Horrendous valve train/HLA noise
Discussion
Right, I know this has been covered plenty of times, and I've read plenty of stuff on the subject already. But I thought I could do with some fresh ears.
The car was fine when I bought it. I covered about 300 mixed miles the week I bought it, then it sat in my garage for about 5 weeks. It began to make noise on the last day as I put it away, but as I'd read about it plenty of times I just assumed it was the HLAs and it all seemed to make sense.
Anyway, today, Fired it up, its very noisy now.
I've just changed the oil, added some Wynn's HLA treatment, let the car warm up a few times, and its still there. Admittedly its not actually run that long, and I'm not insured yet so can't drive it further than 100mtrs down the private driveway (ahem).
It smoked a bit too when I first started it, which also suggests to me that a Valve is sticking or perhaps not seating down quite properly?
Other than the noise, then engine actually sounds and feels quite healthy - oil pressure if fine, temp is fine, it revs up and down cleanly, solid idle etc. Other than the very distinctive tapping the engine sounds fine. Just like it was the week I bought it, less than a hundred miles ago.
Its certainly coming from the head and you can hear it through the filler cap if you take it off. So I'm pretty confident its nothing dramatic like a bearing in the block, and theres no leaks that I can see.
The oil that came out, despite supposedly not being that old, was pretty black and grotty.
Wisely - I've not filled it with Mobil 1. I've used some reasonably quality semi-synth, on the assumption that I may well be flushing it through again very soon.
Reccomendations? I'm a little bit loathe to try the 'italian tune-up' method unless I'm more confident that it should do the trick. Time and a few miles? How long shall I leave it before flushing it through with another lot of oil?
If I get a compression test done, that would show a sticking/badly seated valve up as an erroneously low pressure on one cylinder (The frequency of the tapping is such that i think its just 1 of 16 that is stuck) ?
I'm not too keen on putting any very strong oil flush additives in it as its 14yrs and 80 thousand miles old.
ETA - here it is - http://flickr.com/photos/simonholehan/3148337148/ Sound quality not that great unfortunately.
The car was fine when I bought it. I covered about 300 mixed miles the week I bought it, then it sat in my garage for about 5 weeks. It began to make noise on the last day as I put it away, but as I'd read about it plenty of times I just assumed it was the HLAs and it all seemed to make sense.
Anyway, today, Fired it up, its very noisy now.
I've just changed the oil, added some Wynn's HLA treatment, let the car warm up a few times, and its still there. Admittedly its not actually run that long, and I'm not insured yet so can't drive it further than 100mtrs down the private driveway (ahem).
It smoked a bit too when I first started it, which also suggests to me that a Valve is sticking or perhaps not seating down quite properly?
Other than the noise, then engine actually sounds and feels quite healthy - oil pressure if fine, temp is fine, it revs up and down cleanly, solid idle etc. Other than the very distinctive tapping the engine sounds fine. Just like it was the week I bought it, less than a hundred miles ago.
Its certainly coming from the head and you can hear it through the filler cap if you take it off. So I'm pretty confident its nothing dramatic like a bearing in the block, and theres no leaks that I can see.
The oil that came out, despite supposedly not being that old, was pretty black and grotty.
Wisely - I've not filled it with Mobil 1. I've used some reasonably quality semi-synth, on the assumption that I may well be flushing it through again very soon.
Reccomendations? I'm a little bit loathe to try the 'italian tune-up' method unless I'm more confident that it should do the trick. Time and a few miles? How long shall I leave it before flushing it through with another lot of oil?
If I get a compression test done, that would show a sticking/badly seated valve up as an erroneously low pressure on one cylinder (The frequency of the tapping is such that i think its just 1 of 16 that is stuck) ?
I'm not too keen on putting any very strong oil flush additives in it as its 14yrs and 80 thousand miles old.
ETA - here it is - http://flickr.com/photos/simonholehan/3148337148/ Sound quality not that great unfortunately.
Edited by snotrag on Monday 29th December 19:01
Its been suggested on another forum that it may not the Valvetrain and could be the wobbly pulley thing - Im going to check tomorrow but I'm pretty sure, and rather more hopeful, that its not that!
So if it is the Valves - taking the cam cover seems like a good idea as I presume its pretty easy - new seals required?
If I do take the Tappets out to clean - I presume the process is remove cam cover, then the cams will need to be lifted out too - which involves disturbing the timing belt. So, I may aswell do that at the same time, rather than trying to refit an old belt in the right place...?
So if it is the Valves - taking the cam cover seems like a good idea as I presume its pretty easy - new seals required?
If I do take the Tappets out to clean - I presume the process is remove cam cover, then the cams will need to be lifted out too - which involves disturbing the timing belt. So, I may aswell do that at the same time, rather than trying to refit an old belt in the right place...?
Its the Wynns hydraulic tappet treatment thats in there, was recommended. I only added it after letting the engine run for a while initially - It doesnt seem to have done a huge amount but we will see.
As for doing a full on engine flush, I'm still not sold. If there IS goop in my oilways and bores, then I'm not sure I want to move it. its just the area round the tappets and the valve seats that bothers me!
As for doing a full on engine flush, I'm still not sold. If there IS goop in my oilways and bores, then I'm not sure I want to move it. its just the area round the tappets and the valve seats that bothers me!
The pulley was rock solid in all directions, belts all felt fine too.
So I started it... and after about 5 seconds the noise fell to a tenth of what it was yesterday. Sorted. I'll run it for a few hundred miles then change the oil again, If I then change it regularly I guess I should be able to keep it at bay for most of the time.
So I started it... and after about 5 seconds the noise fell to a tenth of what it was yesterday. Sorted. I'll run it for a few hundred miles then change the oil again, If I then change it regularly I guess I should be able to keep it at bay for most of the time.
Panic over. Went out today in the freezing cold. Slight tapping as I rolled out the garage, after 10 minutes it was warmed up and far smoother. did about 70 miles on B-roads, the engine was working fine. Can't wait to get some 15's and decent tyres on though! And I'm gonna book in for alignment ASAP. Thanks to the tyres and the very slick, cold roads, a quite high proportion of the 70 miles was with wheel spin. It spins out of every T junction, its almost farcical. Diff must be working well as you can hold it very easily!
All said and done - I'm chuffed it seems to be working well now and I can finally drive it. Well aware I need to be very careful at first though, I would like to keep this car for a while!
All said and done - I'm chuffed it seems to be working well now and I can finally drive it. Well aware I need to be very careful at first though, I would like to keep this car for a while!
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