G82 M4... first impressions
Discussion
Yeah I like the understated F82. It's a 4 series until you see an F82 M4 and Series 4 coupe side by side. The front and back end are to die for and the arches...
I'm not worried about my F82 being 'dated' compared to the G82. I was never gonna spend £80k on an M4. I'm still on under 20k miles on the clock (17k when I bought it.) loads of fun left in it. Plus options in upgrading power etc, if i want it.
The G82 is a different beast that's all. Remember when NO-ONE liked those front grills? But they sound wicked. There was one rumbling round Chelsea a couple of weeks ago, a black one which i heard before I saw.
All or most of the M cars through the ages are destined to be classics. It'll be the M's people wlll be talking about, not the M lights.
I'm not worried about my F82 being 'dated' compared to the G82. I was never gonna spend £80k on an M4. I'm still on under 20k miles on the clock (17k when I bought it.) loads of fun left in it. Plus options in upgrading power etc, if i want it.
The G82 is a different beast that's all. Remember when NO-ONE liked those front grills? But they sound wicked. There was one rumbling round Chelsea a couple of weeks ago, a black one which i heard before I saw.
All or most of the M cars through the ages are destined to be classics. It'll be the M's people wlll be talking about, not the M lights.
cerb4.5lee said:
I still remember the day I picked my F82 M4 and it was parked very near a G82 M4, the G82 made it look ancient for me! I do love the more classic shape of the F82 don't get me wrong, but I think overall I much prefer the way the G82 looks though. The G82 reminds me of the Mustang I think in some ways to look at, quite big and aggressive looking, whereas the F82 has a much softer/under the radar look in comparison.
I've done quite a lot of driving today, both motorway and a fair bit of spirited driving. The car is growing on me. It is a genuinely fun car.
Its capabilities are incredible. I feel like I'm barely scratching the surface but it is bonkers fast and composed, it inspires so much confidence.
I still don't like the steering. With the exhaust turned up loud when driving at 6 10ths it does sound quite good, but under full throttle, whilst not bad, it's not a patch on my S65 for noise, although performance is another level.
Love the brakes, love the performance, all you could ever need. I don't particularly like the instrument cluster, it's a bit too much "PlayStation", but that's me being a dinosaur probably.
I do miss the E90, but I am very worried it's going to feel dog slow when I get it back
The styling...... I don't mind it, but I certainly don't like it, especially the front. Rear I don't mind. I prefer the elegance of the E90. That said the M4 gets a LOT of attention. Mostly positives. So many nods, smiles, thumbs up. My neighbour asked if they could sit it in etc. That surprised me.
Overall it's a very good car. Is it worth almost 5x my E90? Not a chance!
Its capabilities are incredible. I feel like I'm barely scratching the surface but it is bonkers fast and composed, it inspires so much confidence.
I still don't like the steering. With the exhaust turned up loud when driving at 6 10ths it does sound quite good, but under full throttle, whilst not bad, it's not a patch on my S65 for noise, although performance is another level.
Love the brakes, love the performance, all you could ever need. I don't particularly like the instrument cluster, it's a bit too much "PlayStation", but that's me being a dinosaur probably.
I do miss the E90, but I am very worried it's going to feel dog slow when I get it back
The styling...... I don't mind it, but I certainly don't like it, especially the front. Rear I don't mind. I prefer the elegance of the E90. That said the M4 gets a LOT of attention. Mostly positives. So many nods, smiles, thumbs up. My neighbour asked if they could sit it in etc. That surprised me.
Overall it's a very good car. Is it worth almost 5x my E90? Not a chance!
E90_M3Ross said:
I think us lot must be dinosaurs, the amount of positive comments the car gets is very surprising. Whether it's because "it looks new and shiny" or whether people genuinely like the design I'm not sure. I think overall it's quite fussy, and not elegant or pretty. The front I don't hate, but likewise I don't think "wow, that looks nice", I think it's quite ugly. It's brutish.
This is my view, it's just too brash to be good looking. I've not driven one, but it seems to be too fast and effective to be as much fun as it could be. I think I prefer feel and tactility rather than outright pace.MikeM6 said:
E90_M3Ross said:
I think us lot must be dinosaurs, the amount of positive comments the car gets is very surprising. Whether it's because "it looks new and shiny" or whether people genuinely like the design I'm not sure. I think overall it's quite fussy, and not elegant or pretty. The front I don't hate, but likewise I don't think "wow, that looks nice", I think it's quite ugly. It's brutish.
This is my view, it's just too brash to be good looking. I've not driven one, but it seems to be too fast and effective to be as much fun as it could be. I think I prefer feel and tactility rather than outright pace.Tagteam said:
What did you think when you got the e90 back
Mixed views! I'll try to summarise but give a bit of detail.Engine - As soon as I got in the M3, started it up and moved 6 feet immediately you feel "this engine just feels more special". That special is subjective, however. In my opinion, it just sounds better and more authentic. It is, however, noticeably slower. There is such a gulf in performance in a straight line. Is the E90 slow? No, of course not, it is still a quick car. You need to work it to get the best from it. For some that is a positive thing. It is, without a shadow of a doubt, the more rewarding engine. You WANT to rev it. The noise, the drama, 8400rpm, it is utterly glorious. If you want to make rapid progress, it can still very much do it, but if you want to make rapid progress without revving the engine hard....then the turbocharged 6 cylinder is the much better machine. I didn't like the way that when you get much past 6k rpm (but well before the 7200rpm redline) the power seems to drop off a bit. No encouragement to hit the redline, certainly compared to the wonder S65B40.
Gearbox - Honestly, not much between them. I think the DCT, again, offers more character and charm. It's smooth, but not AS smooth. It's faster, but not by much. It does a better job of rev matching (shift from 3rd to 2nd off the throttle in the E90 and the noise is grin-inducing - something the M4 couldn't hope to match). Ratios - DCT 7 speed are generally more "traditional" and there isn't a single overdrive gear - The E90 would go beyond top speed in 6th, and continue into 7th, whereas the newer car has 2 overdrive gears. The newer car is noticeably more economical. Which do I prefer? Honestly, I'm not fussed. There isn't much between them in my opinion. Drama? Probably DCT. Smoothness? ZF8. Daily driver? ZF8 probably. Weekend country blast? DCT.
Steering - Feel - no question, E90, all day long. The G82 is very light, and consistently so. It doesn't seem to weight up much, if at all. It is, however, incredibly accurate and direct. Without any shadow of a doubt, the E90 trumps it here. Although some might argue it is quite heavy at times.
Brakes - No question, G82. They're superb. The E90 brakes are very good and sharp, require a bit more force and arguably the pedal is a tad more linear, but I don't think they stop quite so well. It has definitely made me consider getting uprated pads (Ferodo DS2500 instead of the Brembo it has), fluid (Motul 660 instead of the basic ATE DOT4) and Goodridge braided hoses for improved performance. In reality, even for hard road driving, I don't think uprated calipers are necessary.
Chassis and suspension - G82, obviously. Only since having the E90 back have I really thrown it into some corners and to be honest with you, it is still so capable that I think if you're going beyond its limits on the road, you're driving way too fast. It is such a well sorted, balanced, and well-damped chassis that I think having a much more capable chassis on the road isn't necessary. On the track, however, this is obviously different. Ride quality.....honestly, I may go so far as to say the G82 has this. The E90 is far from harsh (as I gather the F80 can be), but I do think the G82 is better. It rides very well. My E90 doesn't have EDC, but I remember the firmest setting for that being ridiculous. I cannot remember comfort.
Interior - call me a luddite - but I prefer the E90 on the whole. It is well laid-out. I prefer the instrument cluster, I think the digital display is too much tech for the sake of it. I liked the HUD, I can live without it. Infotainment obviously better, but I'm actually having a new system fitted to my E90 tomorrow, including a reversing camera, so I'll have Android Auto, Apple CarPlay etc. The seats in the E90 are wonderful. The carbon buckets in the G82 were absolutely amazing. I loved them. Not an interior issue per se, but from the interior I found there to be a big blind spot where the OS mirror is. It can be hard to place the car accurately.
Styling - E90 seems so small and elegant. I much prefer it. I grew to like the G82 rear end's aggressive stance, but not the front end. Could I live with it? Of course, but not in that colour. It is also a much bigger car which would suit some, but I prefer the size of the E90.
Would I take a G80/2 M3/4 over the E90 if the prices/values were the same? Yes, I would (M3 for me, not M4). If mine is worth, maybe £22-23k (looking at examples online now) do I personally think a new one is worth 3-5x the price? No. If my car goes up in value, would I consider selling it and changing in 3-5 years time if I can get an XDrive G80 M3 Comp for the same price? Quite possibly. Am I disappointed to have the E90 back? Definitely not, it is a wonderful car.
Edited by E90_M3Ross on Thursday 27th April 21:30
cerb4.5lee said:
I really enjoyed reading your sum up thanks Ross. 
You're welcome! I'd love to try an F80/2 M3/4 to compare now! I think I'd like the performance but I gather the engine is more spiky and even less exciting than the current one, but until you try you never know.I know you didn't gel with your E90, we're all different but I absolutely understand why people prefer the turbo engines, certainly for daily drivers. I think for a weekend blast the E90 is quick enough. I do, however, feel that the M4 was putting out more than 510bhp. I've been in numerous 550bhp+ cars, even turbocharged ones, and this felt right up there, or even quicker. Was seriously potent.
Tagteam said:
What infotainment system are you fitting to the e90 - I’m keen to do the same to my e92. Is it DIY or going to an installer .
integratedautomotive.co.uk/product/2008-2013-bmw-3-series-all-body-shapes-e90-e91-e92-e93-carplay-and-android-auto-retrofit-multimedia-interface/I actually had it fitted yesterday, with reversing camera. It's definitely not DIY in my opinion (although I'm useless). Glove box needs to be dropped and lots of trim removed.
It's a really good bit of kit and brings the system bang up to date. I'm chuffed with it!
E90_M3Ross said:
Tagteam said:
What infotainment system are you fitting to the e90 - I’m keen to do the same to my e92. Is it DIY or going to an installer .
integratedautomotive.co.uk/product/2008-2013-bmw-3-series-all-body-shapes-e90-e91-e92-e93-carplay-and-android-auto-retrofit-multimedia-interface/I actually had it fitted yesterday, with reversing camera. It's definitely not DIY in my opinion (although I'm useless). Glove box needs to be dropped and lots of trim removed.
It's a really good bit of kit and brings the system bang up to date. I'm chuffed with it!
time waster said:
E90_M3Ross said:
Tagteam said:
What infotainment system are you fitting to the e90 - I’m keen to do the same to my e92. Is it DIY or going to an installer .
integratedautomotive.co.uk/product/2008-2013-bmw-3-series-all-body-shapes-e90-e91-e92-e93-carplay-and-android-auto-retrofit-multimedia-interface/I actually had it fitted yesterday, with reversing camera. It's definitely not DIY in my opinion (although I'm useless). Glove box needs to be dropped and lots of trim removed.
It's a really good bit of kit and brings the system bang up to date. I'm chuffed with it!
Interesting summary; I’ve come to realise that I too am firmly in the dinosaur group.
The grilles don’t bother me so much on the G series cars, but the side profiles do. I think they look very big, very heavy and slab sided. The junction between the rear doors and rear arches is appalling on the M3. I think the touring is they pick of the bunch.
I do like the latest BMW interiors, although prefer the pre facelift cars with buttons! The bucket seats look fab but I do wonder if they’ll wear thin as a daily because they don’t look the easiest to get in and out of.
I have been very critical of BMW’s digital display because I hate the silly shaped dials but it’s actually very good to use and I grew to quite like it in the 320i I had for a week.
The steering on modern BMW’s is dire and seems to get worse with every iteration. I don’t mind the EPAS on my other half’s 125i but hated it in my M140i and thought it was even worse in the G20 I had for a week.
The S65 is a very special engine which I think would be hard to beat (other than it’s thirst for super). The modern turbocharged engines are massively effective but lack the best of a good N/A engine but do make for a very good daily.
The grilles don’t bother me so much on the G series cars, but the side profiles do. I think they look very big, very heavy and slab sided. The junction between the rear doors and rear arches is appalling on the M3. I think the touring is they pick of the bunch.
I do like the latest BMW interiors, although prefer the pre facelift cars with buttons! The bucket seats look fab but I do wonder if they’ll wear thin as a daily because they don’t look the easiest to get in and out of.
I have been very critical of BMW’s digital display because I hate the silly shaped dials but it’s actually very good to use and I grew to quite like it in the 320i I had for a week.
The steering on modern BMW’s is dire and seems to get worse with every iteration. I don’t mind the EPAS on my other half’s 125i but hated it in my M140i and thought it was even worse in the G20 I had for a week.
The S65 is a very special engine which I think would be hard to beat (other than it’s thirst for super). The modern turbocharged engines are massively effective but lack the best of a good N/A engine but do make for a very good daily.
The car is pretty big, it certainly feels a lot bigger than the E90. It's over 20cm longer and also a fair bit wider.
The interior is nice, the materials feel fine but it doesn't feel "hemmed in" like the E90 does. It feels more like how a 5 series interior should in my opinion.
A touring would be very nice as a daily! You're right about the engine. Having said that though, anyone who says the S65 doesn't have enough torque for a daily is, in my opinion, daft. It isn't like a 60bhp hatchback.
The interior is nice, the materials feel fine but it doesn't feel "hemmed in" like the E90 does. It feels more like how a 5 series interior should in my opinion.
A touring would be very nice as a daily! You're right about the engine. Having said that though, anyone who says the S65 doesn't have enough torque for a daily is, in my opinion, daft. It isn't like a 60bhp hatchback.
E90_M3Ross said:
The car is pretty big, it certainly feels a lot bigger than the E90. It's over 20cm longer and also a fair bit wider.
The interior is nice, the materials feel fine but it doesn't feel "hemmed in" like the E90 does. It feels more like how a 5 series interior should in my opinion.
A touring would be very nice as a daily! You're right about the engine. Having said that though, anyone who says the S65 doesn't have enough torque for a daily is, in my opinion, daft. It isn't like a 60bhp hatchback.
I think the E9x shape has aged amazingly well. In fact, it's got better with age rather than staying contemporary.The interior is nice, the materials feel fine but it doesn't feel "hemmed in" like the E90 does. It feels more like how a 5 series interior should in my opinion.
A touring would be very nice as a daily! You're right about the engine. Having said that though, anyone who says the S65 doesn't have enough torque for a daily is, in my opinion, daft. It isn't like a 60bhp hatchback.
The sheer bulk of the G8x is enough to put me off. I don't mind a bit of a wider track on M-cars but it just looks a bit out of proportion width-wise.
I must admit to having mixed feelings about S65. It is a technical marvel but I always felt both of mine felt a bit too linear in their power delivery even when the revs were high. I prefer a bit of a rush to the redline on a high-revving n/a engine. In some ways I thought the turbo'd S55 had a bit more energy at the top end even if the noise / drama was lacking.
The discussion about torque will go round in circles for ever! I think they can feel a bit flat-footed in the 3k - 5k band, but they have excellent throttle response below that, and a good power band above it.
KPB1973 said:
I think the E9x shape has aged amazingly well. In fact, it's got better with age rather than staying contemporary.
The sheer bulk of the G8x is enough to put me off. I don't mind a bit of a wider track on M-cars but it just looks a bit out of proportion width-wise.
I must admit to having mixed feelings about S65. It is a technical marvel but I always felt both of mine felt a bit too linear in their power delivery even when the revs were high. I prefer a bit of a rush to the redline on a high-revving n/a engine. In some ways I thought the turbo'd S55 had a bit more energy at the top end even if the noise / drama was lacking.
The discussion about torque will go round in circles for ever! I think they can feel a bit flat-footed in the 3k - 5k band, but they have excellent throttle response below that, and a good power band above it.
I honestly think most people who complain about the torque don't know how to drive it and use a gearbox.The sheer bulk of the G8x is enough to put me off. I don't mind a bit of a wider track on M-cars but it just looks a bit out of proportion width-wise.
I must admit to having mixed feelings about S65. It is a technical marvel but I always felt both of mine felt a bit too linear in their power delivery even when the revs were high. I prefer a bit of a rush to the redline on a high-revving n/a engine. In some ways I thought the turbo'd S55 had a bit more energy at the top end even if the noise / drama was lacking.
The discussion about torque will go round in circles for ever! I think they can feel a bit flat-footed in the 3k - 5k band, but they have excellent throttle response below that, and a good power band above it.
Its torque curve is very flat, and it produces over 400bhp. The trouble is people drive it like any other engine and moan. For example, if you typically shift gear at 1800rpm in a diesel which revs to 4500rpm, you wouldn't shift gear at 1800rpm with the S65. 8400rpm/4500rpm is 1.8666 times higher redline. So for the equivalent stress for the engine you would shift up at around 3300-3400rpm..... Drive it that way and, for a naturally aspirated car, it isn't weak at all.
You wouldn't shift at 2k rpm on a bike engine that revs to 15k and say it can't pull.....
E90_M3Ross said:
KPB1973 said:
I think the E9x shape has aged amazingly well. In fact, it's got better with age rather than staying contemporary.
The sheer bulk of the G8x is enough to put me off. I don't mind a bit of a wider track on M-cars but it just looks a bit out of proportion width-wise.
I must admit to having mixed feelings about S65. It is a technical marvel but I always felt both of mine felt a bit too linear in their power delivery even when the revs were high. I prefer a bit of a rush to the redline on a high-revving n/a engine. In some ways I thought the turbo'd S55 had a bit more energy at the top end even if the noise / drama was lacking.
The discussion about torque will go round in circles for ever! I think they can feel a bit flat-footed in the 3k - 5k band, but they have excellent throttle response below that, and a good power band above it.
I honestly think most people who complain about the torque don't know how to drive it and use a gearbox.The sheer bulk of the G8x is enough to put me off. I don't mind a bit of a wider track on M-cars but it just looks a bit out of proportion width-wise.
I must admit to having mixed feelings about S65. It is a technical marvel but I always felt both of mine felt a bit too linear in their power delivery even when the revs were high. I prefer a bit of a rush to the redline on a high-revving n/a engine. In some ways I thought the turbo'd S55 had a bit more energy at the top end even if the noise / drama was lacking.
The discussion about torque will go round in circles for ever! I think they can feel a bit flat-footed in the 3k - 5k band, but they have excellent throttle response below that, and a good power band above it.
Its torque curve is very flat, and it produces over 400bhp. The trouble is people drive it like any other engine and moan. For example, if you typically shift gear at 1800rpm in a diesel which revs to 4500rpm, you wouldn't shift gear at 1800rpm with the S65. 8400rpm/4500rpm is 1.8666 times higher redline. So for the equivalent stress for the engine you would shift up at around 3300-3400rpm..... Drive it that way and, for a naturally aspirated car, it isn't weak at all.
You wouldn't shift at 2k rpm on a bike engine that revs to 15k and say it can't pull.....
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