Better Call Saul - Prequel to Breaking Bad

[smn159]

stemll said:

rewild said:

eccles said:

I've tried watching The Wire probably half a dozen times and I can never get passed the first half dozen episodes or so. I really can't see what the fuss is about.

It's ok, not everybody has to like all the same things. But the problem is you.

Try reading the book The Corner by David Simon. Might help it click.

It’s not him, it’s you The Wire is awful. As before, add Black Bird, For All Mankind and Slow Horses to the watch list but all need Apple TV+

Black Bird easily watched in a free trial as only 6 episodes but worth every minute. Amazing performance from Paul Walter Hauser and anything with with Ray Liotta is worth a watch. Probably fit Slow Horses into the trial too as only 1 season so far.

You may not enjoy The Wire but it's high quality stuff and by no measure is 'awful'

You are therefore completely wrong

[Mojooo]

For me The Wire is good - but its not an enjoyable or quick watch but when it is done you look back and think that many scenes were very good


Better Call Saul doesn't really stand on its own does it - so I am not sure it can be considered a great with Breaking Bad.


Check out The Sopranos

[juggsy]

BobToc said:

juggsy said:

I’ve just started re-watching BB, and have reached s2 ep8 ‘Better Call Saul’. Very different watching it knowing what we now know about him.

I was wondering about that, what do you think is different?

Knowing his back story, what he’s been through, how he gained his connections to the cartel and Fring, it all adds a very different perspective. Not to mention the little references to Ignacio and Lalo.

The scene were Jessie says to Walt ‘You don’t need a criminal lawyer, you need a criminal lawyer’ made me smile. Jimmy used some dubious methods in BCS, but wasn’t the crook Saul was in BB, so you’re also constantly reminded of the character transformation he’s gone through.

I just watched the episode where Saul introduces Fring to WW, and following that where Mike is brought up to clean up Jane’s death. Again all adds a different dimension to the show when we have the additional depth of these chatacters.

[basherX]

Started watching the wire last night. Don’t know if it’s my dodgy aged hearing or just that I’m not attuned to the accents but some of the dialogue is seriously hard to hear. Mumble, mumble, mumble.

[Zetec-S]

Had family staying the last couple of weeks, so only just managed to watch the final episode. The more I think about it, the more I realise what an absolutely superb way to end it.

The only way I can describe it is to say it was a "not so happy, happy ending". He was not a good person, it would have been wrong to get away with it completely, or even get away with a light sentence. But at the same time he was not a bad person, and didn't deserve a tragic ending.

There was a point where I was wondering if he'd go up against Kim in court. I didn't know where he was going with the ice cream demand, and when he found out Kim had "confessed" I was wondering if his spiteful side was going to come out and he was going to try and take her down, so that courtroom scene was a great twist in the plot which I didn't see coming. Great to see him reconcile with Kim at the very end, earn her respect again, and a nice way to wrap it all up.

[lornemalvo]

The ending was really good, but I was a bit disappointed with the last series, all that time travelling backwards and forwards was a bit confusing, I have no idea where he was with Walter White. Perhaps I waited too long to watch it after the previous series. Overall, a brilliant series that stands alone imo, and was at least as good as BB. Saul was one of the most interesting TV characters I've seen in a long time, as was Mike.

[Durzel]

The Walter White/Jesse stuff was fan service, I feel. The scene with Jesse and Kim you could argue was infromative to BB, in terms of having more info about how Jesse knew to recommend Saul. The other stuff, I felt, was purely "oh it's them again that's cool". The RV scenes basically added nothing.

I'm not sure I buy into the whole "BCS changes BB completely" argument. The comments about Lalo and Ignacio were throwaway, they're mentioned once in BB and never again, because - of course - they were just names at that point. Their significance was retconned by BCS.

What BCS was useful for as a whole was in showing what the catalyst was for Jimmy to become Saul, i.e. Kim leaving him. The show deserves a lot of credit for turning what was a 2 dimensional character in BB to someone with pathos in BCS, particularly stretching out the "when does he become Saul" question over so many seasons.

[lizardbrain]

I felt the scenes all had some meaning by the end. Eg The RV scenes acts out Saul’s final confession at the stand. Gunpoint but fear quickly swapped for enthusiasm.

The Jesse scene drives home he point that Kim’s divorce bookmarks Saul’s decline into drugs. Perhaps wouldn’t have got the gig without her.

Overall final episodes much better than el Camino but not as good as prior seasons but that’s a high bar to beat. And it’s harder to be subtle wrapping up the story.

[Evercross]

Durzel said:

The other stuff, I felt, was purely "oh it's them again that's cool".

The scene with WW while they waited to get their new identities and get transported out was absolutely key to explaining the difference between 'Breaking Bad' and 'Slippin' Jimmy' (which is what this show should have been called, but Better Call Saul clearly had the bigger commercial draw).

White completely changed in character because he was determined to support his family and provide for them in the way he could have had he not been conned out of his rightful share of his invention's commercial value.

Jimmy was just a greedy con-artist with a chip on his shoulder. For him it was "always about the money". It underlined how shallow Saul/Jimmy was compared to White.

[SpeckledJim]

Evercross said:

Durzel said:

The other stuff, I felt, was purely "oh it's them again that's cool".

The scene with WW while they waited to get their new identities and get transported out was absolutely key to explaining the difference between 'Breaking Bad' and 'Slippin' Jimmy' (which is what this show should have been called, but Better Call Saul clearly had the bigger commercial draw).

White completely changed in character because he was determined to support his family and provide for them in the way he could have had he not been conned out of his rightful share of his invention's commercial value.

Jimmy was just a greedy con-artist with a chip on his shoulder. For him it was "always about the money". It underlined how shallow Saul/Jimmy was compared to White.

Agreed. Walter White was a good man who 'broke bad'.

Jimmy McGill was never a good man in the first place. Always a grifter. Remember early in BSC when he was stealing watches in alleyways. There was a telling line in the last few episodes 'So, you were always like this."

[Durzel]

Evercross said:

Durzel said:

The other stuff, I felt, was purely "oh it's them again that's cool".

The scene with WW while they waited to get their new identities and get transported out was absolutely key to explaining the difference between 'Breaking Bad' and 'Slippin' Jimmy' (which is what this show should have been called, but Better Call Saul clearly had the bigger commercial draw).

White completely changed in character because he was determined to support his family and provide for them in the way he could have had he not been conned out of his rightful share of his invention's commercial value.

Jimmy was just a greedy con-artist with a chip on his shoulder. For him it was "always about the money". It underlined how shallow Saul/Jimmy was compared to White.

Good point about that scene, I forgot about it. The whole time machine thing with Saul's choices being centered around money rather than regrets was great characterisation.

[juggsy]

Durzel said:

I'm not sure I buy into the whole "BCS changes BB completely" argument. The comments about Lalo and Ignacio were throwaway, they're mentioned once in BB and never again, because - of course - they were just names at that point. Their significance was retconned by BCS.

If you’re referring to my comments, I never said “BCS changes BB completely”, just that an additional perspective is added, more specifically in the Saul scenes

[BobToc]

Yeah I agree juggsey. This was the article that piqued my interest:

https://www.nme.com/news/tv/better-call-saul-seaso...

I’ll need to go back and watch Breaking Bad again (great excuse!) but I’d be surprised if I found it quite as dramatic as the writer Peter Gould suggests in this article.

[smn159]

BobToc said:

Yeah I agree juggsey. This was the article that piqued my interest:

https://www.nme.com/news/tv/better-call-saul-seaso...

No issues with the actual (short) article, but that website is awful

[jimwilli]

basherX said:

Started watching the wire last night. Don’t know if it’s my dodgy aged hearing or just that I’m not attuned to the accents but some of the dialogue is seriously hard to hear. Mumble, mumble, mumble.

Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiìiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiittttttt

[BobToc]

jimwilli said:

basherX said:

Started watching the wire last night. Don’t know if it’s my dodgy aged hearing or just that I’m not attuned to the accents but some of the dialogue is seriously hard to hear. Mumble, mumble, mumble.

Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiìiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiittttttt

I watch everything with subtitles now. Do I need an ear clean in my forties?

[coppice]

I use subtitles all the time , and have done so for years. Originally it was to decipher muddy soundtracks , which my motorsport damaged hearing struggled with , but even with a crystal soundtrack you can miss a clever aside or a mumbled insult. We watch a lot of arty foreign films so subtitles are normal and familiar anyway.

But the real thing to note is that even if your hearing is perfect , you won't hear every word in music , whether rock, rap or country. Using subtitles is a revelation and although rap is not my thing , lyrically it can be astonishingly clever -and often very very funny. Try it !

[toon10]

SpeckledJim said:

Just finished BCS last night. I think it just edges BB as the best TV series I've even seen.

(Not seen The Wire. I know that's a popular choice as 'best ever'.)

Controversial but here goes...

The Wire is seen as top tier TV like Breaking Bad and the Sopranos. I tried to watch it and managed 30 minutes of the 1st episode and turned it off. The accents were awful and the acting was a bit standard American TV drama. Everyone told me I was wrong and I should revisit. I did and again, didn't finish the first episode. Compare that to Breaking Bad where I was absolutely hooked after 2 minutes. The cinematography, the intrigue and the way it just grabbed your attention.

I eventually went back and did watch all of the Wire. It was good and definitely something you need to stick with to enjoy. I wouldn't have it in my top ten TV shows but worth watching for sure.

[stemll]

toon10 said:

SpeckledJim said:

Just finished BCS last night. I think it just edges BB as the best TV series I've even seen.

(Not seen The Wire. I know that's a popular choice as 'best ever'.)

Controversial but here goes...

The Wire is seen as top tier TV like Breaking Bad and the Sopranos. I tried to watch it and managed 30 minutes of the 1st episode and turned it off. The accents were awful and the acting was a bit standard American TV drama. Everyone told me I was wrong and I should revisit. I did and again, didn't finish the first episode. Compare that to Breaking Bad where I was absolutely hooked after 2 minutes. The cinematography, the intrigue and the way it just grabbed your attention.

I eventually went back and did watch all of the Wire. It was good and definitely something you need to stick with to enjoy. I wouldn't have it in my top ten TV shows but worth watching for sure.

With you 100% on the Wire except I won't be going back.

[PBDirector]

I recall I had to force myself to stick to the wire for the first 4-5 episodes, but after that it was fantastic. It takes time to build the characters.