How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 5)
Discussion
Nickgnome said:
alfie2244 said:
Probably my failing but I don't really understand most of your post sorry.
However the bit I do understand seems to be inferring that it was me that stated " Ireland is a knowledge economy, focused on services into high-tech, life sciences and financial services industries" hence the apparent mutual exclusivity.... for the avoidance of doubt it wasn't me.
So it wasn't your post at 1606?However the bit I do understand seems to be inferring that it was me that stated " Ireland is a knowledge economy, focused on services into high-tech, life sciences and financial services industries" hence the apparent mutual exclusivity.... for the avoidance of doubt it wasn't me.
soupdragon1 said:
The economy of Ireland is a knowledge economy, focused on services into high-tech, life sciences and financial services industries.
soupdragon1 said:
The feet are under the table. Hardly going to up sticks and move to Germany for example, because if rates are harmonised, what's the benefit?
There are lots of good reasons to go to Germany. They were trumped by Ireland because Ireland is cheap.If Ireland is no longer cheap, then maybe the good reasons to go to Germany become compelling.
(Or maybe, if the UK becomes cheap, they come here...?)
crankedup said:
The anti brexit doom and gloom mongers are lashing it on really thick now we only have a few weeks left. It’s what they need to do in the vain hope of derailing the adventure back to an independent U.K.
Correct. They're following a policy of the more times you repeat the words 'people's vote' the more the general public will incorrectly believe that that is what everyone wants.Might try it myself - people's vote, people's vote, people's vote.....
.......no. Nothing.
psi310398 said:
Nickgnome said:
You have missed quite a few out of the development chain even at just the client end.
Although not directly comparable there are similarities of the structure and procedure.
The DIT was set up to deal with trade going forward after the referendum vote. It's currently standing at about 3,700 or so persons. I have a feeling I read that 1,500 were overseas researching markets so in part directly due to the Brexit decision as this would have been a joint venture with the EU before.
I assume also that every part of the economy that will be covered by any future trade agreement will need to be researched and the stakeholders' opinions ascertained. Their needs will vary depending on where they trade. This simply isn't going to happen with 25 odd people and may explain in part why there are 3,700 in the DIT.
As you have worked in or for the government I'm sure you will understand why I am skeptical that the number will go reduce.
I don't dispute the complexities of running a large programme but people do over-complicate things. And DIT was set up in a rush and, dare I say it, a panic. I have no idea what 3,700 people could spend all day doing at the moment even if 1500 are just researching. Although not directly comparable there are similarities of the structure and procedure.
The DIT was set up to deal with trade going forward after the referendum vote. It's currently standing at about 3,700 or so persons. I have a feeling I read that 1,500 were overseas researching markets so in part directly due to the Brexit decision as this would have been a joint venture with the EU before.
I assume also that every part of the economy that will be covered by any future trade agreement will need to be researched and the stakeholders' opinions ascertained. Their needs will vary depending on where they trade. This simply isn't going to happen with 25 odd people and may explain in part why there are 3,700 in the DIT.
As you have worked in or for the government I'm sure you will understand why I am skeptical that the number will go reduce.
Going for the perfect deal with every partner from the start would be foolish and self-defeating.
I think I'd go for as much off the shelf replication of our current stuff as possible (i.e. the status quo so far as is necessary) with only absolutely essential additional new clauses and insert instead a few clauses/timetable in each to negotiate an agreed programme of targeted sector by sector revisions the better to suit both parties over a given timeframe.
The EU agreements will have been a bugger's muddle of compromise on both sides and if we lifted and shifted the text, our counterparts would want the opportunity to re-open certain provisions as would we, but there's nothing that says it needs to be ab initio. And if, per the example given yesterday, we get the right to export maple syrup tariff free and we don't have any to export, it's hardly the end of the world.
Currently, there are that many bodies doing whatever it is they have been directed to do so I do not see any major trade agreements being made in under 4 years. It is my opinion but I'm a pretty good guesser. This does, of course, exclude the flip over agreements from the EU until one or two of our more opinionated MPs stick their oars in.
Cobnapint said:
crankedup said:
The anti brexit doom and gloom mongers are lashing it on really thick now we only have a few weeks left. It’s what they need to do in the vain hope of derailing the adventure back to an independent U.K.
Correct. They're following a policy of the more times you repeat the words 'people's vote' the more the general public will incorrectly believe that that is what everyone wants.Might try it myself - people's vote, people's vote, people's vote.....
.......no. Nothing.
Nickgnome said:
Cobnapint said:
crankedup said:
The anti brexit doom and gloom mongers are lashing it on really thick now we only have a few weeks left. It’s what they need to do in the vain hope of derailing the adventure back to an independent U.K.
Correct. They're following a policy of the more times you repeat the words 'people's vote' the more the general public will incorrectly believe that that is what everyone wants.Might try it myself - people's vote, people's vote, people's vote.....
.......no. Nothing.
alfie2244 said:
don'tbesilly said:
Whoops, Nickgnome has just flashed the petticoat, and shown the true colour/s.
He must have been joking 
don'tbesilly said:
alfie2244 said:
don'tbesilly said:
Whoops, Nickgnome has just flashed the petticoat, and shown the true colour/s.
He must have been joking I was brought up to believe we are a parliamentary democracy, not a Plebiscite.
Nickgnome said:
Either fortunately or unfortunately depending on one's viewpoint neither you nor I are involvedin the process to give our invaluable advice.
Currently, there are that many bodies doing whatever it is they have been directed to do so I do not see any major trade agreements being made in under 4 years. It is my opinion but I'm a pretty good guesser. This does, of course, exclude the flip over agreements from the EU until one or two of our more opinionated MPs stick their oars in.
Maybe, but the totality of the flip over agreements plus the agreements that have already been indicated as agreed are more than enough to keep the UK ticking over. Currently, there are that many bodies doing whatever it is they have been directed to do so I do not see any major trade agreements being made in under 4 years. It is my opinion but I'm a pretty good guesser. This does, of course, exclude the flip over agreements from the EU until one or two of our more opinionated MPs stick their oars in.
As I suggest, adding a couple of timetabling and priorities clauses in the flip overs then sets out a defined path for moving forward from well-understood ground.
There really is no need to start from scratch, except in those many areas where the EU has failed to get its s
t in one sock and has failed to agree one. But then, we’re on partial terms (flip over) or WTO there anyway.soupdragon1 said:
Ireland will remain in the EU so I don't think the food supply will be as big an issue for Ireland as it would be for the UK.
And the Irish Economy isn't as reliant on the UK to anywhere near the extent that the public seem to imagine.
Quote:
The economy of Ireland is a knowledge economy, focused on services into high-tech, life sciences and financial services industries.
In the global GDP per capita tables, Ireland ranks 5th of 187 in the IMF table and 6th of 175 in the World Bank ranking.
Note that the Irish GDP data below is subject to material distortion by the tax planning activities of foreign multinationals in Ireland.And the Irish Economy isn't as reliant on the UK to anywhere near the extent that the public seem to imagine.
Quote:
The economy of Ireland is a knowledge economy, focused on services into high-tech, life sciences and financial services industries.
In the global GDP per capita tables, Ireland ranks 5th of 187 in the IMF table and 6th of 175 in the World Bank ranking.
gooner1 said:
Nickgnome said:
I did and I would. That is not the same as saying I want another vote.
I was brought up to believe we are a parliamentary democracy, not a Plebiscite.
We are, did not Parlament grant the referendum. Was the referendum result not democraticI was brought up to believe we are a parliamentary democracy, not a Plebiscite.
enough for your liking, Sir
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
don'tbesilly said:
Nickgnome said:
Cobnapint said:
crankedup said:
The anti brexit doom and gloom mongers are lashing it on really thick now we only have a few weeks left. It’s what they need to do in the vain hope of derailing the adventure back to an independent U.K.
Correct. They're following a policy of the more times you repeat the words 'people's vote' the more the general public will incorrectly believe that that is what everyone wants.Might try it myself - people's vote, people's vote, people's vote.....
.......no. Nothing.
I think you got that a bit wrong but I’ll let you off.
BTW. I’m a Lumberjack.
Nickgnome said:
Yes they did.
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
No need, just a common expression us plebs use.It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
And your answer re was the ensuing result not democratic?
Don't you consider it healthy for the aristocracy to get a kick up the arris occasionaly?
Nickgnome said:
gooner1 said:
Nickgnome said:
I did and I would. That is not the same as saying I want another vote.
I was brought up to believe we are a parliamentary democracy, not a Plebiscite.
We are, did not Parlament grant the referendum. Was the referendum result not democraticI was brought up to believe we are a parliamentary democracy, not a Plebiscite.
enough for your liking, Sir
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
Nickgnome said:
don'tbesilly said:
Nickgnome said:
Cobnapint said:
crankedup said:
The anti brexit doom and gloom mongers are lashing it on really thick now we only have a few weeks left. It’s what they need to do in the vain hope of derailing the adventure back to an independent U.K.
Correct. They're following a policy of the more times you repeat the words 'people's vote' the more the general public will incorrectly believe that that is what everyone wants.Might try it myself - people's vote, people's vote, people's vote.....
.......no. Nothing.
I think you got that a bit wrong but I’ll let you off.
BTW. I’m a Lumberjack.
I don't need the let off, thanks all the same
gooner1 said:
Nickgnome said:
Yes they did.
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
No need, just a common expression us plebs use.It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
And your answer re was the ensuing result not democratic?
Don't you consider it healthy for the aristocracy to get a kick up the arris occasionaly?
I’m retired and it will have no neagative impact, in fact up till now slightlly positive. It may inconvenience me in a minor way.
It has however made a negative impact on some of my now ex staff and my ex business. Needless to say my old company has moved some resource into the EU to protect the business.
Nickgnome said:
gooner1 said:
Nickgnome said:
Yes they did.
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
No need, just a common expression us plebs use.It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
And your answer re was the ensuing result not democratic?
Don't you consider it healthy for the aristocracy to get a kick up the arris occasionaly?
I’m retired and it will have no neagative impact, in fact up till now slightlly positive. It may inconvenience me in a minor way.
It has however made a negative impact on some of my now ex staff and my ex business. Needless to say my old company has moved some resource into the EU to protect the business.
You mentioned the slightlly (sic) positives, care to share?
Nickgnome said:
gooner1 said:
Nickgnome said:
Yes they did.
It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
No need, just a common expression us plebs use.It was a blatant abdication of responsibility of our elected representatives.
I am not a Sir. What was your need for the fatuous jibe?
And your answer re was the ensuing result not democratic?
Don't you consider it healthy for the aristocracy to get a kick up the arris occasionaly?
I’m retired and it will have no neagative impact, in fact up till now slightlly positive. It may inconvenience me in a minor way.
It has however made a negative impact on some of my now ex staff and my ex business. Needless to say my old company has moved some resource into the EU to protect the business.
To sum up, your objection to the referendum result is purely altruistic , ok.
Strange how you can define who the plebs are but not their opposites , yet go on to ask if they
will be impacted in the slightest.
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