CV19 - The Anti Vaxxers Are Back
Discussion
Taylor James said:
mcdjl said:
WinstonWolf said:
So you trust the British public to behave with consideration for your welfare at all times?
Good luck with that. I hate to break this to you, you'll either be disappointed or infected.
I'm also guessing you don't look when you cross the road as the driver is responsible for your welfare? Me, I look both ways...
I have slightly more faith in the british public than you, yet i still look both ways even a zebra crossings. Thats because despite the law saying that i as a pedestrian have right of way there are still selfish morons around.Good luck with that. I hate to break this to you, you'll either be disappointed or infected.
I'm also guessing you don't look when you cross the road as the driver is responsible for your welfare? Me, I look both ways...
As i said earlier, if people refuse the vaccine for covid, they should also sign a form saying they don't want treatment for it. After all the chances are so small....
There is evidence to suggest that the risk of severe COVID infection increases in proportion to the amount of virus inhaled. At the height of the pandemic you will have noticed a lot of doctors and nurses were dying. It was quickly established that the virus aerosolised when oxygen was being given to COVID patients meaning there was a much higher risk to those exposed of being more significantly infected. This is why ICU staff were wandering around in HAZMAT suits. I know healthcare professionals whose private view would basically be “why the f
k should I put my health at risk treating somebody who has chosen not to mitigate their own risk?”Naturally that kind of issue doesn’t arise when treating a drinker with a dodgy liver.
WinstonWolf said:
You could, of course, simply accept responsibility for your own welfare.
In society accepting responsibility for your own welfare frequently requires you to abdicate responsibility for your self, place that responsibility in the hands of experts and put your efforts in to doing something which benefits someone else.For example, subsistence farming (which I am sure you are not) requires essentially 100% of your time and energy. Or you can buy produce from someone who is an expert at it and makes money from it.
I am not a Dr, I am not a chemist or a pharmacist, I have no means to produce medicine etc
There is no practical way in modern society that 'accepting responsibility for your own welfare' means something other than relying on other people.
I am sure you think you sound clever, but you to me you sound like an 9 year old packing up their suitcase to leave home.
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
dmahon said:
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
.
This 'stuff' you are talking about when available will be well tested on tens of thousands of people. Examined every which way and when alls said and done it just a damn vaccine not some drug that may have long term detrimental effects. All a vaccine does is harness your body's natural defences..
dmahon said:
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
What does having a vaccine have to do with giving up rights, or blowing up the economy?I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
Do you feel this way about the flu vaccine?
You can disagree with the UKs approach to lock down etc (which I do) and still think the vaccine is a good idea.
s2art said:
This 'stuff' you are talking about when available will be well tested on tens of thousands of people. Examined every which way and when alls said and done it just a damn vaccine not some drug that may have long term detrimental effects. All a vaccine does is harness your body's natural defences.
Like the 1976 Swine Flu vaccine?Or the 2009 Swine Flu vaccine?
grumbledoak said:
s2art said:
This 'stuff' you are talking about when available will be well tested on tens of thousands of people. Examined every which way and when alls said and done it just a damn vaccine not some drug that may have long term detrimental effects. All a vaccine does is harness your body's natural defences.
Like the 1976 Swine Flu vaccine?Or the 2009 Swine Flu vaccine?
Things have moved on since 76, and the Oxford vaccine is using proven measures. The Yank RNA vaccine is novel, and I would avoid it until far more testing has been done, particularly as the Oxford jab will likely be available this year.
s2art said:
A 2009 article on the 1976 vaccine side effects, claiming it's all better now. The 2009 vaccine went on to cause narcolepsy.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/07/why-pandem...
Still, I'm sure it's all better now.
You first.
grumbledoak said:
s2art said:
A 2009 article on the 1976 vaccine side effects, claiming it's all better now. The 2009 vaccine went on to cause narcolepsy.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/07/why-pandem...
Still, I'm sure it's all better now.
You first.
RDMcG said:
Will get a vaccine once approved. Very little downside. Obviously there is a chance of a side effect in some few cases but the ability to return to a normal life is worth it.
The attitude of “I’m young, I’m ok” seems to mean “I’ll survive but no worries if my parents or other vulnerable people catch it from me “
Surely it means "let the old people have the vaccine, I'll just catch the virus"like we currently do every flu season.The attitude of “I’m young, I’m ok” seems to mean “I’ll survive but no worries if my parents or other vulnerable people catch it from me “
gregs656 said:
dmahon said:
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
What does having a vaccine have to do with giving up rights, or blowing up the economy?I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
Do you feel this way about the flu vaccine?
You can disagree with the UKs approach to lock down etc (which I do) and still think the vaccine is a good idea.
I personally couldn’t care less about the statistically insignificant risk that COVID will harm me, so every restriction I have placed upon me or choose to take is purely to benefit someone else.
My point is that even though I feel I am a decent and community minded person, that really has to have a limit and at some point other people need to take responsibility for their own health by shielding or vaccinating themselves and leaving others to make their own free choices.
Edited by dmahon on Tuesday 7th July 18:48
s2art said:
grumbledoak said:
s2art said:
A 2009 article on the 1976 vaccine side effects, claiming it's all better now. The 2009 vaccine went on to cause narcolepsy.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/07/why-pandem...
Still, I'm sure it's all better now.
You first.
What was the the complication rate on the 2009 one. One in 16,000 affected? MUCH higher than my chance of dying from CV19.
And we are giving the companies driving this immunity from prosecution...............
BevR said:
WinstonWolf said:
I trusted my surgeon as that's what he does. I wouldn't trust you to do the same thing.
If you put your trust in me you're an idiot. Look after yourself, take some responsibility, I'm not your mum.
Why do you trust a surgeon trained to perform surgery but not a scientist trained to research and design vaccines? If you put your trust in me you're an idiot. Look after yourself, take some responsibility, I'm not your mum.
gregs656 said:
WinstonWolf said:
You could, of course, simply accept responsibility for your own welfare.
In society accepting responsibility for your own welfare frequently requires you to abdicate responsibility for your self, place that responsibility in the hands of experts and put your efforts in to doing something which benefits someone else.For example, subsistence farming (which I am sure you are not) requires essentially 100% of your time and energy. Or you can buy produce from someone who is an expert at it and makes money from it.
I am not a Dr, I am not a chemist or a pharmacist, I have no means to produce medicine etc
There is no practical way in modern society that 'accepting responsibility for your own welfare' means something other than relying on other people.
I am sure you think you sound clever, but you to me you sound like an 9 year old packing up their suitcase to leave home.
If not why not seeing as there were 50k excess deaths two years ago.
dmahon said:
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
The vast majority of people haven't caught it due to the measures being taken by those community minded people.I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
Do you feel the same about all vaccines and medicines? Is it the injection that makes you fear it or the social media disinformation campaign you've been subjected to?
mx5nut said:
dmahon said:
I must say there are some very community minded people who are willing to give up all their rights, blow up the economy and be injected with stuff just to protect the vulnerable.
I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
The vast majority of people haven't caught it due to the measures being taken by those community minded people.I like to think I’m a decent guy, but at some point you have to draw a line and think that people have to look out for themselves. Yes we can help people but it’s a big ask to do all of this purely for the benefit of a common good. That’s really the situation we are facing as the vast majority of people are not at significant risk from COVID.
Do you feel the same about all vaccines and medicines? Is it the injection that makes you fear it or the social media disinformation campaign you've been subjected to?
DeWar said:
Taylor James said:
mcdjl said:
WinstonWolf said:
So you trust the British public to behave with consideration for your welfare at all times?
Good luck with that. I hate to break this to you, you'll either be disappointed or infected.
I'm also guessing you don't look when you cross the road as the driver is responsible for your welfare? Me, I look both ways...
I have slightly more faith in the british public than you, yet i still look both ways even a zebra crossings. Thats because despite the law saying that i as a pedestrian have right of way there are still selfish morons around.Good luck with that. I hate to break this to you, you'll either be disappointed or infected.
I'm also guessing you don't look when you cross the road as the driver is responsible for your welfare? Me, I look both ways...
As i said earlier, if people refuse the vaccine for covid, they should also sign a form saying they don't want treatment for it. After all the chances are so small....
There is evidence to suggest that the risk of severe COVID infection increases in proportion to the amount of virus inhaled. At the height of the pandemic you will have noticed a lot of doctors and nurses were dying. It was quickly established that the virus aerosolised when oxygen was being given to COVID patients meaning there was a much higher risk to those exposed of being more significantly infected. This is why ICU staff were wandering around in HAZMAT suits. I know healthcare professionals whose private view would basically be “why the f
k should I put my health at risk treating somebody who has chosen not to mitigate their own risk?”Naturally that kind of issue doesn’t arise when treating a drinker with a dodgy liver.
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