Rishi Sunak - Prime Minister

[abzmike]

So this national service will be unpaid, compulsory but not sanctioned if young people don’t want to do it, or an alternative of compulsory volunteering, not sanctioned if you d people don’t want to do it… they really havn’t thought about it past the first line. If young people want to volunteer to do good deeds for charities or whatever they can co that today, in fact some probably are right now - but this whole plan is bonkers. Just as well there is zero chance of it happening.

[EddieSteadyGo]

I don't think the motivate relates to picking off Reform voters. If they wanted to do that properly, they could have offered Tice a deal - something like a referendum on electoral reform in return for standing down their candidates in seats the Conservatives could win. I think that would have been attractive enough for Tice to accept, particular if they could help draft the question.

As to the actual reason behind this policy, looking around on Google, it seems there is a 'think tank' called Onward, which is very close to Sunak, who have been pushing the idea of a "modern" National Service for some time. I think they have been pitching the idea to Sunak and I would imagine, considering his position in the polls, he just decided to roll the dice.

[SWoll]

S600BSB said:

bhstewie said:

Risky though as I expect just as it may pull in some of the Reform vote it might also be enough of a nudge for some of the undecided voters who might have given them the benefit of the doubt.

More importantly, it will encourage younger voters to actually vote on the 4th July! Very silly policy.

It won't as doesn't affect them. Turnout in that demographic is unlikely to better the 50-60% seen previously, although more of that group may well vote Labour this time around.

[119]

Dingu said:

119 said:

Considering knife crime is at its highest in those age ranges it’s easy to see why they get the blame.

Because it can’t be the parenting right? Or the years of austerity your generation has imposed cutting away at everything? Take some responsibility.

My generation?

Which gerneation do you think I am?

[glazbagun]

p1stonhead said:

I’m 100% convinced that he’s trying to bury the Tory party for the next ten years.

Even calling the election was suicide, but talking of national service? They’re absolutely fked.

Sounds very conspiracy tin foil hat but this can’t be all a genuine attempt to win.

I can only assume there's either an(other) iceberg coming and they're jumping ship, or he has a job lined up and wants to leave ASAP.

There is the possibility that this just *is* the Tory party now and is exactly what they want..


They voted for Boris who had a cull and then they voted for Liz Truss who... I mean they voted Liz Truss to be PM, FFS!. It may be that Cameron's winning formula would be rejected by the party now as having too few bigoted or total fantasy elements

[768]

I think "national service" which isn't the same as the one of old might not be the worst idea depending on how it's implemented. A weekend a month, doing some good, getting some skills and experience. No criminal sanctions if you really don't want to do it.

A better notion than VAT on private school fees, but probably about as likely to happen.

[johnboy1975]

p1stonhead said:

I’m 100% convinced that he’s trying to bury the Tory party for the next ten years.

Even calling the election was suicide, but talking of national service? They’re absolutely fked.

Sounds very conspiracy tin foil hat but this can’t be all a genuine attempt to win.

Probably the least worst option. Things aren't going to get better:

4 July gives him the ability to say "We would have got on top of illegal immigrants and were just about to send some people to Rwanda" - much better than the boats continuing all summer (proving the lack of deterrent) and no flights taking off (proving the utter stupidity of the policy in the first place)

Inflation is at 2.3%

Doesn't want a war on his watch (although normally you get "what we need is a good war to unite the proles"). Suspect Ukraine and the Middle East are unwinnable in terms of public opinion though. Conscription has been talked about prior to the bat st policy announced yesterday, both deeply unpopular

Incoming st show on government finances. Let labour deal with it.

Caught Reform out so possibly won't be able to stand some candidates (although Tories still looking for nearly 200 candidates so that cuts both ways I guess)

Plus...California in July is lovely (I've heard)

[p1stonhead]

Dingu said:

James (not so) Cleverly, a Tory MP talking about getting people out of their bubble is one of the stupidest, funniest, least self aware things I’ve ever heard.

Maybe all Tory MPs and members need to give it a go first, get with the real world a bit.

The arrogance of this lot of scum that currently form the cabinet is off the scale.

[Derek Smith]

Derek Smith said:

Middle 70s here. When my wife told me I thought it one of her little jokes. Knowing how stupid this lot was, I checked online. Still had trouble believing it. She's recorded KKwatang on a news programme for me. I think I'll enjoy his justification more than the Monaco GP.

Bizarre.

Just seen the recording.

Bizarre just doesn't cover it. Scary though. Walking amongst us is bad enough, but he was in the cabinet.

Well worth digging out the farce if you can. And if you don't want to sleep at night.

[p1stonhead]

Even if (when) they lose this election, everyone will know national service is on their game plan for the future. Hopefully it’ll put them out of power for a generation or more.

They’re completely mad. Akin to the MAGA lot this week it seems.

[rscott]

768 said:

I think "national service" which isn't the same as the one of old might not be the worst idea depending on how it's implemented. A weekend a month, doing some good, getting some skills and experience. No criminal sanctions if you really don't want to do it.

A better notion than VAT on private school fees, but probably about as likely to happen.

The "plan" appears to be that they think around 35,000 will opt for a year in the army (paid) and it'll be so great that many will join up afterwards.

The rest will have to volunteer one weekend a month, completely unpaid and will disrupt any part time jobs any of them might have. Less of an issue if they work in a large store with plenty of staff, but a lot I know work in smaller independent shops and cafes, who need someone available every weekend.

Any weekend volunteers from our village have minimal local opportunities too, so would need to either have cars, rely on parents for lifts or the 1 bus per hour to get to wherever they'd sent. Not a good way to encourage youth integration and involvement.

[sugerbear]

So vote tory and prevent VAT on schools fees but at the same time the kids get to spend a year doing national service.

Brilliant.

[Sway]

rscott said:

768 said:

I think "national service" which isn't the same as the one of old might not be the worst idea depending on how it's implemented. A weekend a month, doing some good, getting some skills and experience. No criminal sanctions if you really don't want to do it.

A better notion than VAT on private school fees, but probably about as likely to happen.

The "plan" appears to be that they think around 35,000 will opt for a year in the army (paid) and it'll be so great that many will join up afterwards.

The rest will have to volunteer one weekend a month, completely unpaid and will disrupt any part time jobs any of them might have. Less of an issue if they work in a large store with plenty of staff, but a lot I know work in smaller independent shops and cafes, who need someone available every weekend.

Any weekend volunteers from our village have minimal local opportunities too, so would need to either have cars, rely on parents for lifts or the 1 bus per hour to get to wherever they'd sent. Not a good way to encourage youth integration and involvement.

It's a daft idea, but my 17yo lad would actually probably quite like a year in the Army, mainly as he's really gotten into sport and the PT element would really appeal along with the team working aspects. It'd save us a st load in food bill too!

So I guess it'd be quite cool if there were an option like that available, but not via the sort of policy being presented.

[119]

Sway said:

rscott said:

768 said:

I think "national service" which isn't the same as the one of old might not be the worst idea depending on how it's implemented. A weekend a month, doing some good, getting some skills and experience. No criminal sanctions if you really don't want to do it.

A better notion than VAT on private school fees, but probably about as likely to happen.

The "plan" appears to be that they think around 35,000 will opt for a year in the army (paid) and it'll be so great that many will join up afterwards.

The rest will have to volunteer one weekend a month, completely unpaid and will disrupt any part time jobs any of them might have. Less of an issue if they work in a large store with plenty of staff, but a lot I know work in smaller independent shops and cafes, who need someone available every weekend.

Any weekend volunteers from our village have minimal local opportunities too, so would need to either have cars, rely on parents for lifts or the 1 bus per hour to get to wherever they'd sent. Not a good way to encourage youth integration and involvement.

It's a daft idea, but my 17yo lad would actually probably quite like a year in the Army, mainly as he's really gotten into sport and the PT element would really appeal along with the team working aspects. It'd save us a st load in food bill too!

So I guess it'd be quite cool if there were an option like that available, but not via the sort of policy being presented.

Thats the thing though, there hasn't been a policy presented, just a sound bite.

[bitchstewie]

sugerbear said:

So vote tory and prevent VAT on schools fees but at the same time the kids get to spend a year doing national service.

Brilliant.

Priorities dear boy priorities.

[rscott]

Sway said:

rscott said:

768 said:

I think "national service" which isn't the same as the one of old might not be the worst idea depending on how it's implemented. A weekend a month, doing some good, getting some skills and experience. No criminal sanctions if you really don't want to do it.

A better notion than VAT on private school fees, but probably about as likely to happen.

The "plan" appears to be that they think around 35,000 will opt for a year in the army (paid) and it'll be so great that many will join up afterwards.

The rest will have to volunteer one weekend a month, completely unpaid and will disrupt any part time jobs any of them might have. Less of an issue if they work in a large store with plenty of staff, but a lot I know work in smaller independent shops and cafes, who need someone available every weekend.

Any weekend volunteers from our village have minimal local opportunities too, so would need to either have cars, rely on parents for lifts or the 1 bus per hour to get to wherever they'd sent. Not a good way to encourage youth integration and involvement.

It's a daft idea, but my 17yo lad would actually probably quite like a year in the Army, mainly as he's really gotten into sport and the PT element would really appeal along with the team working aspects. It'd save us a st load in food bill too!

So I guess it'd be quite cool if there were an option like that available, but not via the sort of policy being presented.

I can definitely see the benefit of offering a voluntary "Forces Apprenticeship" or similar, where people like your son could sign up for 1-2 years to get experience of life in the military, learn many useful skills, etc., while earning a reasonable wage. That could be a fixed term, with the option at the end to enter the services fully.
Anyone going through that should leave with a half decent set of skills which would improve their employability too.

[Digga]

p1stonhead said:

Dingu said:

James (not so) Cleverly, a Tory MP talking about getting people out of their bubble is one of the stupidest, funniest, least self aware things I’ve ever heard.

Maybe all Tory MPs and members need to give it a go first, get with the real world a bit.

The arrogance of this lot of scum that currently form the cabinet is off the scale.

Totally agree. They are elite, aloof and anti fragile. If they wanted to win huge numbers of votes, just talk to people - potholes and roads would be right up there - but instead, they jump the shark with ever more disconnected policy announcements.

[p1stonhead]

Digga said:

p1stonhead said:

Dingu said:

James (not so) Cleverly, a Tory MP talking about getting people out of their bubble is one of the stupidest, funniest, least self aware things I’ve ever heard.

Maybe all Tory MPs and members need to give it a go first, get with the real world a bit.

The arrogance of this lot of scum that currently form the cabinet is off the scale.

Totally agree. They are elite, aloof and anti fragile. If they wanted to win huge numbers of votes, just talk to people - potholes and roads would be right up there - but instead, they jump the shark with ever more disconnected policy announcements.

I’m quite amazed that they’ve gone full ‘fk the young’ rather than at least giving them a token ANYTHING to vote for.

Will anyone under 40 (either at conscription age, or kids at conscription age) now vote Tory?

Only the most brain boiled lot surely. It pretty much guarantees a loss for them surely?

Have we fallen into a parallel universe?

[anonymoususer]

My westminster sources tell me that a new announcement to bring back pounds. shillings and pence is on the cards and could be announced as early as 3pm. This is dependent on other Tory MP's not getting wind of it first

[p1stonhead]

anonymoususer said:

My westminster sources tell me that a new announcement to bring back pounds. shillings and pence is on the cards and could be announced as early as 3pm. This is dependent on other Tory MP's not getting wind of it first

Literally impossible to tell if you’re joking.