head gets a request for one on a Tuesday morning saying that you're due to attend an interview on the Wednesday and could he give his thoughts. It would really annoy most of them as it would be the first they've heard of it. Then if you don't get it you've sort of shat on your own doorstep a bit.
PorkInsider said:
I'm still struggling with the concept of telling your current employer about any external job application, before you're in receipt of a written offer and intend to hand in your notice.
What do you see as being the benefit in informing your current manager before, or during, your application?
Are things really different in the world of academia?
I was struggling with this too, but as the OP pointed out it's because of the references. Otherwise the only reason for doing it would be to effectively threaten them into giving you what you want or a more extreme way of saying that you're unhappy.What do you see as being the benefit in informing your current manager before, or during, your application?
Are things really different in the world of academia?
Oh, and BTW teaching in a school is NOT part of the world of academia.
In my experience of my Local Authority recruitment, references are sought after a successful interview and before a written job offer BUT its not unusual for Headteachers to call each other and have an unofficial chat even before short listing irrespective of whether they are a referee.
I'm not suggesting for a minute that this is how things should be done but how I have seen recruitment in practice
I'm not suggesting for a minute that this is how things should be done but how I have seen recruitment in practice
My eldest daughter is a Biology teacher and has just started a new job at a large secondary school. The job application process is very different to anything I have experienced.
As the Op has said, references are sought ahead of interview. All candidates are interviewed on the same day and the successful candidate offered the job on that day and a decision from the candidate is expected the same day.
She obviously didn’t hand in her notice until the written offer arrived.
This process has been the same at both of the schools she has worked at so I presume that it's the norm.
As the Op has said, references are sought ahead of interview. All candidates are interviewed on the same day and the successful candidate offered the job on that day and a decision from the candidate is expected the same day.
She obviously didn’t hand in her notice until the written offer arrived.
This process has been the same at both of the schools she has worked at so I presume that it's the norm.
liner33 said:
In my experience of my Local Authority recruitment, references are sought after a successful interview and before a written job offer BUT its not unusual for Headteachers to call each other and have an unofficial chat even before short listing irrespective of whether they are a referee.
I'm not suggesting for a minute that this is how things should be done but how I have seen recruitment in practice
Absolutely. Once a teacher has blackened their copybook then in some areas they'll find it difficult to get a job again. Too many people have too many people in their contacts list from training meetings etc. Of course, such unofficial networks can also work in your favour too. But I imagine most areas of employment are similar in some respects. I'm not suggesting for a minute that this is how things should be done but how I have seen recruitment in practice
Update: the school seems great. Spoken to the deputy head and assistant head at length and also had a brief word with the head. They're very keen for me to apply and I think I will. I think I now need to inform my head.
The deadline is Friday. Add that to the fact that my current school is currently expecting an Ofsted monitoring visit within the next week or two (which could well be converted into a full inspection) and things are certainly going to be hectic.
The deadline is Friday. Add that to the fact that my current school is currently expecting an Ofsted monitoring visit within the next week or two (which could well be converted into a full inspection) and things are certainly going to be hectic.
Interview on Wednesday. Lesson is planned. Written out a series of questions for the interview myself - still more things I want to know about them.
Going to see what it's like. If they want me, and I like the feel again and the answers to my questions, I'll take it. Obviously there's a few ifs there.
Current school said they'd put me up 2 jumps on pay spine instead of one. No extra responsibility or anything. Would only be just over 1k pa, though compared to the 'standard' raise. Nice to fall back on, with any luck.
Going into it all open-minded. Too many variables. And I like a bit of control! Ha
Going to see what it's like. If they want me, and I like the feel again and the answers to my questions, I'll take it. Obviously there's a few ifs there.
Current school said they'd put me up 2 jumps on pay spine instead of one. No extra responsibility or anything. Would only be just over 1k pa, though compared to the 'standard' raise. Nice to fall back on, with any luck.
Going into it all open-minded. Too many variables. And I like a bit of control! Ha
Comparing the job-offer range you mentioned, versus the current place..
spud989 said:
upcoming expected 3k rise
andspud989 said:
Current school said they'd put me up 2 jumps on pay spine instead of one. No extra responsibility or anything. Would only be just over 1k pa, though compared to the 'standard' raise.
Sounds like the right choice by a mile. Well done. liner33 said:
Congrats mate , I take it you are going to accept? Do you need a to give a terms notice?
Thanks, folks.Already accepted! Got a slight raise within the range so I didn't have to start on the minimum too, which is good. You accept or not on-the-spot post-interview. I handed my resignation in today - if you leave at Christmas/January then you need to have resigned by (the end of) October half term, which is just over two weeks away. Only exception is headteachers, which is a full term's notice, I think.
25 miles each way to the new job, which will swallow some of the increase, but that gives me chance to enjoy the incoming TTRS more than my current 4 mile commute! Very happy, all told. Breaking it to my existing department today was very difficult, mind. They're a mixture of happy/gutted, if you believe them!
Edited by spud989 on Thursday 9th October 16:25
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