Discussion
Lots of people upset at how Uber operates, how much tax they pay, what sort of contracts their employees have, and suchlike.
Very little of which is of any concern whatsoever to the man in the street, who just wants to get from A to B in as convenient and 'modern' fashion as possible.
Even if you hate Uber, you should be thankful for them as they have given Black Cabs and private hire the absolutely massive kick up the arse they desperately needed for years, and that's got to be good for everyone.
Very little of which is of any concern whatsoever to the man in the street, who just wants to get from A to B in as convenient and 'modern' fashion as possible.
Even if you hate Uber, you should be thankful for them as they have given Black Cabs and private hire the absolutely massive kick up the arse they desperately needed for years, and that's got to be good for everyone.
The All Parliamentary Group on Responsible Tax recently released a report "Building a fairer system: Tax and the UK's gig economy"
https://www.appgresponsibletax.org.uk/wp-content/u...
As well as giving a very basic overview of some of the ways in which it claims the UK is missing out on some tax revenues, it does specifically mention Uber & VAT
As mentioned in the report Maugham (the QC so vigorously pursuing Uber re VAT), was a member of the panel giving evidence to the Group in the session on which this report is partly based
https://www.appgresponsibletax.org.uk/wp-content/u...
As well as giving a very basic overview of some of the ways in which it claims the UK is missing out on some tax revenues, it does specifically mention Uber & VAT
As mentioned in the report Maugham (the QC so vigorously pursuing Uber re VAT), was a member of the panel giving evidence to the Group in the session on which this report is partly based
Yes, but the beginning of the end of the 'speculation' phase is drawing near now
The initial encounter of Maugham's case with the FTT (Tax) is on 11 July...
I think it will be possible to judge from that if this is a dead horse, or one that might do something exciting with just the gentlest flogging
The initial encounter of Maugham's case with the FTT (Tax) is on 11 July...
I think it will be possible to judge from that if this is a dead horse, or one that might do something exciting with just the gentlest flogging
The expected day at the Tribunal (today) is cancelled
As Maugham tweets in a series of tweets this morning
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/10169143...
The Zipvit case Court of Appeal Judgment is here (https://www.pumptax.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/Zipvit-v-HMRC-final-approved-29-6-18.pdf)
Para 1. shows why the case is relelvant
I am no expert in such matters, but I simply see this as a way of further delaying the point in time at which a court (now looking to be the HC) considers the question: Should Uber fares have been subject to VAT?
To have that question answered is Maugham's intent.
IMO Uber is clearly (and rightly from it's perspective) working hard to delay / avoid that question being considered. The use of a case such as Zipvit to achieve that is no surprise
As Maugham tweets in a series of tweets this morning
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/10169143...
The Zipvit case Court of Appeal Judgment is here (https://www.pumptax.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/Zipvit-v-HMRC-final-approved-29-6-18.pdf)
Para 1. shows why the case is relelvant
I am no expert in such matters, but I simply see this as a way of further delaying the point in time at which a court (now looking to be the HC) considers the question: Should Uber fares have been subject to VAT?
To have that question answered is Maugham's intent.
IMO Uber is clearly (and rightly from it's perspective) working hard to delay / avoid that question being considered. The use of a case such as Zipvit to achieve that is no surprise
Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 11th July 08:03
Uber is in court today appealing the employment tribunal finding that drivers should be treated as workers
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46018104
Ewan McGaughery is tweeting (his bias is obvious, but that aside) as it unfolds
https://twitter.com/ewanmcg/status/105722574728114...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46018104
Ewan McGaughery is tweeting (his bias is obvious, but that aside) as it unfolds
https://twitter.com/ewanmcg/status/105722574728114...
Uber loses appeal against a ruling that its drivers should be treated as workers rather than self employed
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46617584
Judgment here https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/1...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46617584
Judgment here https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/1...
There is a hearing scheduled for early Feb
It seems it will mostly focus on the matter of a protective costs order for Maugham / GLP
https://twitter.com/jolyonmaugham/status/108482084...
It seems it will mostly focus on the matter of a protective costs order for Maugham / GLP
https://twitter.com/jolyonmaugham/status/108482084...
Good Law Project's application for a protective costs order against Uber is being heard this very morning
Uber is, as one would expect, resisting
Links to skeleton arguments of both sides included in the tweet below
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/10930879...
Uber is, as one would expect, resisting
Links to skeleton arguments of both sides included in the tweet below
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/10930879...
The application for a protective costs order has been dismissed
Good law project has to pay Uber > £100k in costs
An appeal is mentioned and potential new proceedings against HMRC
https://goodlawproject.org/uber-protective-costs-a...
Good law project has to pay Uber > £100k in costs
An appeal is mentioned and potential new proceedings against HMRC
https://goodlawproject.org/uber-protective-costs-a...
The next step in GLP's Uber VAT mission
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11033466...
This bit looks as though it might be interesting
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11033488...
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11033466...
This bit looks as though it might be interesting
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11033488...
Yes, there has been a disappointing delay / absence of news. But here is another update
A piece in the Sunday times suggesting HMRC has been looking and that the good law project is about to sue HMRC for ‘failing to act in relation to uber’s Tax dodging’
|https://thumbsnap.com/rwHfMCXk[/url]
https://twitter.com/goodlawproject/status/11300309...
[url]
A piece in the Sunday times suggesting HMRC has been looking and that the good law project is about to sue HMRC for ‘failing to act in relation to uber’s Tax dodging’
|https://thumbsnap.com/rwHfMCXk[/url]https://twitter.com/goodlawproject/status/11300309...
[url]Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 19th May 14:43
Later than it was signposted to be, but proceedings have been issued today apparently
https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/113376773...
The documents are here
https://goodlawproject.org/good-law-project-sues-h...
https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/113376773...
The documents are here
https://goodlawproject.org/good-law-project-sues-h...
HMRC has applied for a “swingeing” confidentiality order to protect basic details of the judicial review from disclosure
https://twitter.com/goodlawproject/status/11441262...
https://twitter.com/goodlawproject/status/11441262...
A bit of movement
A hearing on issues associated with the case on 6 Nov but there is this little section in the most recently filed accounts
The FT (https://ftalphaville.ft.com/2019/10/09/1570629132000/Uber-s-UK-VAT-liability-confirmed/) or google "ubers uk vat liability confirmed" if you are not an FT subscriber suggests
'The most newsworthy part was arguably this one: “the Uber Group is involved in an ongoing dialog with HMRC, which is seeking to classify the Uber Group as a transportation provider. Being classified as a transportation provider would result in a VAT (20%) on Gross Bookings or on the service fee that the Company charges Drivers, both retroactively and prospectively."
...
Of course, the fact that Uber London since filed a company account noting that a dialogue with HMRC over a VAT liability is ongoing implies some sort of protective assessment may already have been initiated. So to some extent the cat is already out of the bag.'
A hearing on issues associated with the case on 6 Nov but there is this little section in the most recently filed accounts
The FT (https://ftalphaville.ft.com/2019/10/09/1570629132000/Uber-s-UK-VAT-liability-confirmed/) or google "ubers uk vat liability confirmed" if you are not an FT subscriber suggests
'The most newsworthy part was arguably this one: “the Uber Group is involved in an ongoing dialog with HMRC, which is seeking to classify the Uber Group as a transportation provider. Being classified as a transportation provider would result in a VAT (20%) on Gross Bookings or on the service fee that the Company charges Drivers, both retroactively and prospectively."
...
Of course, the fact that Uber London since filed a company account noting that a dialogue with HMRC over a VAT liability is ongoing implies some sort of protective assessment may already have been initiated. So to some extent the cat is already out of the bag.'
It doesn't really tell you a lot. The last VAT ding dong I was involved with (with about £1m at stake) took 18 months from asking HMRC for clearance to them giving 'an opinion' (adverse to us). By the time I left the company they still hadn't issued an assessment so nothing was particularly formal by that time. Our accounts included a liability line for the disputed amounts and HMRC had given an initial opinion, but nothing more had happened.
The case about the cofidentiality level applied to the broader hearing is today
Just one update - with a bit of a leading comment - on it from Maugham so far
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11920746...
Just one update - with a bit of a leading comment - on it from Maugham so far
https://twitter.com/GoodLawProject/status/11920746...
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