How do we think EU negotiations will go?
Discussion
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
Barnier just talks a lot, he's part of the negotiation problem, not solutions. The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
Negotiations are negotiations, it's all very childish and getting no one nowhere.
Surely it's in everyone's best interests to put this to bed (if it truly ever will be)
hyphen said:
To change the subject from boring practicalities such as the NI Border, a question.
In the event of a hard Brexit, do you think the UK could setup its own EU-lite? Steal some members from the EU.
It would need countries to leave the EU first for us to be able to do anything outside any EU FTA we negotiate. We cant steal anyone, they have to chose to leave. That looks unlikely.In the event of a hard Brexit, do you think the UK could setup its own EU-lite? Steal some members from the EU.
If the EU implodes then there would be an opportunity to set up a trading body, but after the experience of the EU it would have to be very limited on what it did and had no political union ambition.
digimeistter said:
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
He represents an EU member state who has to abide by their regulations, ergo they should advise.The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
How can anyone resolve it when they flatly refuse to talk about trade until we pay a ransom? Until we get down to the nitty gritty, we can't resolve the Irish issue.
Edited by digimeistter on Monday 20th November 15:58
A FTA would still require a border so there are no solutions.
Perhaps a better comprise would be for the UK to learn the rules then offer an acceptable solution.
Mrr T said:
digimeistter said:
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
He represents an EU member state who has to abide by their regulations, ergo they should advise.The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
How can anyone resolve it when they flatly refuse to talk about trade until we pay a ransom? Until we get down to the nitty gritty, we can't resolve the Irish issue.
Edited by digimeistter on Monday 20th November 15:58
A FTA would still require a border so there are no solutions.
Perhaps a better comprise would be for the UK to learn the rules then offer an acceptable solution.
jsf said:
Mrr T said:
digimeistter said:
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
He represents an EU member state who has to abide by their regulations, ergo they should advise.The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
How can anyone resolve it when they flatly refuse to talk about trade until we pay a ransom? Until we get down to the nitty gritty, we can't resolve the Irish issue.
Edited by digimeistter on Monday 20th November 15:58
A FTA would still require a border so there are no solutions.
Perhaps a better comprise would be for the UK to learn the rules then offer an acceptable solution.
digimeistter said:
On Barnier, I love the way he spent more time on the Irish issue than anything else
...
You can bet your bottom dollar if it was any other Country with a direct European land border wanting to leave, The EU would be dictating a hard border on their terms.
It doesn't quite fit the Brexit narrative that the EU are not demanding the sovereign nation of Ireland to act in a certain way, and are putting the ongoing interests of a member state as a higher priority in negotiations than signing a trade deal with a soon to be ex-member....
You can bet your bottom dollar if it was any other Country with a direct European land border wanting to leave, The EU would be dictating a hard border on their terms.
Mrr T said:
jsf said:
Mrr T said:
digimeistter said:
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
He represents an EU member state who has to abide by their regulations, ergo they should advise.The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
How can anyone resolve it when they flatly refuse to talk about trade until we pay a ransom? Until we get down to the nitty gritty, we can't resolve the Irish issue.
Edited by digimeistter on Monday 20th November 15:58
A FTA would still require a border so there are no solutions.
Perhaps a better comprise would be for the UK to learn the rules then offer an acceptable solution.
mx5nut said:
It doesn't quite fit the Brexit narrative that the EU are not demanding the sovereign nation of Ireland to act in a certain way, and are putting the ongoing interests of a member state as a higher priority in negotiations than signing a trade deal with a soon to be ex-member.
Well that makes no sense at all, talk trade, then and only then will we be able to ascertain border implications, so the EU need to tell us, forget the Sovereign state crap, no Country in the EU is a sovereign nation anymore - do you have trouble reading? digimeistter said:
mx5nut said:
It doesn't quite fit the Brexit narrative that the EU are not demanding the sovereign nation of Ireland to act in a certain way, and are putting the ongoing interests of a member state as a higher priority in negotiations than signing a trade deal with a soon to be ex-member.
Well that makes no sense at all, talk trade, then and only then will we be able to ascertain border implications, so the EU need to tell us, forget the Sovereign state crap, no Country in the EU is a sovereign nation anymore - do you have trouble reading? 
Interesting piece on Order-Order with regards to passporting, essentially saying it's not seen as a priority outside of Remain reporters like the Independent and Standard:
https://order-order.com/2017/11/20/city-moved-on-p...
https://order-order.com/2017/11/20/city-moved-on-p...
Guido said:
the International Regulatory Strategy Group, which is co-sponsored by TheCityUK and The City of London Corporation, published a report on “Alternatives to Passporting” and concluded “the focus of the Brexit negotiations should be on designing and delivering a bespoke UK-EU deal rather than reforming or adapting existing frameworks“
paul789 said:
Jimboka said:
After the financial crisis, we printed 300 billion plus to bail out the banking system didn’t we?
If this is correct, why not print off say 100 billion to grease the EU deal?
Surely Brexit is a far bigger ‘problem’ than faced before, so small change !
Simple. End of.If this is correct, why not print off say 100 billion to grease the EU deal?
Surely Brexit is a far bigger ‘problem’ than faced before, so small change !
Mrr T said:
He may be spending time on the Irish border because it matters to Eire. It also matters for N Ireland but he is not there to represent the UK.
The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
Except it was never a real offer - if the border was placed at the NI ports both sides would be under UK control and could be as porous as we desired. We could have turned NI into a free trade zone bridging the EU and UK, which would have been rather good for NI and the Republic but probably not the EU intention.The EU has offered a solution, that NI remains in the SM and CU and the hard border is at the sea. This is not acceptable to the UK.
If the UK will not accept that solution there is no acceptable solutions.
The UK wants to leave the EU and the SM and CU, but not have a hard border for goods in Ireland. This is not possible. So Barnier has suggested the UK should solve the problem since we are creating it.
digimeistter said:
paul789 said:
Jimboka said:
After the financial crisis, we printed 300 billion plus to bail out the banking system didn’t we?
If this is correct, why not print off say 100 billion to grease the EU deal?
Surely Brexit is a far bigger ‘problem’ than faced before, so small change !
Simple. End of.If this is correct, why not print off say 100 billion to grease the EU deal?
Surely Brexit is a far bigger ‘problem’ than faced before, so small change !
Tuna said:
Interesting piece on Order-Order with regards to passporting, essentially saying it's not seen as a priority outside of Remain reporters like the Independent and Standard:
https://order-order.com/2017/11/20/city-moved-on-p...
Indeed. Hence my mention earlier of 'enhanced equivalence' as an option. https://order-order.com/2017/11/20/city-moved-on-p...
Guido said:
the International Regulatory Strategy Group, which is co-sponsored by TheCityUK and The City of London Corporation, published a report on “Alternatives to Passporting” and concluded “the focus of the Brexit negotiations should be on designing and delivering a bespoke UK-EU deal rather than reforming or adapting existing frameworks“
For all of MrrrT's assertions that everyone will have their euro subsidiaries setup and ready to go in a year's time (or even three years), it's just not feasible.
Ignoring the challenges of capitalising those new organisations to meet the regs without impacting the barely held capital requirements we put in place post 08 (and opened the printing presses for) - just look at RBS. Required to divest it's English business neatly a decade ago, and still nowhere near actually achieving it...
jsf said:
hyphen said:
To change the subject from boring practicalities such as the NI Border, a question.
In the event of a hard Brexit, do you think the UK could setup its own EU-lite? Steal some members from the EU.
It would need countries to leave the EU first for us to be able to do anything outside any EU FTA we negotiate. We cant steal anyone, they have to chose to leave. That looks unlikely.In the event of a hard Brexit, do you think the UK could setup its own EU-lite? Steal some members from the EU.
If the EU implodes then there would be an opportunity to set up a trading body, but after the experience of the EU it would have to be very limited on what it did and had no political union ambition.
digimeistter said:
mx5nut said:
It doesn't quite fit the Brexit narrative that the EU are not demanding the sovereign nation of Ireland to act in a certain way, and are putting the ongoing interests of a member state as a higher priority in negotiations than signing a trade deal with a soon to be ex-member.
Well that makes no sense at all, talk trade, then and only then will we be able to ascertain border implications, so the EU need to tell us, forget the Sovereign state crap, no Country in the EU is a sovereign nation anymore - do you have trouble reading? Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff