Even the middle classes are beginning to feel the pinch
Discussion
Welshbeef said:
rouge59 said:
Welshbeef said:
Is wager (we have 4 overseas holidays a year) that they do a number of overseas holidays every year
Skiing £5k
May holiday £5k
August big 2 week holiday £12k
Oct Caribbean/canaries/Maldives/Africa £8k+
On top of lots of weekends doing things and doing things not being cheap. Heck a meal out and a rushed one at that will be not far off £120 before you start.
You'd be lucky to afford a week in a 2 star in Benidorm, you bulls
tting knobhead.
So this is £3,900 which is half board only so all drinks on top plus you need to pay for ski passes for all 4 which is £250per person comfortably plus hire of kit plus lessons plus airport parking. Skiing £5k
May holiday £5k
August big 2 week holiday £12k
Oct Caribbean/canaries/Maldives/Africa £8k+
On top of lots of weekends doing things and doing things not being cheap. Heck a meal out and a rushed one at that will be not far off £120 before you start.
You'd be lucky to afford a week in a 2 star in Benidorm, you bulls
tting knobhead.Pretty easy to get to £5k for skiing & this is not really trying hard at all.
Just what do you expect skiing to cost at half term week for a family of 4?
johnwilliams77 said:
What a great achievement (£800 on food PCM)
That's the point - previous poster was concerned we couldn't afford a 2 star Benidorm holiday yet food bill is above that cost so easily paid for 
. And if it's a Costco shop it's never less than £350 a pop which is always nice I'm sure you can do 2/3 star Benidorm hols for that.
Really? We are supposed to believe the market system we have rewards the most talented and hard working people. These guys are easily in the top 1%............ yet they are clearly too fking stupid to manage their finances. Even in London 190k is a generous salary. I'm willing to bet they have 50k Range Rovers on the drive and indulge in 10k holidays 2 or 3 times a year.
Why don't they do what 99% of people have do when they have kids - reduce their lifestyle to pay for the priorities, either spend less on luxuries or go out and earn more.
king stupid to manage their finances. Even in London 190k is a generous salary. I'm willing to bet they have 50k Range Rovers on the drive and indulge in 10k holidays 2 or 3 times a year.Why don't they do what 99% of people have do when they have kids - reduce their lifestyle to pay for the priorities, either spend less on luxuries or go out and earn more.
Edited by VolvoT5 on Saturday 21st November 08:27
ClaphamGT3 said:
For the four of us, we can just about get a ski trip down to £5k if we really work on doing it as cheaply as possible - usually a 'cheeky' second week if Easter is early and the snow is holding out. For the main ski trip, I would say £8k is about what a nice - but not lavish - family ski trip costs
Exactly. We're fortunate in that we have a ski chalet so it's purely flight and ski pass cost which makes it more viable to do skiing holidays/ multiple if we can.
I cannot wait until we do a 10-14 day Canada ski holiday now I can imagine that will be big bucks.
VolvoT5 said:
Really? We are supposed to believe the market system we have rewards the most talented and hard working people. These guys are easily in the top 1%............ yet they are clearly too fking stupid to manage their finances. Even in London 190k is a generous salary. I'm willing to get they have 50k Range Rovers on the drive and indulge in 10k holidays 2 or 3 times a year.
Why don't they do what 99% of people have do when they have kids - reduce their lifestyle to pay for the priorities, either spend less on luxuries or go out and earn more.
Indeed, apart from the usual PH nonsense that 190k is poverty level for London, this seems like a simple case of people being unable to live within their means.king stupid to manage their finances. Even in London 190k is a generous salary. I'm willing to get they have 50k Range Rovers on the drive and indulge in 10k holidays 2 or 3 times a year.Why don't they do what 99% of people have do when they have kids - reduce their lifestyle to pay for the priorities, either spend less on luxuries or go out and earn more.
WolfAir said:
If 190k a year is middle class, what does that make my 18k a year....with overtime?
It is location specific I would say that anywhere in London or its commuter belt if you didn't purchase your own home before say the early 2000s you would be looking at a gross household income approaching six figures to have anything like what would be considered a middle class lifestyle.
At the other end of the scale I once worked at a factory where there were 300 people on the shop floor, pay was good for the area but more importantly almost everyone was on the same wage.
The contrast between guys all taking home the same was remarkable, some owned their house, drove new cars, took holidays abroad and had well turned out kids whilst others never had anything to show for their efforts.
As I got to know people it became obvious that most of the "have nots" were just pouring their wages down the drain, latest TV, Sky full package, pub 3 nights a week, betting shop, fruit machines, thirsty car, takeaways etc.
No matter how much some folks make they never have anything left by the time the next payday comes around, look at those lottery winners that end up broke, some people just cannot manage money.
The contrast between guys all taking home the same was remarkable, some owned their house, drove new cars, took holidays abroad and had well turned out kids whilst others never had anything to show for their efforts.
As I got to know people it became obvious that most of the "have nots" were just pouring their wages down the drain, latest TV, Sky full package, pub 3 nights a week, betting shop, fruit machines, thirsty car, takeaways etc.
No matter how much some folks make they never have anything left by the time the next payday comes around, look at those lottery winners that end up broke, some people just cannot manage money.
Going back to OP.
These people are choosing not to sell their buy to let as they are banking on in 15+ years time it will be worth a huge amount more. Well if they'd the case if not be too fussed about building up borrowing elsewhere which is less than the property value growth IF prices drop flog it.
That said we would not send our kids to private school - wife is a teacher and even though we could do it she simply would refuse. We both went to state school so did our parents (well some went to Grammer school via scholarship). Provided you live in a good area with a good state school happy days.
These people are choosing not to sell their buy to let as they are banking on in 15+ years time it will be worth a huge amount more. Well if they'd the case if not be too fussed about building up borrowing elsewhere which is less than the property value growth IF prices drop flog it.
That said we would not send our kids to private school - wife is a teacher and even though we could do it she simply would refuse. We both went to state school so did our parents (well some went to Grammer school via scholarship). Provided you live in a good area with a good state school happy days.
At the other end of this scale , my cousin ( a professor designing optics for the James Webb Space Telescope ) , lives in London and defo middle-class , maybe upperclass going by the people she hangs with ( and the fact you can't understand what she says ha ! ) . She has far more brain-power than the OP link clowns combined + some and earns maybe 45k , seems happy , well she spends her time designing telescopes and kit that hunt earth like planets , awesome job and history changing stuff. Not all people chase money to spend on ste.
OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
te.OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
Edited by superkartracer on Saturday 21st November 09:40
superkartracer said:
At the other end of this scale , my cousin ( a professor designing optics for the James Webb Space Telescope ) , lives in London and defo middle-class , maybe upperclass going by the people she hangs with ( and the fact you can't understand what she says ha ! ) . She has far more brain-power than the OP link clowns combined + some and earns maybe 45k , seems happy , well she spends her time designing telescopes and kit that hunt earth like planets , awesome job and history changing stuff. Not all people chase money to spend on ste.
OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
That's quite amazing she managed A* on a levels years ago considering A* scoring for A levels was only introduced within the last few years.te.OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
Edited by superkartracer on Saturday 21st November 09:40
johnwilliams77 said:
superkartracer said:
At the other end of this scale , my cousin ( a professor designing optics for the James Webb Space Telescope ) , lives in London and defo middle-class , maybe upperclass going by the people she hangs with ( and the fact you can't understand what she says ha ! ) . She has far more brain-power than the OP link clowns combined + some and earns maybe 45k , seems happy , well she spends her time designing telescopes and kit that hunt earth like planets , awesome job and history changing stuff. Not all people chase money to spend on ste.
OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
That's quite amazing she managed A* on a levels years ago considering A* scoring for A levels was only introduced within the last few years.te.OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling . Thanks for the input on private schooling chaps , interesting stuff . ALL the farmers around here send their kids to private School , and guess what they end up doing! , farming ha ha .
Edited by superkartracer on Saturday 21st November 09:40
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Very valid point , Sam was a strange one , she was never interested in kids stuff , playing with toys etc , very focussed type and just wanted to read read read , most prob autistic as a few other family members are ( including my youngest son ) . Parents left her to it.Welshbeef said:
Exactly.
We're fortunate in that we have a ski chalet so it's purely flight and ski pass cost which makes it more viable to do skiing holidays/ multiple if we can.
I cannot wait until we do a 10-14 day Canada ski holiday now I can imagine that will be big bucks.
Do you put snow tyres on the Porsche 944? We're fortunate in that we have a ski chalet so it's purely flight and ski pass cost which makes it more viable to do skiing holidays/ multiple if we can.
I cannot wait until we do a 10-14 day Canada ski holiday now I can imagine that will be big bucks.
P
If their house is only worth £725K it must be in a pretty dodgy area so the schools are likely to be carp. Don't know if you're familiar with these matters but most state schools are rammed so you don't exactly get much choice.What many people appear to fail to appreciate is that, shockingly, it is possIble to live & work somewhere other than London.
I can't see the point of "slumming it" on a shoestring in a home that is worth almost 3x what our (5 bed semi) house is ...in a nice, leafy area with good state schools, including state grammar schools.i
The standard of living/quality of life elsewhere can be much, much better, even on a far lower income.
Sheepshanks said:
MC Bodge said:
Of course, your children could just go to a local state school....
If their house is only worth £725K it must be in a pretty dodgy area so the schools are likely to be carp. Don't know if you're familiar with these matters but most state schools are rammed so you don't exactly get much choice.
I can't see the point of "slumming it" on a shoestring in a home that is worth almost 3x what our (5 bed semi) house is ...in a nice, leafy area with good state schools, including state grammar schools.i
The standard of living/quality of life elsewhere can be much, much better, even on a far lower income.
ClaphamGT3 said:
Unless you happen to be mortgage free, there is no way that you can afford to put two children through school on £190k income.
I know someone paying two lots of day fees on considerably less (admittedly with a mortgage of only about £250k - the benefits of London equity). No flash holidays, six-year-old A4, but certainly not slumming it.superkartracer said:
OH , she went to a state school in Solihull , gained 4 A's ( A* A levels math/physics/chem etc) aged 14 and straight to Oxford , smart girl and again shows you don't need to spend money on private schooling .
All it shows is that very smart kids will probably do well regardless of schooling which is not really surprising. Also not surprising is if you pay up you get smaller class sizes and average kids get better than average results... that's the point.ClaphamGT3 said:
Alex said:
I sympathise with them, seriously. When you earn that sort of money, you expect to have a comfortable life and be able to afford luxuries like private schooling. As this thread shows, everyone else thinks you can. But the truth is, you can't.
It says their take-home is £10k a month, which means they are paying £70k a year in tax. THAT'S the real disgrace. Be smart, work hard, and we'll confiscate your earnings.
Would agree with this. Unless you happen to be mortgage free, there is no way that you can afford to put two children through school on £190k income.It says their take-home is £10k a month, which means they are paying £70k a year in tax. THAT'S the real disgrace. Be smart, work hard, and we'll confiscate your earnings.
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