Lying About My A Level Grades
Discussion
Alex97 said:
I thought you wanted to be a barrister and not be a "desk bound" solicitor?
Well, as it probably evident, I am finding out a lot about this route into the law and have decided to go down the solicitor route for a few reasons:1. It would appear to offer greater chance of success - the route to becoming a solicitor is tremendously hard, apparently the route to the Bar is much harder still. I cant really afford to follow a pipe dream completely as I do need to 'pay the mortgage' in future.
2. It would seem English law is becoming more commercialised and you can study to represent people in court once qualified as a solicitor anyway.
3. The Bar course is very expensive.
At the moment I'm applying for training contracts (and being completely honest!) and hoping that I can get one prior to starting the GDL in September.
What about, like me, I left school at 15 having passed no exams, joined the Royal Navy spent 24 years as a marine engineer having passed many career and professional (RN) exams that did not produce a nationally recognised certificate. Then left RN and did HGV driving, generator and CHP servicing and now commercial boiler servicing. The upshot is in this current financial crisis I find myself for the first time in my life Unemployed and having to fill in application forms......when it comes to education ????????? qualifications ???????? It has never been a problem before but it is now! do i lie, not something i want to do but i do want a job.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Well, I have been thinking a lot about it and (with the obvious caveat that I have yet to commence studying so am basing this on a completely outside view on the areas of law) am looking at family, employment, criminal & IP.I realise that these may not be the most lucrative areas (so I've been told) but I think they are the areas that are most likely to interest me. In my training contract applications I'm making sure I'm only applying to firms that practice in these areas (still searching for criminal practice - the CPS isnt doing training contracts this year according to their site).
daveparry said:
What about, like me, I left school at 15 having passed no exams, joined the Royal Navy spent 24 years as a marine engineer having passed many career and professional (RN) exams that did not produce a nationally recognised certificate. Then left RN and did HGV driving, generator and CHP servicing and now commercial boiler servicing. The upshot is in this current financial crisis I find myself for the first time in my life Unemployed and having to fill in application forms......when it comes to education ????????? qualifications ???????? It has never been a problem before but it is now! do i lie, not something i want to do but i do want a job.
Well, I can only speak for the training contract applications I've been filling out, most of them have a section where you can explain why your crap grades at school (in my case) or lack of qualifications should not be held as indicative of your suitability for consideration.daveparry said:
What about, like me, I left school at 15 having passed no exams, joined the Royal Navy spent 24 years as a marine engineer having passed many career and professional (RN) exams that did not produce a nationally recognised certificate. Then left RN and did HGV driving, generator and CHP servicing and now commercial boiler servicing. The upshot is in this current financial crisis I find myself for the first time in my life Unemployed and having to fill in application forms......when it comes to education ????????? qualifications ???????? It has never been a problem before but it is now! do i lie, not something i want to do but i do want a job.
Put down the significant and relevant RN exams that you did, plus any other courses or certifications that you gained along the way.I would imagine that for the sort of jobs you'll be applying for, and at your age, then experience and capability would be much more important than exam results.
I know a guy who, many years ago now, applied for university with faked A-level certificates...and got in! A red-brick too!
How can a small business go about checking these things?
I'd be interested to know how the process is done as I never believe anything I read on CVs...I just make a judgement based on grammar, spelling and general written competence before interviewing.
fido said:
Martial Arts Man said:
I know a guy who, many years ago now, applied for university with faked A-level certificates...and got in! A red-brick too!
Well at least that wasn't for pecuniary gain. One assumes that person doesn't need to lie anymore?In all fairness it probably only worked due to the fact that 12 or so years ago not many had access to high quality scanners and printers.
It's a bit like my other mate who made his own railcards about fiteen years ago; nobody really expected anyone to be able to do such a thing.
I also remember helping to think up a variety of different and interesting fake membership cards etc to fool pub and club security; overwhelm them with a plethora of evidence! Wouldn't work these days I bet...
Marty Funkhouser said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Well, I have been thinking a lot about it and (with the obvious caveat that I have yet to commence studying so am basing this on a completely outside view on the areas of law) am looking at family, employment, criminal & IP.I realise that these may not be the most lucrative areas (so I've been told) but I think they are the areas that are most likely to interest me. In my training contract applications I'm making sure I'm only applying to firms that practice in these areas (still searching for criminal practice - the CPS isnt doing training contracts this year according to their site).
I trained at a firm where we did a bit of everything, property, private client, litigation etc. Moved to another firm where I did some insolvency litigation, and then moved this year to work for this GLS, which is the best job I've ever had.
princeperch said:
Marty Funkhouser said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Well, I have been thinking a lot about it and (with the obvious caveat that I have yet to commence studying so am basing this on a completely outside view on the areas of law) am looking at family, employment, criminal & IP.I realise that these may not be the most lucrative areas (so I've been told) but I think they are the areas that are most likely to interest me. In my training contract applications I'm making sure I'm only applying to firms that practice in these areas (still searching for criminal practice - the CPS isnt doing training contracts this year according to their site).
I trained at a firm where we did a bit of everything, property, private client, litigation etc. Moved to another firm where I did some insolvency litigation, and then moved this year to work for this GLS, which is the best job I've ever had.
PS GLS?
Edited by Marty Funkhouser on Tuesday 8th June 22:48
daveparry said:
What about, like me, I left school at 15 having passed no exams, joined the Royal Navy spent 24 years as a marine engineer having passed many career and professional (RN) exams that did not produce a nationally recognised certificate. Then left RN and did HGV driving, generator and CHP servicing and now commercial boiler servicing. The upshot is in this current financial crisis I find myself for the first time in my life Unemployed and having to fill in application forms......when it comes to education ????????? qualifications ???????? It has never been a problem before but it is now! do i lie, not something i want to do but i do want a job.
What you have written above (apart from the lower case "i"s) would be more attractive to many employers than a bunch of A-Levels. It reads well, and suggests that you have a good attitude to work.As Deva has said, your O/A-levels are no longer relevant.
List the "career and professional" exams that you have taken. These will be more relevant than what you did 30 years ago.
Jobs are harder to find at the moment - regardless of your academic qualifications.
Don
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anonymous said:
[redacted]
Cheers for the advice Tonker. Thats pretty much my thoughts. I have got about 30-40 applications in so far and I still have plenty to go. I am willing to do the TC pretty much anywhere thats reasonable to get to from Oxford. My A level grades are crap & I have a 'modern' degree. I missed the deadline to apply for vacation schemes as I only made the decision to leave work in mid Feb (deadline was end of jan).I have almost 15 yrs in advertising so am making sure I apply to the likes of Olswang that have a advertising/media practice and am applying to pretty much every firm I can. Like I said, the only places I am avoiding are the corporate finance/tax/banking firms as I have no interest in that type of law.
I realise that TC's are phenominally competitive but I can only do my best and cross my fingers. The more I think about it, the more I wouldnt want to start the GDL without a TC.
If you don't train in London, be prepared for 2 years of not a lot of financial fun....
£1x grand didn't stretch very far for me when I was a trainee, it's mont to month living to a certain point - so I wouldn't go getting that porker on HP just yet...
That said when you qualify things get better. At the firm I trained at, NQs were on about 32 odd grand, which is ok but nothing special. My salary more than doubled when I qualified, plus good pension (whilst it still exists), and more importantly, the people I work with aren't
- which you will find from day one the vast majority of partners are.
£1x grand didn't stretch very far for me when I was a trainee, it's mont to month living to a certain point - so I wouldn't go getting that porker on HP just yet...
That said when you qualify things get better. At the firm I trained at, NQs were on about 32 odd grand, which is ok but nothing special. My salary more than doubled when I qualified, plus good pension (whilst it still exists), and more importantly, the people I work with aren't
- which you will find from day one the vast majority of partners are.princeperch said:
If you don't train in London, be prepared for 2 years of not a lot of financial fun....
£1x grand didn't stretch very far for me when I was a trainee, it's mont to month living to a certain point - so I wouldn't go getting that porker on HP just yet...
That said when you qualify things get better. At the firm I trained at, NQs were on about 32 odd grand, which is ok but nothing special. My salary more than doubled when I qualified, plus good pension (whilst it still exists), and more importantly, the people I work with aren't - which you will find from day one the vast majority of partners are.
I know - city firms seem to offer anywhere between £30-40k 1st yr trainee, regionals seem to range from £20-25k. There are pros and cons to both. Ideally I'd do 2 years to qualification at a top London firm and then decide if I want to move. The reality will more likely be taking any offer I can get!£1x grand didn't stretch very far for me when I was a trainee, it's mont to month living to a certain point - so I wouldn't go getting that porker on HP just yet...
That said when you qualify things get better. At the firm I trained at, NQs were on about 32 odd grand, which is ok but nothing special. My salary more than doubled when I qualified, plus good pension (whilst it still exists), and more importantly, the people I work with aren't
- which you will find from day one the vast majority of partners are.It all feels like the end of school again - trying to make long term career affecting decisions without really being in full grasp of the facts - I have no idea of what practicising family/criminal/IP law will be like and whether or not its for me. I just have to give it my best shot and see what happens. It would have been much better to have made this decision last October and then I could have at least (hopefully) have got some experience on vacation schemes.
Edited by Marty Funkhouser on Wednesday 9th June 10:37
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