fred stripped of his knighthood
Discussion
Rather than start a separate thread. When I switched on R4 this morning on my way back from nursery, there was a chap being interviewed about this topic. I wondered to myself whether anyone had ever told him he sounded just like Jackie Stewart. It turns out it was Jackie Stewart, so why was he on?
Tiggsy said:
he was knighted in 2004...if Redgrave came back to rowing, post knighthood, and crashed his boat and sank would we have his back??
Rubbish. His achievements were real and on the record books. The true parallel would be if it were suddenly revealed that Sir Steve Redgrave had won all of his events using performance enhancing drugs. Then he would lose his knighthood and he would deserve to.Goodwin was never a banking or business genius. He was an amoral costcutting accountant who first got lucky and then got carried away with himself. Far from deserving an order of chivalry, he never had any concern for anyone but himself, certainly no concern for those whose jobs, pensions, savings and lives he 'shredded'. He was and is a sociopathic monster of Eichmann proportions and his rise and fall should be a lesson to us all about the risks of putting power in the hands of accountants.
Actually Goodwin is more comparable to Reinhard Heydrich, whom Hitler paid the compliment of saying 'he had a heart of stone'. That is why old establishment apparatchiks like George Mathewson loved him. He did their dirty work without a hint of conscience or remorse.
Edited by cardigankid on Wednesday 1st February 09:54
singlecoil said:
cardigankid said:
Britain suffers from a chronic backscratching crony culture which is absolutely not capitalism, obscene rewards for failure, bonusses for doing nothing, and undeserved honours, and this should be a first step in dealing with it. Whether the politicians actually have the moral fibre to do it remains to be seen. They still believe that casino banking generates wealth, whereas it is really just a fraud on the general population, and of course some of these bankers fund their party. It will go on, of course, but let's at least not pretend it isn't dishonesty.
Nice summary.
Bing o said:
singlecoil said:
cardigankid said:
Britain suffers from a chronic backscratching crony culture which is absolutely not capitalism, obscene rewards for failure, bonusses for doing nothing, and undeserved honours, and this should be a first step in dealing with it. Whether the politicians actually have the moral fibre to do it remains to be seen. They still believe that casino banking generates wealth, whereas it is really just a fraud on the general population, and of course some of these bankers fund their party. It will go on, of course, but let's at least not pretend it isn't dishonesty.
Nice summary.
cardigankid said:
Tiggsy said:
he was knighted in 2004...if Redgrave came back to rowing, post knighthood, and crashed his boat and sank would we have his back??
Rubbish. His achievements were real and on the record books. The true parallel would be if it were suddenly revealed that Sir Steve Redgrave had won all of his events using performance enhancing drugs. Then he would lose his knighthood and he would deserve to.Goodwin was never a banking or business genius. He was an amoral costcutting accountant who first got lucky and then got carried away with himself. Far from deserving an order of chivalry, he never had any concern for anyone but himself, certainly no concern for those whose jobs, pensions, savings and lives he 'shredded'. He was and is a sociopathic monster of Eichmann proportions and his rise and fall should be a lesson to us all about the risks of putting power in the hands of accountants.
He is a multi-multi-millionaire even though he messed up. That's the whole concept of rewards for failure.
His example should lead to a sea-change in the way employment/bonus contracts are drawn up, but that doesn't seem to be happening.
cardigankid said:
Rubbish. His achievements were real and on the record books. The true parallel would be if it were suddenly revealed that Sir Steve Redgrave had won all of his events using performance enhancing drugs. Then he would lose his knighthood and he would deserve to.
Exactly. And I would also expect that anyone who has received an award for services to science, industry etc, whose research or practises turned out to be flawed or fraudulent, would also be stripped of it.cardigankid said:
Goodwin was never a banking or business genius. He was an amoral costcutting accountant who first got lucky and then got carried away with himself. Far from deserving an order of chivalry, he never had any concern for anyone but himself, certainly no concern for those whose jobs, pensions, savings and lives he 'shredded'. He was and is a sociopathic monster of Eichmann proportions and his rise and fall should be a lesson to us all about the risks of putting power in the hands of accountants.
Actually Goodwin is more comparable to Reinhard Heydrich, whom Hitler paid the compliment of saying 'he had a heart of stone'. That is why old establishment apparatchiks like George Mathewson loved him. He did their dirty work without a hint of conscience or remorse.
True, although I do wonder if he is being made an example of because he was never a member of the establishment, maybe someone with a more conventional background would have been treated differently. It will be interesting to see if Stephen Hester is subsequently given a knighthood, in which case we can all speculate on exactly how much one costs. Actually Goodwin is more comparable to Reinhard Heydrich, whom Hitler paid the compliment of saying 'he had a heart of stone'. That is why old establishment apparatchiks like George Mathewson loved him. He did their dirty work without a hint of conscience or remorse.
rhinochopig said:
Rather than start a separate thread. When I switched on R4 this morning on my way back from nursery, there was a chap being interviewed about this topic. I wondered to myself whether anyone had ever told him he sounded just like Jackie Stewart. It turns out it was Jackie Stewart, so why was he on?
He's Fred's mate......Reference Sir JYS,let's not forget that when RBS blew up, he wanted to enforce the contract which Fred had given him. His comment was that he was contractually entitled to some very substantial payments, but that he would 'open his contact book' at no charge to assist RBS in future. Fortunately for him he has a more highly tuned sense of self preservation than Fred Goodwin and changed his mind. Otherwise we might be looking at his knighthood as well, which I don't personally grudge him in any way given his brilliant career which reflected so well on Britain, but some might given he is still, I believe, a tax exile!
To quote the Daily Mail 24th February 2009 -
"Motor racing legend Sir Jackie Stewart was last night criticised for refusing to give up his £4million role as a global ambassador for the beleaguered Royal Bank of Scotland. The former Formula One triple world champion is keen to cling on to his lucrative contract despite RBS being about to axe 30,000 jobs and announce losses of £28billion, the biggest in UK corporate history.
Sir Jackie came under fire as another RBS ambassador, British tennis ace Andy Murray, declared that he would take a pay cut to help out the institution that has supported his career since he was 13 years old.
But Sir Jackie, 69, dug his feet in, saying: 'I am sorry these people are losing their jobs, but I signed a contract and I have done my bit. I have two more years to run. I work all over the world for them. I am out there, creating business.'
Last night he said he would be tabling proposals for a new deal shortly but refused to confirm if he would accept a pay cut, adding: 'I definitely want to help the recovery of RBS and will be proposing a plan that is better for both the bank and for me.'
For years the multimillionaire has lived in Switzerland as a tax exile. Now the British taxpayer, who owns 68 per cent of the bank, is paying his huge fees.
Sir Jackie is among a coterie of sports stars, including the Queen's horse-riding granddaughter Zara Phillips, hired by former RBS chief executive Sir Fred Goodwin in a £200million sponsorship binge."
Maybe not the best person to wheel on in support of Freddie Krueger after all.
To quote the Daily Mail 24th February 2009 -
"Motor racing legend Sir Jackie Stewart was last night criticised for refusing to give up his £4million role as a global ambassador for the beleaguered Royal Bank of Scotland. The former Formula One triple world champion is keen to cling on to his lucrative contract despite RBS being about to axe 30,000 jobs and announce losses of £28billion, the biggest in UK corporate history.
Sir Jackie came under fire as another RBS ambassador, British tennis ace Andy Murray, declared that he would take a pay cut to help out the institution that has supported his career since he was 13 years old.
But Sir Jackie, 69, dug his feet in, saying: 'I am sorry these people are losing their jobs, but I signed a contract and I have done my bit. I have two more years to run. I work all over the world for them. I am out there, creating business.'
Last night he said he would be tabling proposals for a new deal shortly but refused to confirm if he would accept a pay cut, adding: 'I definitely want to help the recovery of RBS and will be proposing a plan that is better for both the bank and for me.'
For years the multimillionaire has lived in Switzerland as a tax exile. Now the British taxpayer, who owns 68 per cent of the bank, is paying his huge fees.
Sir Jackie is among a coterie of sports stars, including the Queen's horse-riding granddaughter Zara Phillips, hired by former RBS chief executive Sir Fred Goodwin in a £200million sponsorship binge."
Maybe not the best person to wheel on in support of Freddie Krueger after all.
Edited by cardigankid on Wednesday 1st February 11:49
t.Cheib said:
rhinochopig said:
Rather than start a separate thread. When I switched on R4 this morning on my way back from nursery, there was a chap being interviewed about this topic. I wondered to myself whether anyone had ever told him he sounded just like Jackie Stewart. It turns out it was Jackie Stewart, so why was he on?
He's Fred's mate......Norfolkit said:
Must admit I went off JYS a bit after reading his autobiography, seems to be a lot of name dropping towards the end
Towards the end? Half of the book was about his friends in high places. I'm not sure what it's about but he seems to measure his worth by the status of those he mixes with.He went down a long way in my estimation after I read that book.
JYS is a terrific bloke, please don't get me wrong, with a very driven professional approach to life. His achievements, unlike Fred's, are beyond any reproach or criticism. He is also a guy who both sympathises with those less fortunate than himself and will where he can do something to help, or as he would see it, help them to help themselves. He would show kindness where he had no pressing reason to do so, which I know personally, and I surmise that at some point in his life he knew what it was like to suffer.
He is very ambitious, no surprise there, but much more as a businessman than a racing driver. The namedropping in the book is from his perspective just a mark of where he considers he has got by his own efforts. His criticism of others, particularly his schoolteacher, comes over as petty, but that and the whole dyslexia schtick come from an expectation of perfection from himself. It can't be easy being Sir JYS. Financial success is however an absolute imperative and a matter of pride, and maybe on occasion he allows personal interest to affect his judgement. You just have to take it with a pinch of salt. He will have been paid an absolute fortune by or through Fred Goodwin and will regard it as a matter of professional duty to stand up in his defence. If you have hired Sir Jackie he will come in to bat for you. He always delivers.
If you want to read some better books by Jackie Stewart, try 'Faster' with Peter Manso, or Principles of Performance Motoring.
He is very ambitious, no surprise there, but much more as a businessman than a racing driver. The namedropping in the book is from his perspective just a mark of where he considers he has got by his own efforts. His criticism of others, particularly his schoolteacher, comes over as petty, but that and the whole dyslexia schtick come from an expectation of perfection from himself. It can't be easy being Sir JYS. Financial success is however an absolute imperative and a matter of pride, and maybe on occasion he allows personal interest to affect his judgement. You just have to take it with a pinch of salt. He will have been paid an absolute fortune by or through Fred Goodwin and will regard it as a matter of professional duty to stand up in his defence. If you have hired Sir Jackie he will come in to bat for you. He always delivers.
If you want to read some better books by Jackie Stewart, try 'Faster' with Peter Manso, or Principles of Performance Motoring.
Edited by cardigankid on Wednesday 1st February 14:11
AndrewW-G said:
As well as Archer, could we do the same for all the thieves who were caught fiddling their House of Lords expenses?
I present Baroness Uddin - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pola_Uddin,_Baroness_...He got his knighthood for a combination of massive risk taking and political expediency.
And he lost his knighthood for massive risk taking and political expediency.
Basically, he put all the money on red, and it came up red, got a knighthood, then put all his money on black, it came up red, lost his knighthood.
And he lost his knighthood for massive risk taking and political expediency.
Basically, he put all the money on red, and it came up red, got a knighthood, then put all his money on black, it came up red, lost his knighthood.
Chris Type R said:
AndrewW-G said:
As well as Archer, could we do the same for all the thieves who were caught fiddling their House of Lords expenses?
I present Baroness Uddin - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pola_Uddin,_Baroness_...Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff