80 years ago today - Britain Declares War on Germany

[RedWhiteMonkey]

Ayahuasca said:

When did we stop saying ‘war on Germany’ and start saying ‘war on the nazis’?

Have we?

[aeropilot]

Ayahuasca said:

When did we stop saying ‘war on Germany’ and start saying ‘war on the nazis’?

Not sure we ever did.

Both terms were used at the time, and ever since.

[Eric Mc]

aeropilot said:

Largely as a result of Allied stategic bombing hindering production, plus a certain person then insisting it be turned into a bomber.

Again, a story that is only partially true. Apparently, it wasn't Hitler's suggestion but an idea raised by Willie Messerschmitt himself - to try and encourage the RLM (the German Air Ministry) to place a production order. Messerschmitt was very adept at pandering to what he thought would go down well with Herr Hitler. Other aircraft manufacturers, such as Ernst Heinkel, were less astute.

[vonuber]

Ayahuasca said:

When did we stop saying ‘war on Germany’ and start saying ‘war on the nazis’?

The Austrians, italians, Hungarians and Romanians always get left out.

[aeropilot]

vonuber said:

Ayahuasca said:

When did we stop saying ‘war on Germany’ and start saying ‘war on the nazis’?

The Austrians, italians, Hungarians and Romanians always get left out.

Although they never actually signed up to the Treaty, you could lump the Finns into that pile as well, until they swapped sides like the Italians.

[anonymous-user]

RedWhiteMonkey said:

Ayahuasca said:

When did we stop saying ‘war on Germany’ and start saying ‘war on the nazis’?

Have we?

I think it was in the last 10 years or so. You used to always hear about fighting the Germans etc but now it’s all about the Nazis. I think it’s about modern Germans not getting the blame?

Probably for another thread though.

[Eric Mc]

Not to mention Slovaks, Estonians, Latvians, Croations, Ukranians, Dutch, Belgian, French, Danes etc some or all of whom fought alongside Germany at different times during the war.

[vonuber]

And a few brits.

[Eric Mc]

You would get a few individuals who might be enticed to join up with the Germans - but quite a few European countries threw in their lot with the Nazi regime of Germany - mostly to further their own political and territorial agendas. I was listing those countries that allied themselves formally with Germany for some or all of the period 1939 to 1945 and also those occupied countries where there was sufficient internal support for extreme Nazi type views that recruiting combatants was not that hard. Indeed, there were entire military units in the Wermacht and even the SS made up of non-Germans.

The Germans did try to recruit from the Prisoner of War camps. They had high hopes of being able to persuade Irish prisoners of war (guys that had been serving with the British Army, RAF and Royal Navy) as they thought that Irishmen might be persuaded to join up to fight the "old enemy". They were pretty unsuccessful on that score.

[theplayingmantis]

Eric Mc said:

Not to mention Slovaks, Estonians, Latvians, Croations, Ukranians, Dutch, Belgian, French, Danes etc some or all of whom fought alongside Germany at different times during the war.

british, indians, americans etc too. probably examples form every nation who fought on both sides...

Edited by theplayingmantis on Thursday 5th September 18:13

[theplayingmantis]

vonuber said:

The Austrians, italians, Hungarians and Romanians always get left out.

Didn't Austria cease to be as a nation state officially after Anschluss (spelling?)? it just became another province of Greater Germany, despite never being part of a united Germany before due to its historic rivalry with Prussia and competition for primacy.

[Eric Mc]

theplayingmantis said:

british, indians, americans etc too. probably examples form every nation who thought on both sides...

Or perhaps, "didn't think"?

You need to differentiate between random individuals and those countries that formally allied themselves with Germany. There is a big difference.

[vonuber]

Estonia / latvia etc are slight exceptions though, putting them in a similar camp to the finns.

The Estonian troops are still honoured to this day- if you ever go to Tallinn, try and find tbe soviet war memorial in the centre of the city..

[Eric Mc]

Yes - those baltic nations were prepared to embrace Germany as an ally as they had a far greater fear (with plenty of justification) of Stalin's Soviet Union.
However, especially in the case of the Estonians and Latvians, they seemed to become very enthusiastic in carrying out Nazi policies regarding races and religions.

[Ayahuasca]

Interesting that only a few years after the horrendous slaughter and suffering of the Great War, the British people, far from being shattered, cowed or pacified by that experience, were prepared to do it all over again, and were prepared to stand up to the Germans when every other nation in Europe was either defeated or neutral.

[DoubleD]

Im sure I read that WW2 was a more deadly conflict than WW1, is that because it involved more nations?

[JagLover]

DoubleD said:

Im sure I read that WW2 was a more deadly conflict than WW1, is that because it involved more nations?

Mainly due to the mass slaughter of civilians and POWs unfortunately.

[Zirconia]

Ayahuasca said:

Interesting that only a few years after the horrendous slaughter and suffering of the Great War, the British people, far from being shattered, cowed or pacified by that experience, were prepared to do it all over again, and were prepared to stand up to the Germans when every other nation in Europe was either defeated or neutral.

Probably owe that to Churchill, Halifax wanted to get around the peace table.

[theplayingmantis]

Eric Mc said:

theplayingmantis said:

british, indians, americans etc too. probably examples form every nation who fought on both sides...

Or perhaps, "didn't think"?

You need to differentiate between random individuals and those countries that formally allied themselves with Germany. There is a big difference.

were those countries you list all formally allied with Germany (i mean the list containing Netherlands etc)?

Also not sure why your changing my grammar to make out im an idiot! Some of us have to type surreptitiously and quickly...my op clearly spelt correctly





























































....now

[theplayingmantis]

Zirconia said:

Eric Mc said:

Was it Prien?

Yep
https://www.uboat.net/men/prien.htm

Edit. Keeping with the topic. You can set the date on this search.
https://www.uboat.net/boats/patrols/search.php
Says 43 U Boats on patrol this day.

Edited by Zirconia on Thursday 5th September 09:21

i don't understand the function of the blockships if they could be circumnavigated. wer they simply intended to make life awkward or to be impenetrable? how did they impact surface ship navigation? were they of a depth that surface ships could pass over but a submerged u boat not? (at least intended). or were they meant to block any traffic. if the former then a u-boat on the surface could get over them (assume there were shore defenses too though to watch for such things?