CV19 - Cure worse than the disease? (Vol 9)

[markyb_lcy]

75Black said:

markyb_lcy said:

75Black said:

I'd be pissed off if I were a takeaway..or any food premises in Scotland for that matter. Spend thousands to make it "covid safe", wee Scottish dictator says it's still not enough, its all your fault for spreading the virus.

Just like pubs and restaurants in England. They really have drawn the short straw at every point.

Wouldn’t be quite so bad if the govt(s) could at least actually prove (evidence, anyone remember that?) shutting these places down makes a significant difference to hospitalisations and deaths. They can’t even do that.

It's not just that, but how is this: "Take-away services must operate from a serving hatch or doorway, no one can go inside a premise to collect food or drink" going to make any difference? Unless you're KFC/McD's etc with a drive thru, sure but what about the smaller Chinese/Indian etc.

It’s one-way, one-dimensional, short-term, overly-simplistic, evidence-lacking thinking.

Basically “what activities where people encounter other people can we ban that we haven’t banned already?”

[grumbledoak]

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Florida has no lockdown measures.

[Pupbelly]

isaldiri said:

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Human behaviour. Weather conditions affect that a lot but the virus still will transmit if there's enough sustained indoors contact whether in the tropics or temperate zones irrespective.

JagLover said:

There is a difference in seasonality in different climates.

Northern temperate has a predictable cycle peaking in December and January before falling away again in late Spring.

So on that basis Covid will be around in some form for ages, or forever just at varying degrees of severity. Which brings us full circle to that fact that as long as we are testing for Covid cases they will be found and therefore restrictions will be deemed valid.

[anonymous-user]

75Black said:

markyb_lcy said:

75Black said:

I'd be pissed off if I were a takeaway..or any food premises in Scotland for that matter. Spend thousands to make it "covid safe", wee Scottish dictator says it's still not enough, its all your fault for spreading the virus.

Just like pubs and restaurants in England. They really have drawn the short straw at every point.

Wouldn’t be quite so bad if the govt(s) could at least actually prove (evidence, anyone remember that?) shutting these places down makes a significant difference to hospitalisations and deaths. They can’t even do that.

It's not just that, but how is this: "Take-away services must operate from a serving hatch or doorway, no one can go inside a premise to collect food or drink" going to make any difference? Unless you're KFC/McD's etc with a drive thru, sure but what about the smaller Chinese/Indian etc.

The Chinese and Indian takeaways I use all have doors. I don't think they are the exceptions.

[Boringvolvodriver]

isaldiri said:

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Human behaviour. Weather conditions affect that a lot but the virus still will transmit if there's enough sustained indoors contact whether in the tropics or temperate zones irrespective.

Lot of older people in Florida?

[Pupbelly]

grumbledoak said:

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Florida has no lockdown measures.

Noted, but it was an example of a warm climate and more stable constant annual temperatures.

[deebs]

One of the things that has always surprised me is the government and their media shrills make little to no mention of the low adherence to self isolation off the back of a positive test.

The very people we don't want wandering about are those who have positive results. Figures regularly estimate that very few do self isolate for the time required. The govt very rarely appeal to those of us who have a positive case directly.

Perhaps that would cast a light where they don't want it, ie what are the underlying reasons people don't self isolate properly.

[ben5575]

320d is all you need said:

Because they don't. It's just control. Wearing people down. Making people realise that their normal lives are over.

The question is why.

It's really not about making people realise that their normal lives are over.

It's simply about trying to herd 68m cats to work together to minimise the spread of infection so that the vaccine can be rolled out whilst trying to be seen to do everything reasonably possible.

It's about modifying behaviours. If you want people to drive at 80mph, set the limit at 70mph, because if you set it at 80mph, everybody (or a large enough proportion of people) will do 90mph.

It's not about science or effectiveness.

Now whether that approach is right or wrong is a separate issue. Personally I'd like to know the actual facts and make a judgement accordingly, but then I quite like personally responsibility and freedom. Lots of people seemingly don't.

[Jordan210]

grumbledoak said:

Florida has no lockdown measures.

They did close up for a few months. Restaurants, leisure and so on (not sure on other businesses) then slowly reopen in stages. But now appears to be fully open again

[Blue62]

Pupbelly said:

isaldiri said:

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Human behaviour. Weather conditions affect that a lot but the virus still will transmit if there's enough sustained indoors contact whether in the tropics or temperate zones irrespective.

JagLover said:

There is a difference in seasonality in different climates.

Northern temperate has a predictable cycle peaking in December and January before falling away again in late Spring.

So on that basis Covid will be around in some form for ages, or forever just at varying degrees of severity. Which brings us full circle to that fact that as long as we are testing for Covid cases will be found and therefore restrictions will be deemed valid.

I think that’s unduly pessimistic. I posted earlier about new therapy trials, which seem to get as much attention on here as they do with the nhs! As with many killer viruses like TB and Aids, I think therapies will be a route out of this and quickly, fingers crossed.

[JagLover]

Pupbelly said:

So on that basis Covid will be around in some form for ages, or forever just at varying degrees of severity. Which brings us full circle to that fact that as long as we are testing for Covid cases they will be found and therefore restrictions will be deemed valid.

Very likely it will. I doubt it is going anywhere, but its impact on the population will fade due to vaccinations and prior infection. The most likely future for it is to become the fifth coronavirus and be bundled up with them in what we call the "common cold" .

Continued testing for it past this summer will just create "casedemics" when it has long ceased being a threat.

[Boringvolvodriver]

320d is all you need said:

markyb_lcy said:

75Black said:

I'd be pissed off if I were a takeaway..or any food premises in Scotland for that matter. Spend thousands to make it "covid safe", wee Scottish dictator says it's still not enough, its all your fault for spreading the virus.

Just like pubs and restaurants in England. They really have drawn the short straw at every point.

Wouldn’t be quite so bad if the govt(s) could at least actually prove (evidence, anyone remember that?) shutting these places down makes a significant difference to hospitalisations and deaths. They can’t even do that.

Because they don't. It's just control. Wearing people down. Making people realise that their normal lives are over.

The question is why.

The why is what I cannot get my head round either - I guess we will see what happens once cases start to go down and stay down once we have vaccinated the vulnerable.

I am hoping that we will start to see some steps back to normality and if we don’t, then I will start to question the motives and hope that others would as well -

[grumbledoak]

Jordan210 said:

They did close up for a few months. Restaurants, leisure and so on (not sure on other businesses) then slowly reopen in stages. But now appears to be fully open again

Florida reopened completely in September
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-...

Schools before that.

[Pupbelly]

Blue62 said:

Pupbelly said:

isaldiri said:

Pupbelly said:

There is a lot of talk that the virus will calm down as the weather warms up etc. which I kind of understand due to the Winter always being a cold & flu season, can someone explain why in places such as Florida where they always have high / warm temperatures their figures are running riot?

Human behaviour. Weather conditions affect that a lot but the virus still will transmit if there's enough sustained indoors contact whether in the tropics or temperate zones irrespective.

JagLover said:

There is a difference in seasonality in different climates.

Northern temperate has a predictable cycle peaking in December and January before falling away again in late Spring.

So on that basis Covid will be around in some form for ages, or forever just at varying degrees of severity. Which brings us full circle to that fact that as long as we are testing for Covid cases will be found and therefore restrictions will be deemed valid.

I think that’s unduly pessimistic. I posted earlier about new therapy trials, which seem to get as much attention on here as they do with the nhs! As with many killer viruses like TB and Aids, I think therapies will be a route out of this and quickly, fingers crossed.

I wish I shared your optimism, therapy trials will be a long way away before they can be implemented and by that time we are back to winter season and the merry go round begins again. Even with the vaccinations cases will still be found (yes, yes albeit those people will be less poorly) so the restrictions will continue until some logic is used or proper reporting i.e. deaths rather than cases to bring things back to a state of normal surely?

[KingNothing]

By my judging I should be dead by coronavirus 10 times over due to the amount of times I've spent going into takeaways to pick up my food orders over the course of this all, who knew being in a take away for 1 minute to pick up food you've already ordered was such an important area of coronavirus spreading that there's a need to legislate over it now 9 months later

Edited by KingNothing on Wednesday 13th January 13:41

[ant1973]

I saw this and for some reason a mental image of a banana on a bike appeared...



If everything goes as we have been prepped to believe it will, the new lockdown will be firmly in place when we all wake up on Thursday morning – meaning populations will be expected to ‘stay at home’ except for trips to the shops to buy food/ medication, visits to the doctor, and outdoor exercise (this includes the ability to walk dogs).

https://www.portugalresident.com/portugals-lockdow...

I personally blame the unwillingness of ex pats living in Portugal to follow the sterling example of those residing in the United Kingdom....

If only they would wear masks and adhere to the rules...

Edited by ant1973 on Wednesday 13th January 13:43

[Superdavros]

Steve vRS said:

Elysium said:

This is exactly the same with driving. We all think we are better drivers than everyone else.

And sex. We are all expert lovers.

All you need to know is that i'm fast....

[Jordan210]

grumbledoak said:

Florida reopened completely in September
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/25/us/florida-ron-...

Schools before that.

They had some odd rules at one point.Like you could not go in the a bar and get a drink to go. But you could get one from an outside bar.

Disney say they are only at 25% capacity. What is completely untrue when you see a image from over the weekend.

With Queues over 180min long for some rides it must be massively higher than that.

I wonder if their figure is based on the 2 water parks that are shut the the closed hotels. So 25% of whole property capacity not theme park attendance.

[Gadgetmac]

ben5575 said:

Personally I'd like to know the actual facts and make a judgement accordingly, but then I quite like personally responsibility and freedom. Lots of people seemingly don't.

That's all very well until your sense of personal responsibility and freedom threatens others lives. It also means different things to different people. Some use that as an argument for driving at high speed or wanting to own dangerous weapons. Not many people argue against laws and restrictions in place to set limits on those. Likewise entering a packed restaurant knowingly with covid is also rightly at the moment restricted. It's dangerous and should not be left to everyone's own sense of responsibility and freedom in my opinion.

[markyb_lcy]

Gadgetmac said:

That's all very well until your sense of personal responsibility and freedom threatens others lives.

What, like when you jump in a car? Or buy a diamond engagement ring for your wife to be. Or eat fresh fish caught at sea?