Graduated 2011 - No grad job, need further guidance.
Discussion
iphonedyou said:
No you don't 
Life's all about opinion, right? If you enjoy it then I'm pleased for you and wish you all the best! Get in touch if you ever want a move! haha.Anon... drop me a PM and we can arrange a time to have a chat through your CV. I can't promise that I'll be able to help but I might be able to point you in the right direction.
NickHKent said:
Life's all about opinion, right? If you enjoy it then I'm pleased for you and wish you all the best! Get in touch if you ever want a move! haha.
Anon... drop me a PM and we can arrange a time to have a chat through your CV. I can't promise that I'll be able to help but I might be able to point you in the right direction.
No, I just mean you don't work for £35k base and no bonus. That's not opinion, that's fact! Anon... drop me a PM and we can arrange a time to have a chat through your CV. I can't promise that I'll be able to help but I might be able to point you in the right direction.
^Good question.
It was because I focused solely on online internship applications to well known banks and I wasn't very switched on back then. Should have really walked through the doors at all nearby banks offering unpaid labour.
I didn't do a placement either because I thought it would affect my final year studies too much. I put too much emphasis on chasing a 1st when instead, I should have undertaken a placement and been happy with a 2.1 (don't think I would have secured a 1st). I think everyone will agree that the placement year plus the 2.1 would have been much more valuable.
It was because I focused solely on online internship applications to well known banks and I wasn't very switched on back then. Should have really walked through the doors at all nearby banks offering unpaid labour.
I didn't do a placement either because I thought it would affect my final year studies too much. I put too much emphasis on chasing a 1st when instead, I should have undertaken a placement and been happy with a 2.1 (don't think I would have secured a 1st). I think everyone will agree that the placement year plus the 2.1 would have been much more valuable.
Youth is for making mistakes, and enjoying the time you have without responsibilities or commitments. Never think that you should have done things differently, and certainly dont wish you had missed out on things you have done to chase something you havent got yet. Despite what it seems when you're looking for jobs, and seemingly up against people who have spent their whole lives doing internships, years abroad, getting great grades etc, there is so much more to life than work. You have 40 years to do a job, so do anything you want to do now, while you can.
You're in a much better position than me (a 2.2 rules you out of almost all grad schemes and means that 90% of employers wont read your CV beyond that!!) but its not the end of the world. Keep trying, get to know people, do some of your own work and then present a nice CV or file to them when you can. If you want to do it there is always a way.
You're in a much better position than me (a 2.2 rules you out of almost all grad schemes and means that 90% of employers wont read your CV beyond that!!) but its not the end of the world. Keep trying, get to know people, do some of your own work and then present a nice CV or file to them when you can. If you want to do it there is always a way.
Edited by Condi on Thursday 22 March 19:53
Even now in 2012 where its obvious you cannot graduate and walk straight into a graduate job unless your at one of the best Uni's, study atleast a BSc, and get First grades, s
tty universitys are gaurantee'ing (untill you read the small print) they will find you a job.
There simply arent any.
Digital Marketing Executive in IT, 5 years ago required a years experience and paid £30k, now requires 5 years experience, a Masters and pays £16k, the job market is ridiculous.
tty universitys are gaurantee'ing (untill you read the small print) they will find you a job.There simply arent any.
Digital Marketing Executive in IT, 5 years ago required a years experience and paid £30k, now requires 5 years experience, a Masters and pays £16k, the job market is ridiculous.
Yeah agree with the above its a stupidly competitive market- we are talking at least 3000 applicants for grad positions. Its passed the point where they can truly consider the merits of each CV and now becomes a checklist- and only the cvs that pass the checklist get considered properly. This means if you compete on intangibles like strong communication skills etc (or as i like to call it 'just being a good bd' then you need to find other ways of showing them this like chatting up HR staff at careers fairs or even just writing straight to the firms.
d' then you need to find other ways of showing them this like chatting up HR staff at careers fairs or even just writing straight to the firms. right mate- i cant speak from a wisened point of view with the experience of age on my side, but having landed a grad role in the tax team of a big 4 i can at least tell you what helped me get there
1 Knowing people
just meet as many people as you can at uni. a lot of students do internships at big firms and knowing them helps. dont name drop them and expect the employer to go to them for a reference, but explain how you are friends with x and y who both work in xyz department. once they know you have the technical ability they JUST WANT TO KNOW THAT YOU FIT IN. I made a few friends that happened to work at this firm and so i told them this at the interview. they reason that if you socialise wth these people on your own accord you will work well with them too.
2 Be confident
all the big firms do phone interviews. when mine came i happened to be working at a client downtown accross the rd from their offices. I simply told the hr guy- look, I can see your office, do you mind if I just come up for a chat? it worked well and we had a nice talk. at the end he asked if I had any questions- i didnt of course it was just a little phone interview ('why do you want to work for us?' why do you want to work in this service line?' and a general knowledge question) so i just said "well whenever I meet someone I like to learn a bit more about them- so tell me about yourself. how long have you been here?"
it worked well to build up some kind of relationship between us. thats important when hr will be dealing with 2-3k applicants/plebs.
SAMe goes for the interview of course. be relaxed. dont be afraid to sit back in your chair. show that you are not terribly nervous. in my second (well second partner interview) there was just one partner. we sat at a circle table opposite each other. I said "this is a big table, you dont mind if i just move around a little do you?" . little things like that will mark you out as not being nervous to the extent that you will stop thinking.
3 be prepared to turn negatives into positives
On my CV i have a lot of work experience (working since 12 so 8 yrs now) but none of it is a formal internship or anything with a big firms training programme. when this was pointed out i said "this is what I am so proud of. Look, I have a lot of REAL experience. in my jobs I have never been sheltered or pampered, i have always been dealing with REAL problems in REAL time".
4 have very specific examples
while some employers are bigger on behavoural type questions than others, all will bring them up. You need to have very specific examples as these are what make you look credible.
5 be polite
For gods sake dont forget this. when the receptionist asked "whats your name" to call up the interviewer, I responded "and whats yours?" then we had a nice chat, and the 2nd and 3rd times I came back we talked again. when I dropped in my contract she was saying "im so glad youre joining us, you were one of the only candidates who actually took the time to talk to me" . Always remember please, thank you, and peoples names. talking to people like the receptionist shows that you do just like people and are not interested in talking only to people higher up because they will be the ones giving you a job.
6 have fun!
I am told that recruiting by holding a networking evening is becoming popular. after my interviews this was the last step. 2 hours having drinks and nibbles with ppl from the firm. While I would not reccomend doing exactly what I did (they had a range of 5 or 6 beers and I sampled all of them and then some- wasnt drunk but prob had a bit too much) I can give a bit of advice on how to handle these events. Firstly, you need to have a beer if youre a guy. they just want to see that youre normal. if you dont drink at all then thats ok, have a coke or whatever, but many of the seniors like their beer, and like to see the staff drinking with them.
Make jokes where appropiate. Proper, memorable ones. For instance at a networking evening i was hoping to talk to a person who was in charge of a certain division. someone pointed me his way and I went over to him- as usual about 4 or 5 female applicants were huddled around listening. i introduced myself and said "so you are the division x guy" yes thats me he replied- "and a ladies man too by the looks of it" I said, and it went down well. after a 5 minute chat i made my excuses and he shook my hand and said "I really hope you join us here".
So what it comes down to is making a name for yourself. This goes for whether you are applying for a job or starting out in a big firm. Until then you are just a number- one of a million. You want to get people talking about you. A good sign for me was when I talked to a senior manager and they said they had heard about me- being incredibly friendly had made me a name for myself at the firm during the recruitment process.
Dont think i am one of those students who gets offers from everyone they apply to. I didnt go to all of the red brick schools the big firms recruit from here, i dont play rugby/cricket/soccer etc which they love, and as mentioned earlier i never did an internship. 15 months ago i was just a shy, diligent, and boring student. I changed all that because it was st and have never been happier. I just stopped worrying and caring obsessively about grades and all that, and gained the confidence to just live like the person I always wanted to be. I was the genuine me and that is what any people hiring a graduate wants to see.
1 Knowing people
just meet as many people as you can at uni. a lot of students do internships at big firms and knowing them helps. dont name drop them and expect the employer to go to them for a reference, but explain how you are friends with x and y who both work in xyz department. once they know you have the technical ability they JUST WANT TO KNOW THAT YOU FIT IN. I made a few friends that happened to work at this firm and so i told them this at the interview. they reason that if you socialise wth these people on your own accord you will work well with them too.
2 Be confident
all the big firms do phone interviews. when mine came i happened to be working at a client downtown accross the rd from their offices. I simply told the hr guy- look, I can see your office, do you mind if I just come up for a chat? it worked well and we had a nice talk. at the end he asked if I had any questions- i didnt of course it was just a little phone interview ('why do you want to work for us?' why do you want to work in this service line?' and a general knowledge question) so i just said "well whenever I meet someone I like to learn a bit more about them- so tell me about yourself. how long have you been here?"
it worked well to build up some kind of relationship between us. thats important when hr will be dealing with 2-3k applicants/plebs.
SAMe goes for the interview of course. be relaxed. dont be afraid to sit back in your chair. show that you are not terribly nervous. in my second (well second partner interview) there was just one partner. we sat at a circle table opposite each other. I said "this is a big table, you dont mind if i just move around a little do you?" . little things like that will mark you out as not being nervous to the extent that you will stop thinking.
3 be prepared to turn negatives into positives
On my CV i have a lot of work experience (working since 12 so 8 yrs now) but none of it is a formal internship or anything with a big firms training programme. when this was pointed out i said "this is what I am so proud of. Look, I have a lot of REAL experience. in my jobs I have never been sheltered or pampered, i have always been dealing with REAL problems in REAL time".
4 have very specific examples
while some employers are bigger on behavoural type questions than others, all will bring them up. You need to have very specific examples as these are what make you look credible.
5 be polite
For gods sake dont forget this. when the receptionist asked "whats your name" to call up the interviewer, I responded "and whats yours?" then we had a nice chat, and the 2nd and 3rd times I came back we talked again. when I dropped in my contract she was saying "im so glad youre joining us, you were one of the only candidates who actually took the time to talk to me" . Always remember please, thank you, and peoples names. talking to people like the receptionist shows that you do just like people and are not interested in talking only to people higher up because they will be the ones giving you a job.
6 have fun!
I am told that recruiting by holding a networking evening is becoming popular. after my interviews this was the last step. 2 hours having drinks and nibbles with ppl from the firm. While I would not reccomend doing exactly what I did (they had a range of 5 or 6 beers and I sampled all of them and then some- wasnt drunk but prob had a bit too much) I can give a bit of advice on how to handle these events. Firstly, you need to have a beer if youre a guy. they just want to see that youre normal. if you dont drink at all then thats ok, have a coke or whatever, but many of the seniors like their beer, and like to see the staff drinking with them.
Make jokes where appropiate. Proper, memorable ones. For instance at a networking evening i was hoping to talk to a person who was in charge of a certain division. someone pointed me his way and I went over to him- as usual about 4 or 5 female applicants were huddled around listening. i introduced myself and said "so you are the division x guy" yes thats me he replied- "and a ladies man too by the looks of it" I said, and it went down well. after a 5 minute chat i made my excuses and he shook my hand and said "I really hope you join us here".
So what it comes down to is making a name for yourself. This goes for whether you are applying for a job or starting out in a big firm. Until then you are just a number- one of a million. You want to get people talking about you. A good sign for me was when I talked to a senior manager and they said they had heard about me- being incredibly friendly had made me a name for myself at the firm during the recruitment process.
Dont think i am one of those students who gets offers from everyone they apply to. I didnt go to all of the red brick schools the big firms recruit from here, i dont play rugby/cricket/soccer etc which they love, and as mentioned earlier i never did an internship. 15 months ago i was just a shy, diligent, and boring student. I changed all that because it was s
t and have never been happier. I just stopped worrying and caring obsessively about grades and all that, and gained the confidence to just live like the person I always wanted to be. I was the genuine me and that is what any people hiring a graduate wants to see. aucklander said:
5 be polite
For gods sake dont forget this. when the receptionist asked "whats your name" to call up the interviewer, I responded "and whats yours?" then we had a nice chat, and the 2nd and 3rd times I came back we talked again. when I dropped in my contract she was saying "im so glad youre joining us, you were one of the only candidates who actually took the time to talk to me" . Always remember please, thank you, and peoples names. talking to people like the receptionist shows that you do just like people and are not interested in talking only to people higher up because they will be the ones giving you a job.
No 6 - networking
You don't have to tell jokes and be the life and soul of the party if that's not how you roll
To be honest, in networking situations it's almost more important to listen, ask questions about them and about the job/industry/company/role and act as if you are genuinely interested.
This is important for a number of reasons.
Most people genuinely love to talk about themselves, or to be treated as a subject matter expert, but rarely get the opportunity to do so to someone who seems to be prepared to listen properly. They will therefore remember you more fondly and will consider you to be more competent.
You also are now armed with a lot of useful info that may help you in an interview and will also mean that you have a meaningful network contact for the future. The next time you need to deal with them, you already have an "in" (so how's the new baby/project going, how did the wedding go, congratulations on the promotion, etc?) and you know a bit about how they roll. Having moved to the private sector last year, personality has so much more impact on how you do your work than ever I had to deal with before - knowing what people want, how they work and how to get them onside can be a vital part of getting the job done.
You don't have to tell jokes and be the life and soul of the party if that's not how you roll
To be honest, in networking situations it's almost more important to listen, ask questions about them and about the job/industry/company/role and act as if you are genuinely interested.
This is important for a number of reasons.
Most people genuinely love to talk about themselves, or to be treated as a subject matter expert, but rarely get the opportunity to do so to someone who seems to be prepared to listen properly. They will therefore remember you more fondly and will consider you to be more competent.
You also are now armed with a lot of useful info that may help you in an interview and will also mean that you have a meaningful network contact for the future. The next time you need to deal with them, you already have an "in" (so how's the new baby/project going, how did the wedding go, congratulations on the promotion, etc?) and you know a bit about how they roll. Having moved to the private sector last year, personality has so much more impact on how you do your work than ever I had to deal with before - knowing what people want, how they work and how to get them onside can be a vital part of getting the job done.
oldbanger said:
No 6 - networking
You don't have to tell jokes and be the life and soul of the party if that's not how you roll
To be honest, in networking situations it's almost more important to listen, ask questions about them and about the job/industry/company/role and act as if you are genuinely interested.
This is important for a number of reasons.
Most people genuinely love to talk about themselves, or to be treated as a subject matter expert, but rarely get the opportunity to do so to someone who seems to be prepared to listen properly. They will therefore remember you more fondly and will consider you to be more competent.
You also are now armed with a lot of useful info that may help you in an interview and will also mean that you have a meaningful network contact for the future. The next time you need to deal with them, you already have an "in" (so how's the new baby/project going, how did the wedding go, congratulations on the promotion, etc?) and you know a bit about how they roll. Having moved to the private sector last year, personality has so much more impact on how you do your work than ever I had to deal with before - knowing what people want, how they work and how to get them onside can be a vital part of getting the job done.
Great advice- the best technique is to get them talking. then when you have done some good listening you drop little snippets back to them and they think you are awesome for remembering little things like that. The joke stuff isnt necessary but in a sterile grad recruitment environment where everyone is so similar and there are so many of you it does help you stand out. You don't have to tell jokes and be the life and soul of the party if that's not how you roll
To be honest, in networking situations it's almost more important to listen, ask questions about them and about the job/industry/company/role and act as if you are genuinely interested.
This is important for a number of reasons.
Most people genuinely love to talk about themselves, or to be treated as a subject matter expert, but rarely get the opportunity to do so to someone who seems to be prepared to listen properly. They will therefore remember you more fondly and will consider you to be more competent.
You also are now armed with a lot of useful info that may help you in an interview and will also mean that you have a meaningful network contact for the future. The next time you need to deal with them, you already have an "in" (so how's the new baby/project going, how did the wedding go, congratulations on the promotion, etc?) and you know a bit about how they roll. Having moved to the private sector last year, personality has so much more impact on how you do your work than ever I had to deal with before - knowing what people want, how they work and how to get them onside can be a vital part of getting the job done.
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