Sir Ben & the Americas Cup
Discussion
rossb said:
Penguinracer said:
The Cup needs to capitalise on the small amount of momentum it has generated.
Agree 100% - throw in a bit of rule stability like continuing with AC75 - or at least allow some class input outside holder+direct challenger to even the playing field a bit and we should be able to get Jim to weigh in again. More friends who dont race boats have talked to me about sailing this winter than ever before after seeing ac75 - might even get a few to come out racing - untill they realise an ac75 at 50 knots has very little in common with reality of bashing around solent in spring at considerably lower speed ??Where I swim there’s all kinds of foiling going on from small boats to windsurfers and boards that people stand on. Some of them seem to be moving at amazing speeds in relatively light winds.
Getting hit by a boat when swimming always seems bad enough but there something even worse about a faster moving object with blades under the water.
It’s obviously not just about adding a foil to any old boat but it always looks amazing seeing (and hearing) them fly by (from a safe distance).
Presumably they’re harder to sail though?
El stovey said:
There seems to be loads of foiling craft around now though?
Where I swim there’s all kinds of foiling going on from small boats to windsurfers and boards that people stand on. Some of them seem to be moving at amazing speeds in relatively light winds.
Getting hit by a boat when swimming always seems bad enough but there something even worse about a faster moving object with blades under the water.
It’s obviously not just about adding a foil to any old boat but it always looks amazing seeing (and hearing) them fly by (from a safe distance).
Presumably they’re harder to sail though?
It’s very common for small craft like moths and sail boards but still not common on yachts as I imagine the cost plus current skill levels will be quite a jump. Where I swim there’s all kinds of foiling going on from small boats to windsurfers and boards that people stand on. Some of them seem to be moving at amazing speeds in relatively light winds.
Getting hit by a boat when swimming always seems bad enough but there something even worse about a faster moving object with blades under the water.
It’s obviously not just about adding a foil to any old boat but it always looks amazing seeing (and hearing) them fly by (from a safe distance).
Presumably they’re harder to sail though?
ecsrobin said:
It’s very common for small craft like moths and sail boards but still not common on yachts as I imagine the cost plus current skill levels will be quite a jump.
Those foiling moths look fantastic, the internet suggests smaller foiling craft have been around for ages but I’ve only really started seeing them more (in the reservoir I go to) over the last couple of years. classicaholic said:
I wonder how you can get a handicap for a foiling yacht, waterline length dosnt really matter or hull shape but you might get hammered on overhangs!
Basically, I'd suggest it would be next to impossible to get a fair single handicap for a foiling yacht that covered all wind strengths. I'm on the committee that sets the dinghy PY's and it's hard enough trying to set a single moth number that we gave up a few years ago. We had a suggested number for when foiling but have observed that if they can't foil they are about the same speed as a topper and with the best will in the world no current fixed number handicap system would be able to deal with that range of speeds. They would either win by a mile or lose by a mile. You could try setting multiple numbers based on wind strength but then it opens up a whole can of worms and additional cans of worms are the last thing any club handicapper needs. Who decides the wind strength, OD or sailor when they sign on? Is it the wind strength at start or finish of the race or a guess of mean wind speed? Is it the speed on the clubhouse anemometer or on the start boat or at the windward mark etc etc.....ecsrobin said:
rossb said:
Agree 100% - throw in a bit of rule stability like continuing with AC75 - or at least allow some class input outside holder+direct challenger to even the playing field a bit and we should be able to get Jim to weigh in again. More friends who dont race boats have talked to me about sailing this winter than ever before after seeing ac75 - might even get a few to come out racing - untill they realise an ac75 at 50 knots has very little in common with reality of bashing around solent in spring at considerably lower speed ??
Although all your friends can go away after racing in the spring series knowing they’ve pulled off a better start than SBA 
- that said I thought Ineos starts were much better this weekend - ref spring/finishing off winter series - I see on bramblemet that solent water temperature is currently 6.6 centigrade - a choppy beat in that with a boat with low freeboard will quickly weed out anyone who does not have more than a passing interest in freezing their nuts off!rossb said:
- that said I thought Ineos starts were much better this weekend - ref spring/finishing off winter series - I see on bramblemet that solent water temperature is currently 6.6 centigrade - a choppy beat in that with a boat with low freeboard will quickly weed out anyone who does not have more than a passing interest in freezing their nuts off!How I miss being on the water.
I wonder is foiling can apply to heavier cruising boats?
Some of the boat energy whether supplied by wind or motor would need to be used to lift the boat, meaning less is available for forward thrust, so I guess there is a cross-over where lifting the weight of the boat exceeds the benefits of low drag.
Some of the boat energy whether supplied by wind or motor would need to be used to lift the boat, meaning less is available for forward thrust, so I guess there is a cross-over where lifting the weight of the boat exceeds the benefits of low drag.
bobthemonkey said:
Ayahuasca said:
Will SBA have another crack at it next time?
There was a rumour doing the rounds that SNA/Ineos have agreed to be the Challenger of Record if ETNZ win. Apparently some back room falling out with LR who were CoR for this edition. rossb said:
- that said I thought Ineos starts were much better this weekend - ref spring/finishing off winter series - I see on bramblemet that solent water temperature is currently 6.6 centigrade - a choppy beat in that with a boat with low freeboard will quickly weed out anyone who does not have more than a passing interest in freezing their nuts off!Ayahuasca said:
I wonder is foiling can apply to heavier cruising boats?
Some of the boat energy whether supplied by wind or motor would need to be used to lift the boat, meaning less is available for forward thrust, so I guess there is a cross-over where lifting the weight of the boat exceeds the benefits of low drag.
Canova... 43M, 146T and foils...Some of the boat energy whether supplied by wind or motor would need to be used to lift the boat, meaning less is available for forward thrust, so I guess there is a cross-over where lifting the weight of the boat exceeds the benefits of low drag.
https://www.balticyachts.fi/yachts/baltic-142-cust...
It's not going to fly like an AC75 though.
Chris Stott said:
Canova... 43M, 146T and foils...
https://www.balticyachts.fi/yachts/baltic-142-cust...
It's not going to fly like an AC75 though.
Now that is a nice looking yacht. https://www.balticyachts.fi/yachts/baltic-142-cust...
It's not going to fly like an AC75 though.
Ayahuasca said:
Switching my allegiance to TNZ. Hope they thrash the Italians.
I think ordinarily I'd have switched support straight to TNZ once we were knocked out but having followed the AC Facebook group I've been a bit put off by both sides fans to be honest. Labelled as whinging Poms by NZ or random Brexit taunting s
te from the Italian fans that had nothing to do with sailing so not sure who to support now. It might be nice to have the cup back in Europe one step closer to home though so maybe the Italians are worth a punt. That way ITUK would only have to travel to the Med rather than traipsing half way round the world, freeing up some of the air fare/shipping budget for some faster foils. Then we can bring it home easier next time. Perhaps.....Whinging Poms? That is an Australian expression.
Most Enzedders are descended from British immigrants anyway. Very strange that a Kiwi would use that expression.
I assure you it's not the case. And probably just down to the uneducated and unwashed on Facebook.
Like my post said above...
Welcome, my home is your home.
Most Enzedders are descended from British immigrants anyway. Very strange that a Kiwi would use that expression.
I assure you it's not the case. And probably just down to the uneducated and unwashed on Facebook.
Like my post said above...
Welcome, my home is your home.
Tyre Smoke said:
Whinging Poms? That is an Australian expression.
Most Enzedders are descended from British immigrants anyway. Very strange that a Kiwi would use that expression.
I assure you it's not the case. And probably just down to the uneducated and unwashed on Facebook.
Like my post said above...
Welcome, my home is your home.
Thanks, very kind. Most Enzedders are descended from British immigrants anyway. Very strange that a Kiwi would use that expression.
I assure you it's not the case. And probably just down to the uneducated and unwashed on Facebook.
Like my post said above...
Welcome, my home is your home.
I know you shouldn't take Facebook as a realistic snapshot of life anywhere but sort of thought there was a mutual respect toward all the teams, certainly there was from my end as it was no mean feat just getting a yacht like that to the startline, especially in the midst of a pandemic. I understand it's the AC so there will be the usual argy bargy of rule queries, protests by teams etc but that's part of the cup.
Maybe I misunderstood and it was Aussies stirring it as they couldn't put a challenge together themselves, just had to rent their helm to the Italians...
I am intrigued to see if the 30% smaller foils on your boat will fly early enough and what the reduction in drag will mean to your top speed though! Bring on the 6th March. I think I may yet switch allegiance to TNZ as much prefer Burling to Spithill, mainly as he's a multiple world champ in dinghies as well.
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