BMW E46 M3, what is it to you, iconic, overrated, epic etc.?
Discussion
CRA1G said:
I can't believe you think the Z4M Roadster has a stiffer chassis than the E46 M3 Coupe...? I've not just driven both I've owned both Z4MR and Z4MC still have an M3 and Z3MC but side by side having tracked both and there's now way the Z4MR is anywhere near stiffer than the M3 totally different cars.....
Your wrong, the z4mr is stiffer but don't let your bias get in the way. List below:Alfa 159 - 31,400 Nm/deg
Aston Martin DB9 Coupe - 27,000 Nm/deg
Aston Martin DB9 Convertible - 15,500 Nm/deg
Aston Martin Rapide - 28,000 Nm/deg
Aston Martin Vanquish - 28,500 Nm/deg
Audi A2 - 11,900 Nm/deg
Audi A8 - 25,000 Nm/deg
Audi R8 - (2014 MY) - 40,000 Nm/deg
Audi TT Coupe - 19,000 Nm/deg
Bentley Azure - 18,000 Nm/deg
Bugatti EB110 - 19,000 Nm/deg
Bugatti Veyron - 60,000 Nm/deg
Bugatti Veyron Grand Sport - 22,000 Nm/deg
BMW E30 M3 - 23,000 Nm/deg
BMW E36 Touring - 10,900 Nm/deg
BMW E36 Z3 - 5,600 Nm/deg
BMW E46 Sedan (w/o folding seats) - 18,000 Nm/deg
BMW E46 Sedan (w/folding seats) - 13,000 Nm/deg
BMW E46 Wagon (w/folding seats) - 14,000 Nm/deg
BMW E46 Coupe (w/folding seats) - 12,500 Nm/deg
BMW E46 Convertible - 10,500 Nm/deg
BMW E53 X5 (2004) - 23,100 Nm/deg
BMW E90 - 22,500 Nm/deg
BMW Z4 Coupe - 32,000 Nm/deg
BMW Z4 Roadster - 14,500 Nm/deg
BMW E39 5 - 24,000 Nm/deg
BMW E60 5 - 24,000 Nm/deg
BMW F10 5 - 37,500 Nm/deg
BMW F07 5GT - 31,000 Nm/deg
BMW E70 X5 - 28,000 Nm/deg
Chrysler Crossfire - 20,140 Nm/deg
Chrysler Durango - 6,800 Nm/deg
Chevrolet Cobalt - 28 Hz (conversion anyone??)
Chevrolet Corvette C5 - 9,100 Nm/deg
Chevrolet Cruze - 17,600 Nm/deg
Dodge Viper Coupe - 7,600 Nm/deg
Ferrari 360 Spider - 8,500 Nm/deg
Ferrari F50 - 34,600 Nm/deg
Ferrari 355 - 1,024 kgm/degree (bending: 727 kg/mm)
Fisker Karma - 33,000 Nm/deg
Ford Focus 3d - 19,600 Nm/deg
Ford Focus 5d - 17,900 Nm/deg
Ford GT - 27,100 Nm/deg
Ford GT40 MkI - 17,000 Nm/deg
Ford Mustang 2003 - 16,000 Nm/deg
Ford Mustang 2005 - 21,000 Nm/deg
Ford Mustang Convertible (2003) - 4,800 Nm/deg
Ford Mustang Convertible (2005) - 9,500 Nm/deg
Jaguar X-Type Sedan - 22,000 Nm/deg
Jaguar X-Type Estate - 16,319 Nm/deg
Jaguar XK - 16,000 Nm/deg
Koenigsegg Agera - 58,000 Nm/deg
Koenigsegg Agera R - 65,000 Nm/deg
Koenigsegg CC-8 - 28,100 Nm/deg
Lamborghini Aventador - 35,000 Nm/deg
Lamborghini Countach - 2,600 Nm/deg
Lambo Gallardo - 23,000 Nm/deg
Lamborghini Gallardo Super Trofeo Stradale - 35,000 Nm/deg
Lamborghini Murcielago - 20,000 Nm/deg
Land rover Freelander 2 - 28,000 Nm/deg
Lexus LF-A - 39,130 Nm/deg
Lotus Elan - 7,900 Nm/deg
Lotus Elan GRP body - 8,900 Nm/deg
Lotus Elise - 10,000 Nm/deg
Lotus Elise 111s - 11,000 Nm/deg
Lotus Esprit SE Turbo - 5,850 Nm/deg
Lotus Elise S2 Exige (2004) - 10,500 Nm/deg
Maserati QP - 18,000 Nm/deg
Mazda Rx-7 - 15,000 Nm/deg
Mazda Rx-8 - 30,000 Nm/deg
McLaren F1 - 13,500 Nm/deg
Mercedes Benz SL - With top down - 17,000 Nm/deg, with top up 21,000 Nm/deg
Mercedes Benz W212 E - 29,920 Nm/deg
Mini (2003) - 24,500 Nm/deg
Opel Astra - 12,000 Nm/deg
Pagani Zonda C12 - 25,000 Nm/deg
Pagani Zonda C12 S - 26,300 Nm/deg
Pagani Zonda F - 27,000 Nm/deg
Pagani Zonda Roadster - 18,000 Nm/deg
Porsche 959 - 12,900 Nm/deg
Porsche 911 Turbo (2000) - 13,500 Nm/deg
Porsche 911 Turbo 996 - 27,000 Nm/deg
Porsche 911 Turbo 996 Convertible - 11,600 Nm/deg
Porsche 911 (997) - 33,000 Nm/deg
Porsche Carrera GT - 26,000Nm/deg
Renault Sport Spider - 10,000 Nm/deg
Rolls-Royce Phantom - 40,500 Nm/deg
Saab 9-3 Sportcombi - 21,000 Nm/deg
Volkswagen Fox - 17,941 Nm/deg
Volkswagen Passat (2006) - 32,400 Nm/deg
Volkswagen Phaeton - 37,000 Nm/deg
Volkswagen Golf V GTI - 25,000 Nm/deg
Volvo S60 - 20,000 Nm/deg
Volvo S80 - 18,600 Nm/de
To be honest most of this is top trumps, means f
k all in the real world but it makes people look good to pretend. Regardless M3 E46 is a better handling car than any z4m despite its rigidity which makes the whole argument a bit pointless.
I found myself browsing E92 M3's last night and they are coming down in price. Around the £10k mark...I reckon that it would be quite a tricky decision on whether you go for the E46 or E92.
I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
trackdemon said:
I always enjoy it when folks can look past fairly meaningless stats, and get to the nub of the point
I have to agree.... stats are one thing,personal experience is another,imo the E46 M3 chassis has a far greater driving commitment on the track over the ZMR but everyone is different I think the ZMC is much closer like for like... but this is my humble opinion... I'm just waiting to be able to get out and drive mine now...
stay safe...Get a nice low mileage coupe with good history and drive it on the weekends. Can be great fun- not the fastest car and obviously refinement won’t be as great as brand new stuff. However, it will make you smile. You don’t have to go twice the speed limit really quickly to enjoy your driving experience.
thegermancarguy said:
Get a nice low mileage coupe with good history and drive it on the weekends. Can be great fun- not the fastest car and obviously refinement won’t be as great as brand new stuff. However, it will make you smile. You don’t have to go twice the speed limit really quickly to enjoy your driving experience.
oGiven they are up to what 21 years old and newest what 15 years old what would be classed as low mileage for a mass produced car?
The E36 M3 hasn’t increased in value so buying one on the hope it increases in value if the total wrong reason & likely it will not happen. But one because you want the car because you like it’s looks it’s engine the whole experience.
Buying on the hope of increase in value is always wrong given E36 and virus and E92 all giving mega downward pressure on values it’s never going to happen. Enjoy it get a nice example and given it’s cheap entry practically there is little to lose in outright terms.
thegermancarguy said:
I think sub 60 miles is low mileage. They will increase in value. Maybe not for the next year or so.
Can you explain why they (massive mass produced car) will increase invalue when owners of the E36 have been saying the same thing for decades and nada. Add in ruined economy too I’m struggling to see how anyone would think they w increase in value in a year or so. They will not unless you bought a distressed sale/under market value.
They are not rare
The CS and CLS have the limited numbers but as you know their value has dropped notably even before the virus destroyed our economy.
The next Feb starts at £10k
The older generation that owners have banged on about for decades that they are going up never have and are in much lower numbers than the E46 M3.
I like the hope - but you buy on wanting the car assume it loses value and costs money to run and plan for something to fail as they are very old cars now most hammered /enjoyed.
60k in classic car terms is huge miles , 30k is toppy for classic cars otherwise they are simply not worth it.
But it as a car and enjoy it as a car - I wish people would stop talking about value going up it’s a dream world utterly unrealistic and masks the real running costs of a 15-21 year old old car. New brake lines for example new condenser total replacement of all rubber bushes etc.
Value is always a positive when u factor in maintenance etc over a period of few years I don’t expect them to rise like Z3Ms or e30 m3s. However they have already risen quite a lot over the past 5 years. Especially the CS and CSLs- limited I know but good coupes have also gone up quite appreciably over the same time. Imo I don’t see anything happening over the next year or so but long term they’ll increase as there are a lot of people who have a soft spot for them.
thegermancarguy said:
Value is always a positive when u factor in maintenance etc over a period of few years I don’t expect them to rise like Z3Ms or e30 m3s. However they have already risen quite a lot over the past 5 years. Especially the CS and CSLs- limited I know but good coupes have also gone up quite appreciably over the same time. Imo I don’t see anything happening over the next year or so but long term they’ll increase as there are a lot of people who have a soft spot for them.
I think Z3MC's have reached their peak for the moment but prices were getting silly,not a concern for me though I think I'm safe with the £13k I paid for my 60,000 mile "clowns shoe" 8 years ago.....CRA1G said:
I think Z3MC's have reached their peak for the moment but prices were getting silly,not a concern for me though I think I'm safe with the £13k I paid for my 60,000 mile "clowns shoe" 8 years ago.....
You’re right they have peaked over the past year- I sold my estoril blue on for 23k almost 2 years ago. It would be the same price now. I do think they’re one of the best looking sports car BMw produced
cerb4.5lee said:
I found myself browsing E92 M3's last night and they are coming down in price. Around the £10k mark...I reckon that it would be quite a tricky decision on whether you go for the E46 or E92.
I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
I've been watching these e92s... they've Been coming down steadily over the past year. If these dip below 10k I'll have no choice but to add one to the garage! I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
I too love the appearance of the e46, I think BMW nailed it there. In terms of the engine I think it's a bit overrated, though I can see how it must have been revolutionary in its day.
MKA29 said:
I've been watching these e92s... they've Been coming down steadily over the past year. If these dip below 10k I'll have no choice but to add one to the garage!
I too love the appearance of the e46, I think BMW nailed it there. In terms of the engine I think it's a bit overrated, though I can see how it must have been revolutionary in its day.
What about the turbo M3/4? Oldest ones of these are getting great value & new technology inside the car + so much quicker than E36/46/92. I too love the appearance of the e46, I think BMW nailed it there. In terms of the engine I think it's a bit overrated, though I can see how it must have been revolutionary in its day.
MKA29 said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I found myself browsing E92 M3's last night and they are coming down in price. Around the £10k mark...I reckon that it would be quite a tricky decision on whether you go for the E46 or E92.
I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
I've been watching these e92s... they've Been coming down steadily over the past year. If these dip below 10k I'll have no choice but to add one to the garage! I was stood next to a E46 M3 the other day and nostalgia really grabbed a hold of me, and the shape/stance is really nice I thought.
I too love the appearance of the e46, I think BMW nailed it there. In terms of the engine I think it's a bit overrated, though I can see how it must have been revolutionary in its day.
cerb4.5lee said:
I have a bit of a love/hate relationship with the engine too(I had the E46 M3's engine in a Z4M). On the one hand I respect that the engine won many awards...but on the other hand I've never liked the way it sounds. Plus the power delivery can make it feel a lot less powerful than it actually is I reckon.
Keep the engine spinning at 4-5k rpm and upwards all of the time it flies - but any NA engine will lose out to an equally powerful turbo version with its low end grunt. Welshbeef said:
What about the turbo M3/4? Oldest ones of these are getting great value & new technology inside the car + so much quicker than E36/46/92.
I do like the new M3. I was lucky enough to be a passenger on track with a young racing driver who - quite literally- drove the wheels off of it. It's nothing short of brutal in the right hands.
The e92 gave the same buzz at (semi) legal speeds! Nothing beats that raw NA engine
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