The Red Arrows - what is their purpose?
Discussion
Max_Torque said:
But i just want to be able to look up, watch some bloody good pilots race around the sky and with a big smile on my face say "WOW"............. 
For this reason, I miss the Red Bull air races. Hopefully they'll be back.As for the Reds? I can't quite imagine an RAF without them. It just wouldn't be right.
Andy
Quote from BAE Website: "The Red Arrows are ambassadors of the Royal Air Force and Great Britain and we aim to demonstrate UK excellence wherever we display. Our display is the product of highly skilled people in the air and on the ground and a reliable, easy to manoeuvre aircraft in the shape of the BAE Systems Hawk."
I also understand that BAE, RR and others pay 'undisclosed' but significant sums for the Reds to display on overseas export tours. Based on this, BEA sell more trainer jets, pilot training programs, fast jets, and various other support programs.
Objectively, they are without doubt a net contributor to the UK GDP and balance of payments, and great value too.
Subjectively, they are one of the major symbols of 'British', and we should all be very proud to watch them on TV or at airshows.
I also understand that BAE, RR and others pay 'undisclosed' but significant sums for the Reds to display on overseas export tours. Based on this, BEA sell more trainer jets, pilot training programs, fast jets, and various other support programs.
Objectively, they are without doubt a net contributor to the UK GDP and balance of payments, and great value too.
Subjectively, they are one of the major symbols of 'British', and we should all be very proud to watch them on TV or at airshows.
airscrew said:
Objectively, they are without doubt a net contributor to the UK GDP and balance of payments
Where's the evidence for the use of 'objectively' there?Knowing how BAE and other aerospace firms 'operate' in order to win multi-million dollar deals for aircraft sales to overseas governments, I do not believe for a minute that a lovely display by red-painted aircraft contributes anything to the client's decision-making process.
It's pure public relations; something exciting to show when the real details of these deals are hardly ever revealed.
5705 said:
Knowing how BAE and other aerospace firms 'operate' in order to win multi-million dollar deals for aircraft sales to overseas governments, I do not believe for a minute that a lovely display by red-painted aircraft contributes anything to the client's decision-making process.
It's pure public relations; something exciting to show when the real details of these deals are hardly ever revealed.
+1It's pure public relations; something exciting to show when the real details of these deals are hardly ever revealed.
The Gnat trainers displayed around most of the world but there were never any export orders for them.
It's flying the flag for Britain rather than just trying to sell Gnats or Hawks.
The Gnat trainer was a bit of an afterthought. The Gnat was originally developed as a small lightweight single seat fighter - and that is the version that proved more amenable to export customers. The Indians even obtained a production licence as the Ajeet.
The Gnat trainer was a bit of an afterthought. The Gnat was originally developed as a small lightweight single seat fighter - and that is the version that proved more amenable to export customers. The Indians even obtained a production licence as the Ajeet.
I'm with Eric Mc on this one. What use is the hunt for the Higgs Boson, National Parks or education in subjects such as art or music? All of these things improve our happiness as a nation, and are partly or wholly funded out of our taxes. Not all will appeal to everyone, but on the whole they are of positive benefit. Once you take that into account, plus the revenue generated by each one, they start to make sense. This is especially true when you look at them in context with the rest of our taxes. Out of the many tens of thousands of pounds I give to the government every year in tax (grrr..), I expect a tiny fraction goes to fund the Red Arrows. I don't know the figures, but I do know that the Royal Family cost each of us 65 pence, which for me is just over a minute's work 
Chavs sat on their lazy arses all day claiming benefits, only pausing to loot the odd shop or stab a disabled person, probably cost me thousands...
As for the poor guy that was killed, well, huge condolensces to his family and friends, but being part of the Red Arrows is an individual choice for each pilot, and I bet he loved every minute of it. He certainly gave thousands of people pleasure and inspiration, which I think is worth a few pence out of our pockets each year.
Chavs sat on their lazy arses all day claiming benefits, only pausing to loot the odd shop or stab a disabled person, probably cost me thousands...As for the poor guy that was killed, well, huge condolensces to his family and friends, but being part of the Red Arrows is an individual choice for each pilot, and I bet he loved every minute of it. He certainly gave thousands of people pleasure and inspiration, which I think is worth a few pence out of our pockets each year.
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