Toilet breaks, right to have a drink - at work
Discussion
Anyway solicitors in the house?
My (very temporary day job) boss is threatening to remove our "priviledge" to have 1x 15 min coffee break (or toilet break etc.) in a 4 hour morning and 1 x 15 min break in a 3 hour afternoon. And also remove our "priviledge" to go to the toilet when we need to go and get a drink when we are thirsty.
I have not opted out of EU law in my contract.
EU law seems... well... complex and not very easy to divulge, but given the Department of Health recommends that men drink at least 2.9L of water a day (and in bits not in one sitting) for good mental performance it seems a bit incompatible.
Feels a lot like a breach of human rights, so citations would be extremely useful.
My (very temporary day job) boss is threatening to remove our "priviledge" to have 1x 15 min coffee break (or toilet break etc.) in a 4 hour morning and 1 x 15 min break in a 3 hour afternoon. And also remove our "priviledge" to go to the toilet when we need to go and get a drink when we are thirsty.
I have not opted out of EU law in my contract.
EU law seems... well... complex and not very easy to divulge, but given the Department of Health recommends that men drink at least 2.9L of water a day (and in bits not in one sitting) for good mental performance it seems a bit incompatible.
Feels a lot like a breach of human rights, so citations would be extremely useful.
You are legally entitled to a 15 minute break for every 4 hours worked, how and when these are provided is not dictated I believe. So for example if you do an 8 hr day you can have 30 minutes off throughout the day, whether this is in 1 go or 4 15 minute breaks is up to the employer.
mattikake said:
Anyway solicitors in the house?
My (very temporary day job) boss is threatening to remove our "priviledge" to have 1x 15 min coffee break (or toilet break etc.) in a 4 hour morning and 1 x 15 min break in a 3 hour afternoon. And also remove our "priviledge" to go to the toilet when we need to go and get a drink when we are thirsty.
I have not opted out of EU law in my contract.
EU law seems... well... complex and not very easy to divulge, but given the Department of Health recommends that men drink at least 2.9L of water a day (and in bits not in one sitting) for good mental performance it seems a bit incompatible.
Feels a lot like a breach of human rights, so citations would be extremely useful.
What the fMy (very temporary day job) boss is threatening to remove our "priviledge" to have 1x 15 min coffee break (or toilet break etc.) in a 4 hour morning and 1 x 15 min break in a 3 hour afternoon. And also remove our "priviledge" to go to the toilet when we need to go and get a drink when we are thirsty.
I have not opted out of EU law in my contract.
EU law seems... well... complex and not very easy to divulge, but given the Department of Health recommends that men drink at least 2.9L of water a day (and in bits not in one sitting) for good mental performance it seems a bit incompatible.
Feels a lot like a breach of human rights, so citations would be extremely useful.
k kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?Are you serving time?
LOL funny replies and my thoughts exactly.
Just a regular job... in a business struggling to make a profit... you get the idea.
I think the bummer is that we get a 1 hour break for lunch, which is over the 30 mins per 8 hours min.
But are you expected to hold-it until you burst? Why is employment law so ignorant to human needs? (NB: I know the answer. It was a rhetorical question!)
Just a regular job... in a business struggling to make a profit... you get the idea.
I think the bummer is that we get a 1 hour break for lunch, which is over the 30 mins per 8 hours min.
But are you expected to hold-it until you burst? Why is employment law so ignorant to human needs? (NB: I know the answer. It was a rhetorical question!)
Laird said:
What the fk kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?
Are you serving time?
a good example where that might need to be dictated is on a production line. If your role affects every person downstream and you bugger off for 5 mins, as does the other guy 10 mins later, and another guy, then all of a sudden you've lost 15mins of productivity because 3 people "had a quick loo break".k kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?Are you serving time?
TonyHetherington said:
Laird said:
What the fk kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?
Are you serving time?
a good example where that might need to be dictated is on a production line. If your role affects every person downstream and you bugger off for 5 mins, as does the other guy 10 mins later, and another guy, then all of a sudden you've lost 15mins of productivity because 3 people "had a quick loo break".k kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?Are you serving time?
Human rights are not engaged here, and employment law does not legislate to such a level of detail, but if the absence of a toilet break were to cause real discomfort or threaten health, the employer might be in breach of health and safety standards. Refusing toilet breaks to a pregnant woman or to someone with a bladder disability would be unlawful.
Laird said:
TonyHetherington said:
Laird said:
What the fk kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?
Are you serving time?
a good example where that might need to be dictated is on a production line. If your role affects every person downstream and you bugger off for 5 mins, as does the other guy 10 mins later, and another guy, then all of a sudden you've lost 15mins of productivity because 3 people "had a quick loo break".k kind of employer refuses to allow you a toilet/coffee break?Are you serving time?
The working time regs say you're entitled to a 20 minute (unpaid) break if working more than 6 hours at a stretch. http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1906
Can you bring in a Thermos mug or bottle of water to drink whilst at your work station, have a piss and a drink top up in your 20 minute break and last out the second half of your shift?
It just feels all pretty inhumane to me.
It's recently been proven (in er, many studies and surveys) that sitting down for more than 4 hours a day significantly reduces your health - heart attacks, fitness, back problems, deep vein thrombosis etc. etc.) EVEN if you spend an hour or 2 in the gym, per day. Bringing drink into work, just so you can be forced to sit at your desk even longer is conveniently ignorant these health effects and just plain rude.
I'm surprised we're not kept in Pens.
btw it's just a brain-dead technical call centre thing for some extra cash.
It's recently been proven (in er, many studies and surveys) that sitting down for more than 4 hours a day significantly reduces your health - heart attacks, fitness, back problems, deep vein thrombosis etc. etc.) EVEN if you spend an hour or 2 in the gym, per day. Bringing drink into work, just so you can be forced to sit at your desk even longer is conveniently ignorant these health effects and just plain rude.
I'm surprised we're not kept in Pens.
btw it's just a brain-dead technical call centre thing for some extra cash.
bmw535i said:
Has he given a reason?
Some of us have been going to the toilet when we need to go, without asking teacher first. Because I'm aware of the 2.9L a day requirement and the colour of my urine to know if I'm dehydrated or not (takes about 3 cups of tea to rehydrate from sleeping night before), I must be going about 5 times a day... probably a total of 10 minutes. I could cut this to 8mins if I stopped washing my hands afterwards...I'm thinking of asking for some gel packs, on the company of course.
No offence, but it might be that if you take a similar attitude at work to the way you've written your posts, it could be that your boss feels that you're taking the piss and clamping down on it.
But tone is difficult to judge, so I could be wrong and you could be conscientious and hard working in your "brain-dead" job.
But tone is difficult to judge, so I could be wrong and you could be conscientious and hard working in your "brain-dead" job.
I work (very) hard especially given the pay, I work fair, I'm consistent, proved repeatedly re-employable by numerous contract extensions, I offer many well-reasoned and diplomatic constructive critisims, which I have zero obligation to (off my own back etc.) - all have which improved the teams overall throughput. In short, I've done more for the team than anyone else and my a$$ is frequently licked, and in some cases from customers or through his boss. I do what I feel I should for the good of everyone, and seemingly get persecuted in return.
At the end of the day, I'm paid to do a job and I feel I should do it at the best of my abilities at all times as a matter of principle. I don't take the piss... except when I need to 'go'.
The original OP threat was also aimed generally at the team, not at me per se.
At the end of the day, I'm paid to do a job and I feel I should do it at the best of my abilities at all times as a matter of principle. I don't take the piss... except when I need to 'go'.
The original OP threat was also aimed generally at the team, not at me per se.
mattikake said:
It just feels all pretty inhumane to me.
It's recently been proven (in er, many studies and surveys) that sitting down for more than 4 hours a day significantly reduces your health
Even with your breaks you are sitting for more than 4 hours??It's recently been proven (in er, many studies and surveys) that sitting down for more than 4 hours a day significantly reduces your health
In anycase, if he takes away your breaks no EU Laws or Human Rights are being breached. At the moment you get 1.5 hours break during an 8 hour day. Many workplaces have a single 30min lunchbreak in that time.
The concept of human rights is devalued by people asserting that their human rights are infringed if they have to sit at a desk for four hours. OP, do some Googling on real human rights abuses and obtain a bit of perspective. A reasonable employer should allow reasonable flexibility, but you can't insist on more time off than you have at present.
Breadvan73 said:
The concept of human rights is devalued by people asserting that their human rights are infringed if they have to sit at a desk for four hours. OP, do some Googling on real human rights abuses and obtain a bit of perspective. A reasonable employer should allow reasonable flexibility, but you can't insist on more time off than you have at present.
Oh give over. The reason conditions are as "good" as they are today is because people like me don't take stuff lying down.So because someone else has it real bad, I shouldn't attempt to make my life better... and for the potential benefit of everyone else in the future? Who are you? Satan?
Sitting down kills humans. It's a fact. No-one has the right to impose detremental conditions on someone, least of all because some have it worse than I do.
You suggested that human rights are engaged by your situation. You've received free and correct legal advice from me and others above that they aren't, to which I have added a general observation that human rights arguments are sadly discredited when misapplied to inappropriate contexts.
Your employer should act reasonably, but your rights to breaks are as stated above. If you are unwell or have an emergency, the employer should accommodate this, but employers have good business reasons for regulating breaks. Also, the x litres of water a day thing is a number plucked from the air. You should drink enough to keep you hydrated, relative to your activity level and food intake, not some arbitrary fixed amount. Ask a sports doctor about this (I just did - he's my brother). There you are: free lawyer, free doctor. Big kisses!
Your employer should act reasonably, but your rights to breaks are as stated above. If you are unwell or have an emergency, the employer should accommodate this, but employers have good business reasons for regulating breaks. Also, the x litres of water a day thing is a number plucked from the air. You should drink enough to keep you hydrated, relative to your activity level and food intake, not some arbitrary fixed amount. Ask a sports doctor about this (I just did - he's my brother). There you are: free lawyer, free doctor. Big kisses!
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