45th President Of The United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 14)
Discussion
h0b0 said:
I'm sure there is a space reserved on the 13th hole at Trump Bedminster golf course with Ivanna.
However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
The recordings were released by Mary Trump in 2020. She stepped down in 2018 after the NYT investigation of how the Trumps had a shell company funnelling money to Maryanne in the 70's and 80's. An investigation started but was moot when she resigned. The tapes came out later.However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
I doubt she was an innocent naive lamb in all of that.
hidetheelephants said:
h0b0 said:
I'm sure there is a space reserved on the 13th hole at Trump Bedminster golf course with Ivanna.
However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
We know this how if the investigation was never concluded? What could possibly motivate a judge to resign from a lifetime appointment, $250k a year and other trappings? Could it be she knew exactly how guilty she was, that the investigation would find her guilty of tax evasion and pulled the plug?However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
Crook said:
cgt2 said:
The corrupt Judge who resigned rather suddenly when facing an ethics investigation.
It's all pretty depressing really.Now consider whyTubberville is holding up military promotions, so trump can nominate his own lackeys. Same goes for Cruz, Hawley, Paul holding up ambassador appointments, etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025
h0b0 said:
I think you are trying to hard on the "because x.... Y must be true. I said there was no conclusion to the investigation. i.e. we do not have a result. What we do have is an investigation that was worth so little that when an 82 year old judge who had been inactive for 2 years stepped down there was no further action taken. If it was the smoking gun for Trump's downfall you want it to be then you would think they would proceed.
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
She gave up $250k a year for a nothing-burger! It's the way you tell them.Byker28i said:
If you think that's depressing, the plan for trumps revenge tour is call out in the open. Trump just can't stop boasting about it. Project 2025, to replace govt departments with trump lackeys.
Now consider whyTubberville is holding up military promotions, so trump can nominate his own lackeys. Same goes for Cruz, Hawley, Paul holding up ambassador appointments, etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025
I wonder if you’ll get shouted at for posting that? After all, Trump has got no chance, but you can keep dreaming. That’s the normal reply I get, rather than genuine concern about what he’s saying he will do if the idiot somehow gets re-elected. Now consider whyTubberville is holding up military promotions, so trump can nominate his own lackeys. Same goes for Cruz, Hawley, Paul holding up ambassador appointments, etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025
hidetheelephants said:
h0b0 said:
I think you are trying to hard on the "because x.... Y must be true. I said there was no conclusion to the investigation. i.e. we do not have a result. What we do have is an investigation that was worth so little that when an 82 year old judge who had been inactive for 2 years stepped down there was no further action taken. If it was the smoking gun for Trump's downfall you want it to be then you would think they would proceed.
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
She gave up $250k a year for a nothing-burger! It's the way you tell them.It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
In case there is any doubt, I hope Donald spends the rest of his life in prison. But, pitchfork wielding lunatics trying to circumvent the justice system are worse for society than Trump ever was, or will be. Sure, you can suggest the justice system is broken. I would counter that it has been damaged by people, like you, who think it is not required.
LF5335 said:
I wonder if you’ll get shouted at for posting that? After all, Trump has got no chance, but you can keep dreaming. That’s the normal reply I get, rather than genuine concern about what he’s saying he will do if the idiot somehow gets re-elected.
I get the sentiment behind this post. I think the point is Dems and Dem voters can't switch off, can't assume, can't do anything except get out and vote in record numbers again. Because even a little bit of apathy could have catastrophic consequences.
Given everything that's happening Trump has no chance. But if the Dems - to quote an Americanism - "take their foot off the gas" it could all go horribly wrong.
h0b0 said:
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
Not really; Trump Org has been found guilty, the trial is now about how much it owes.h0b0 said:
Unfortunately, you are just confirming what I said in that you have no idea what you are talking about. $250k is a lot of money for most of us. But, Maryanne had received a significant portion of Fred Trump's estate through inheritance and had also recently sold a house for $7M profit at the time she stepped down. $250k "plus trappings" wasn't going to pay her property tax bill.
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
In case there is any doubt, I hope Donald spends the rest of his life in prison. But, pitchfork wielding lunatics trying to circumvent the justice system are worse for society than Trump ever was, or will be. Sure, you can suggest the justice system is broken. I would counter that it has been damaged by people, like you, who think it is not required.
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
In case there is any doubt, I hope Donald spends the rest of his life in prison. But, pitchfork wielding lunatics trying to circumvent the justice system are worse for society than Trump ever was, or will be. Sure, you can suggest the justice system is broken. I would counter that it has been damaged by people, like you, who think it is not required.
Despite all that, you're essentially agreeing with what I typed; there was no investigation and no verdict. Have you ever considered a career as a barrister?Agreeing furiously with you doesn't make me frothing at the mouth, nor a lunatic, and I've never wielded a pitch fork; I'm baffled how posting on a forum constitutes an attack on the justice system. Casting aspersions about a dead woman isn't even libellous.
cgt2 said:
h0b0 said:
I'm sure there is a space reserved on the 13th hole at Trump Bedminster golf course with Ivanna.
However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
The recordings were released by Mary Trump in 2020. She stepped down in 2018 after the NYT investigation of how the Trumps had a shell company funnelling money to Maryanne in the 70's and 80's. An investigation started but was moot when she resigned. The tapes came out later.However, it is worth noting that Maryanne was appointed by democratic President Bill Clinton. Maryanne had also fallen out with her brother after saying his only accomplishments were 5 bankruptcies and that Trump has not principles and can't be trusted.
Her career was ended as a result of her association with Trump and not because she was corrupt. The investigation was never concluded after she stepped down.
I doubt she was an innocent naive lamb in all of that.
Edited by h0b0 on Monday 13th November 22:10
hidetheelephants said:
h0b0 said:
The frothing at the mouth shown on this thread wants to put aside legal process and get the pitch forks out. That makes you just as bad. There is also a clear lack of how the system works and posts repeatedly highlighting that. Just because Trump has tried to reduce his property tax liability while talking up his property value is not illegal. Every one in American knows that if you get your property taxes down your property value goes up. I myself have contested my property tax several times. What is on trial here is how it was done.
Not really; Trump Org has been found guilty, the trial is now about how much it owes.h0b0 said:
Unfortunately, you are just confirming what I said in that you have no idea what you are talking about. $250k is a lot of money for most of us. But, Maryanne had received a significant portion of Fred Trump's estate through inheritance and had also recently sold a house for $7M profit at the time she stepped down. $250k "plus trappings" wasn't going to pay her property tax bill.
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
In case there is any doubt, I hope Donald spends the rest of his life in prison. But, pitchfork wielding lunatics trying to circumvent the justice system are worse for society than Trump ever was, or will be. Sure, you can suggest the justice system is broken. I would counter that it has been damaged by people, like you, who think it is not required.
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
In case there is any doubt, I hope Donald spends the rest of his life in prison. But, pitchfork wielding lunatics trying to circumvent the justice system are worse for society than Trump ever was, or will be. Sure, you can suggest the justice system is broken. I would counter that it has been damaged by people, like you, who think it is not required.
Despite all that, you're essentially agreeing with what I typed; there was no investigation and no verdict. Have you ever considered a career as a barrister?Agreeing furiously with you doesn't make me frothing at the mouth, nor a lunatic, and I've never wielded a pitch fork; I'm baffled how posting on a forum constitutes an attack on the justice system. Casting aspersions about a dead woman isn't even libellous.
hidetheelephants said:
What could possibly motivate a judge to resign from a lifetime appointment
Seemed to suggest, or state, guilt. Which was somewhat backed up byhidetheelephants said:
she knew exactly how guilty she was
I responded with details of Maryanne having already stepped away from the role 2 years previously and was in a "non-active" status. The next source of my confusion was the subject of money. You mentioned a couple of times that $250k would be sufficient to act as a motive to continue the role. Here,
hidetheelephants said:
$250k a year and other trappings?
and here,hidetheelephants said:
She gave up $250k a year for a nothing-burger! :roflIf we are now saying you do not think there is any implied guilt based on an 82 year old woman saying she is no longer doing a job she had not been doing for 2 years, then yes, we agree.
h0b0 said:
Yes, I am not suggesting the recordings led to her stepping down as the time machine had not been invented at that point. I was suggesting Maryanne was not Donald's greatest fan. I am also not suggesting she was either guilty or innocent as we did not get the opportunity for her to appear in a trial. That;'s the sticking point with Welephant we agree there was no trial but he seems to think "Yeah, but we all know she did it" so going to head over to his posts.
Got it. Playing devil's advocate I think it's fairly safe to assume all of Fred Trump's offspring were a pretty dodgy bunch just in greater or lesser degrees Edited by h0b0 on Monday 13th November 22:10
cgt2 said:
h0b0 said:
Yes, I am not suggesting the recordings led to her stepping down as the time machine had not been invented at that point. I was suggesting Maryanne was not Donald's greatest fan. I am also not suggesting she was either guilty or innocent as we did not get the opportunity for her to appear in a trial. That;'s the sticking point with Welephant we agree there was no trial but he seems to think "Yeah, but we all know she did it" so going to head over to his posts.
Got it. Playing devil's advocate I think it's fairly safe to assume all of Fred Trump's offspring were a pretty dodgy bunch just in greater or lesser degrees Edited by h0b0 on Monday 13th November 22:10
h0b0 said:
Absolutely. Some of the stories of Trump destroying small businesses and impacting families are disgusting. What I want to see is him go down in a fair trial.
Which as I repeatedly say here and any lawyer knows takes time. The crux of any legal case has to be absolutely irrefutable evidence which is building and building. These are likely to be the most high profile cases in US legal history. There is absolutely no margin for error in the presentation of any of it.To just throw a hail Mary and say he should go to prison for eternity without a solid weight of evidence and witnesses is asking for disaster even if his defence lawyers are morons. Why take that risk?
The added benefit is that nearly every time he speaks he further incriminates himself.
h0b0 said:
If we are now saying you do not think there is any implied guilt based on an 82 year old woman saying she is no longer doing a job she had not been doing for 2 years, then yes, we agree.
That would be fine with a normal person, but there's poor evidence the Trump siblings were normal. Anecdotally Trump Snr indoctrinated his children to be venal and ruthless. We can hypothesise that there are no obvious innocent explanations for defenestrating herself from a role she had not been active in for 2 years just 10 days after an official investigation starts. We can hypothesise that an elderly former judge might take the view that the investigation itself would be upsettingly intrusive and decide to resign solely to stop it. These both bear scrutiny. The argument about her being extremely wealthy is viable but hardly conclusive. There are examples of very rich people being hoist on their own petard for trivial(to them) amounts of money; $60k to take one at random. No, we do not agree on that. I think it's possible and I'm at a loss why you don't.
h0b0 said:
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
It doesn't; it says only one thing, that she resigned and the investigation stopped. hidetheelephants said:
h0b0 said:
If we are now saying you do not think there is any implied guilt based on an 82 year old woman saying she is no longer doing a job she had not been doing for 2 years, then yes, we agree.
That would be fine with a normal person, but there's poor evidence the Trump siblings were normal. Anecdotally Trump Snr indoctrinated his children to be venal and ruthless. We can hypothesise that there are no obvious innocent explanations for defenestrating herself from a role she had not been active in for 2 years just 10 days after an official investigation starts. We can hypothesise that an elderly former judge might take the view that the investigation itself would be upsettingly intrusive and decide to resign solely to stop it. These both bear scrutiny. The argument about her being extremely wealthy is viable but hardly conclusive. There are examples of very rich people being hoist on their own petard for trivial(to them) amounts of money; $60k to take one at random. No, we do not agree on that. I think it's possible and I'm at a loss why you don't.
h0b0 said:
It was the way the tax was paid on the inheritance, by all beneficiaries including Donald, that was called into question. We do not know the status of her, or importantly, Donald's guilt. But, if Maryanne was found guilty, it would also mean Donald would be found guilty but they decided not to pursue. I think that says a lot.
It doesn't; it says only one thing, that she resigned and the investigation stopped. This is Punchy - the WH response to trumps Veterans day rhetoric
From White House deputy press secretary Andrew Bates: "The nation just observed Veterans Day, recognizing the sacred memory of every American who risked their lives to defend our freedom. Veterans who are absolutely not 'suckers' or 'losers;' but who, as President Biden has said, deserve our greatest respect.
He went on to describe trumps plans to suspend the constitution as an abuse of power would put the rights of all Americans in unprecedented danger.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/13/bi...
Axios points out team trump are already screening people to be ready to take over almost immediately if trump wins
The massive headhunting quest aims to recruit 20,000 people to serve in the next trump administration, 4,000 presidential appointments and potential replacements for as many as 50,000 federal workers who are "policy-adjacent."
https://www.axios.com/2023/11/13/trump-loyalists-2...
It's all out in the open, trump plans his dictatorship, hence the constant promoting of Orban., Xi and Putin He wants complate power to do anything he likes, drop/block investigations and charges again, retribution against his enemies, all backed by a host of lackeys again in govt departments and the military.
US Press are just waking up to this
From White House deputy press secretary Andrew Bates: "The nation just observed Veterans Day, recognizing the sacred memory of every American who risked their lives to defend our freedom. Veterans who are absolutely not 'suckers' or 'losers;' but who, as President Biden has said, deserve our greatest respect.
He went on to describe trumps plans to suspend the constitution as an abuse of power would put the rights of all Americans in unprecedented danger.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/13/bi...
Axios points out team trump are already screening people to be ready to take over almost immediately if trump wins
The massive headhunting quest aims to recruit 20,000 people to serve in the next trump administration, 4,000 presidential appointments and potential replacements for as many as 50,000 federal workers who are "policy-adjacent."
https://www.axios.com/2023/11/13/trump-loyalists-2...
It's all out in the open, trump plans his dictatorship, hence the constant promoting of Orban., Xi and Putin He wants complate power to do anything he likes, drop/block investigations and charges again, retribution against his enemies, all backed by a host of lackeys again in govt departments and the military.
US Press are just waking up to this
Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 14th November 06:28
trumps ex lawyers proffer videos are out. ABC News are releasing clips
Here's Powell, singing like a canary. Many people told trump he lost
https://twitter.com/i/status/1724229409488457956
Ellis is here. Says Ellis says she was told trump wasn't going to leave the WH on 19 Dec which was when trump sent his 'be there will be wild' tweet
https://abc7chicago.com/jenna-ellis-sydney-powell-...
Scavino, trumps former golf caddy made deputy chief of staff, could be in trouble and facing a subpoena at least after Jenna Ellis testified that Scaino told her "The boss is not going to leave under any circumstances.,We are just going to stay in power.”
Here's Powell, singing like a canary. Many people told trump he lost
https://twitter.com/i/status/1724229409488457956
Ellis is here. Says Ellis says she was told trump wasn't going to leave the WH on 19 Dec which was when trump sent his 'be there will be wild' tweet
https://abc7chicago.com/jenna-ellis-sydney-powell-...
Scavino, trumps former golf caddy made deputy chief of staff, could be in trouble and facing a subpoena at least after Jenna Ellis testified that Scaino told her "The boss is not going to leave under any circumstances.,We are just going to stay in power.”
Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 14th November 07:23
Another boon, Jonathan Karl's "Tired of Winning" claims that trump ripped up a note about his intention to fire army leaders if they made any statements about not backing his call for election fraud, this after Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy and Army Chief of Staff James McConville issued a statement affirming the military would play no role in determining the outcome of a U.S. election
The National Archives apparently have the note and stuck it back together and it's reproduced in the book. Claims it shows trump intent then to use the military to back his actions, hence installing Kash Patel
Interesting when you remember he was calling for 10,000 National guard on his insurrection attempt, so he could be protected and lead the mob to the Capitol
The National Archives apparently have the note and stuck it back together and it's reproduced in the book. Claims it shows trump intent then to use the military to back his actions, hence installing Kash Patel
Interesting when you remember he was calling for 10,000 National guard on his insurrection attempt, so he could be protected and lead the mob to the Capitol
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