made redundant whilst on the sick !

[poj]

A person i know that has worked as a pub manager for the last 9 months,he recently(11-12-2009) had an accident at work that resulted in a back injury,the pub has now just been sold,the owners of the pub have several other pubs.They are now saying....
"the pub is now sold so you'll have to get your money off the dole" This seems bizarre to me as my mate was supposed to be going into another one of his employers pubs.
Any help would be appreciated

[siscar]

Well at 9 months service he/she is an unprotected employee so whilst the process doesn't sound good there isn't a great deal they can do about it.

[khushy]

errrrrrr no such thing as an unprotected employee - its the employer that is unprotected - employees have all the rights - no matter if they lie or steal - if it goes to a tribunal - the employer will loose!

khushy

[Dupont666]

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

[Munter]

Dupont666 said:

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

If my company sell the office then I'm still their employee. They can't just go "Sorry mate you now belong to carp cleaners LTD" who've moved into the office.

I've always wondered what happens if the company wants rid of you in the initial "trial period" of a contract. But shirly thats not 9 months.

[poj]

My pal(pub manager) has carried out work at the pub owners other pubs in the past.
Before the sickness issue,discussions took place regarding covering holidays in other pubs.
Munter,i agree with your thoughts on this matter.

[RichBurley]

Dupont666 said:

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

TUPE Regs.

The Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment Regulations. If you sell a business, then the staff go with it.

[Dupont666]

RichBurley said:

Dupont666 said:

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

TUPE Regs.

The Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment Regulations. If you sell a business, then the staff go with it.

So I am right... they shouldnt have said he was redundant but its the new owners issue to deal with?

[Munter]

RichBurley said:

Dupont666 said:

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

TUPE Regs.

The Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment Regulations. If you sell a business, then the staff go with it.

They didn't sell the business. The way I read it the business sold an asset. The business is still "in the business" of running pubs as it was before. They just have one less now. Which may mean the guys position has gone and he's redundant. Certainly doesn't mean he's working for whoever buys the pub.

[poj]

Pub manager was going to be a 'roving' pub manager within the pub owners mini empire,i think pub owner now thinks that as he now has one less unit in said empire,coupled with falling revenue from the industry he can decide to end pub managers employment rather than pay him his sick money.
I think the issue here is....can the pub owner decide to stop paying sick money even though there is a valid sick note in place ?

[RichBurley]

Munter said:

RichBurley said:

Dupont666 said:

Im lost... they own a pub sold it and then the manager is left without a job.

Well surely its not like they are a package, once sold the pub is no longer theirs and hence the staff their are not their responsibility.

Like if I sold my company with one member of staff... I wouldnt care what happened to them once its sold, its not mine anymore and would inform them as such, but thats it surely?

TUPE Regs.

The Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment Regulations. If you sell a business, then the staff go with it.

They didn't sell the business. The way I read it the business sold an asset. The business is still "in the business" of running pubs as it was before. They just have one less now. Which may mean the guys position has gone and he's redundant. Certainly doesn't mean he's working for whoever buys the pub.

The sold pub IS the undertaking. The staff go with it. They are not redundant. They are now just employed in the same pub, by the new owners of the pub. They have continuity of employment, and if they have been there for more than 12 months, then they have employment rights as well, including the right not to be unfairly dismissed. They can still be made redundant through a proper and formalised restructuring, as long as it is genuine and not just an attempt to, say, sack the ugly ones...

[RichBurley]

Although the "Roving Pub Manager" thing is a bit confusing. What did the contract of employment say. I really can't give any useable advice until we know allthe facts...

[poj]

Matey was employed as a pub manager but pub owner used him to go into underperforming pubs and give them a boost if possible.Sadly no contract of employment was issued!

[2 sMoKiN bArReLs]

I'd say unless he can prove dismissal on discriminatory grounds he falls foul of the 12 month rule. Being off sick may be construed as the reason, and there for dicriminatory.

He may be better, however, in concentrating efforts on getting a new job.